Leaf regen vs Prius regen

[tps]

In my New York drive with the Hertz rental LEAF, I found the regen to be quite good for most all of my braking needs. Like the precise acceleration, the regenerative braking seemed far more precise than normal friction braking. Except at the beginning of the drive, when the battery was full, I found the regenration to be strong enough to handle just about all of my braking. (But my driving style seems to be gentler than the norm, which I think the LEAF will like when I get mine.)

 

[IBELEAF]

Something I noticed while driving on ECO mode while going down the hill (about 30% grade) and let regen do the braking for you, it will be using 3 regen circles, if you press break and release it will stick to 4 regen circles. It's reproducible every time. Anyone else noticed that?

 

[wsbca]

Something I noticed while driving on ECO mode while going down the hill (about 30% grade) and let regen do the braking for you, it will be using 3 regen circles, if you press break and release it will stick to 4 regen circles. It's reproducible every time. Anyone else noticed that?

30% is an extremely steep hill (eg. there are only 4 roads in San Francisco over 30%). Assuming our SOC is not too high, I'm pretty sure we get 4 circles simply by letting up on the accelerator on our 10% downhill, but I'll double check to see whether one needs to 'trigger' that by touching the brake.

 

[IBELEAF]

30% is an extremely steep hill (eg. there are only 4 roads in San Francisco over 30%). Assuming our SOC is not too high, I'm pretty sure we get 4 circles simply by letting up on the accelerator on our 10% downhill, but I'll double check to see whether one needs to 'trigger' that by touching the brake.

Hm, maybe I' am exaggerating on the steepness %, could be 20% but it's definitely not extreme and just letting up accelerator results in 3 circles. Actually, you don't even need to be on the hill, I am reproducing this even when taking an exit on the freeway and simply breaking once and the regen sticking to 4 circles afterwards vs 3 circles if I let it coast. I'll see if non ECO mode has the same behavior.

 

[abasile]

In ECO mode when you let off on the accelerator, it seems that the amount of regen is correlated to one's speed. In other words, the car applies more regen resistance at higher speeds. That is necessary to keep the feeling of "engine braking" relatively constant, as an ICE will offer more resistance as it is spun at higher speeds. BTW, I really prefer ECO mode at all times because of the finer power control and the ability to do mostly single-pedal driving. I also like to display the Energy Info screen continuously, as I prefer more granularity than the "bubbles" offer, and I like knowing when I am truly "gliding".

As LEAF regen maxes out at 30 kW compared to ~ 20 kW in the third-generation Prius, I find that with the LEAF it is significantly easier to avoid friction braking when driving around in the mountains where we live. (Of course, it also helps that the LEAF has a far larger battery pack!)

 

[juanmax]

Hello community,

I am new here but have several years in Automotive development and hybrid-E/Cars. I am waiting for my Leaf to arrive too

Just wanted to say that the amount of regen (not sure about what Nissan makes) is normally vehicle speed dependent just because of the power relation to speed. (power = torque x speed)

If the electromotor produces,lets say ,a regen torque of "-50 Nm" constantly when we lift the "gas" pedal off, then the power of our regen will vary with the speed of the vehicle. Since I "suspect" that the rings in the Leaf display are related to power, this explains why in Eco mode, at different speeds you see diferent "regens". Howere, driving is a nice sensation to have a constant regen torque, since what you feel is acceleration, and acceleration is directly proportional to torque.

This is another nice thing about E-Car, the ability to produce a "simulated drag" which is constant! Unlike an ICE which will be near zero at 1000rpm...

Sorry for my english.

Cheers.

 

[EVDRIVER]

Hello community,

I am new here but have several years in Automotive development and hybrid-E/Cars. I am waiting for my Leaf to arrive too

Just wanted to say that the amount of regen (not sure about what Nissan makes) is normally vehicle speed dependent just because of the power relation to speed. (power = torque x speed)

If the electromotor produces,lets say ,a regen torque of "-50 Nm" constantly when we lift the "gas" pedal off, then the power of our regen will vary with the speed of the vehicle. Since I "suspect" that the rings in the Leaf display are related to power, this explains why in Eco mode, at different speeds you see diferent "regens". Howere, driving is a nice sensation to have a constant regen torque, since what you feel is acceleration, and acceleration is directly proportional to torque.

This is another nice thing about E-Car, the ability to produce a "simulated drag" which is constant! Unlike an ICE which will be near zero at 1000rpm...

Sorry for my english.

Cheers.

Yes, I was about to note that. You will also find the regen on the LEAF cuts out quickly in many cases and much power is wasted to the friction brakes.

 

[Mx5racer]

I feel just the opposite and wish that the Eco on my 2012 Priuswould slow it down by lifting off the gas like it does in the Leaf. With the Prius I have to move my foot to the brake pedal much more than in the Leaf.

I do wish that I could have the regen on the Leaf without the acceleration limitations.

 

[planet4ever]

I feel just the opposite and wish that the Eco on my 2012 Prius would slow it down by lifting off the gas like it does in the Leaf. With the Prius I have to move my foot to the brake pedal much more than in the Leaf.

I don't know about the 2012, but my seat-of-the-pants feel, as well as my downhill experience, tells me our 2007 Prius has more regen in "B" than the LEAF in "ECO". Well, at least until the Prius battery is full going downhill. After that you have no regen and a screaming engine.

I do wish that I could have the regen on the Leaf without the acceleration limitations.

Total nonsense. Push the accelerator to the floor and the LEAF jumps just as fast in "ECO" as it does in "D". There is no "limitation", only a different mapping for a partially depressed pedal.

Ray

 

[Mx5racer]

2007 Prius has more regen in "B" than the LEAF in "ECO".

I read on the Prius forum that B mode for the 2012 creates less regen and uses more engine braking?

There is no "limitation", only a different mapping for a partially depressed pedal.

I know
but
I like the pedal feel better in Drive Mode.

 

[jkirkebo]

Sorry guys. I still don't get it.

Leaf does have variable regen. You regen more by pressing the brake harder. What we don't have is the ability to change the amount of regen for a particular amount of brake press.

So, is the ask that Leaf should regen more for a given amount of brake press ?

Personally, I do not want an regen on the brake pedal at all, while in ECO mode. I'd be very much happier if I could get full regen on accelerator pedal lift.

This is how Tesla does it. I look forward to my Model S being delivered next summer

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Sorry guys. I still don't get it.

Leaf does have variable regen. You regen more by pressing the brake harder. What we don't have is the ability to change the amount of regen for a particular amount of brake press.

So, is the ask that Leaf should regen more for a given amount of brake press ?

Personally, I do not want an regen on the brake pedal at all, while in ECO mode. I'd be very much happier if I could get full regen on accelerator pedal lift.

This is how Tesla does it. I look forward to my Model S being delivered next summer

so would i, but that would be "too much unlike" a gas car.

what i really want to know is who thought we wanted our LEAF to be anything like our gas cars?

 

[dhanson865]

Sorry guys. I still don't get it.

Leaf does have variable regen. You regen more by pressing the brake harder. What we don't have is the ability to change the amount of regen for a particular amount of brake press.

So, is the ask that Leaf should regen more for a given amount of brake press ?

Personally, I do not want an regen on the brake pedal at all, while in ECO mode. I'd be very much happier if I could get full regen on accelerator pedal lift.

This is how Tesla does it. I look forward to my Model S being delivered next summer

I'd like to be able to choose how "wide" the glide band is on the accelerator pedal and how strong the regen is at foot off pedal.

There are times on flat ground or a slight down slope I want to glide as much as possible and it bugs me how touchy I have to feather the pedal.

There are times when I want more regen than foot off pedal currently gives.

I don't want more regen through the entire pedal travel, I just want more regen at the very end of travel and a wider dead spot between regen and applying power to the wheels.

 

[EVDRIVER]

Sorry guys. I still don't get it.

Leaf does have variable regen. You regen more by pressing the brake harder. What we don't have is the ability to change the amount of regen for a particular amount of brake press.

So, is the ask that Leaf should regen more for a given amount of brake press ?

Personally, I do not want an regen on the brake pedal at all, while in ECO mode. I'd be very much happier if I could get full regen on accelerator pedal lift.

This is how Tesla does it. I look forward to my Model S being delivered next summer

so would i, but that would be "too much unlike" a gas car.

what i really want to know is who thought we wanted our LEAF to be anything like our gas cars?

NIssan, they admitted they went to great lengths to make it seem just like an ICE, so much so they took away some of the coolness of an EV. As a result quite a bit of regen is wasted to friction brakes which is very sad for an EV, if you drive in a hilly area or stop faster than a turtle or even like more spirited driving then significant regen is lost, this is a fact and a very sad one. In addition having the ability to have more off pedal regen can be a very cool driving experience. Another thing they went overboard on was the old fart 1970's EPS that feels like steering with a rubber band. Nissan has publicly admitted they did this intentionally and like so many other things they ignored from long time ev drivers they dumbed the car down to much. I'm sure it is perfect for the Japanese market and 1980 Cadillac drivers but sad for anyone that has driven a modern car with even decent steering.

 

[TomT]

Nissan.

I, too, wish there was much more regen available from just the accelerator.

what i really want to know is who thought we wanted our LEAF to be anything like our gas cars?

 

[davewill]

Guess I'm in the minority. I'd rather the accelerator had NO regen unless I put it in a "hill" mode. anything else is just trying to be a fake ICE to me. I like to glide and hate having to feather the "go" pedal to achieve it. If I want to slow down, I'll push the brake.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Guess I'm in the minority. I'd rather the accelerator had NO regen unless I put it in a "hill" mode. anything else is just trying to be a fake ICE to me. I like to glide and hate having to feather the "go" pedal to achieve it. If I want to slow down, I'll push the brake.

that would require too much button pushing. what is wrong with having all of it on a single pedal? as it stands now, i am constantly shifting from eco to neutral to drive to eco, etc. its a pain but i can verify that it does improve my performance.

problem is that is takes a lot of concentration and planning which is ok to a degree because that is the nature of hypermiling but I could do it in the Prius on just the accelerator for the most part because the benefits of shifting to neutral were not that great. in the LEAF however, the difference can be huge if done correctly

 

[davewill]

...that would require too much button pushing. what is wrong with having all of it on a single pedal? as it stands now, i am constantly shifting from eco to neutral to drive to eco, etc. its a pain but i can verify that it does improve my performance. ...

Huh? Why would you shift to neutral if you want "it all on one pedal"? Just stay in ECO, feather the pedal, and be done with it.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

...that would require too much button pushing. what is wrong with having all of it on a single pedal? as it stands now, i am constantly shifting from eco to neutral to drive to eco, etc. its a pain but i can verify that it does improve my performance. ...

Huh? Why would you shift to neutral if you want "it all on one pedal"? Just stay in ECO, feather the pedal, and be done with it.

well mostly because unless you are 95+% SOC, "deadbanding" (driving when power meter says the motor is neither generating or consuming power) still has a significant drag on the vehicle. i can coast much farther and maintain my speed much better in neutral and no amount of pedal play will match that performance.

ask anyone who gets 7 miles/K they will tell ya how it works

 

[davewill]

well mostly because unless you are 95+% SOC, "deadbanding" (driving when power meter says the motor is neither generating or consuming power) still has a significant drag on the vehicle. i can coast much farther and maintain my speed much better in neutral and no amount of pedal play will match that performance.

ask anyone who gets 7 miles/K they will tell ya how it works

Then why do you want it all on one pedal? That was MY argument. I want to just let off the "GO" pedal and coast. Then hit the brake if I want to regen and slow down.