Who Is The World's Leading EV Maker? [Forbes]

[SageBrush]

Accelerated battery aging has not affected me personally, but you have to live alone in a cave to not know about the widespread problem.

Okay, I'll bite. If this does not affect you personally, why are you on this endless crusade? Can't we just stick to the actual facts in our on-line posts?

I'm not on a crusade at all. I do recognize the pickle that Nissan is in and I am aware of their response. I most surely would not buy a new Nissan EV knowing what I know, and the attempt by this thread to portray Nissan as a leading light circa 2017 in the nascent EV movement is deluded fanboy-ism.

Why should I spend my time responding to a fan-boy ? Three reasons:
1. I think potential owners deserve a transparent understanding of Nissan's current battery tech and its limitations, and Nissan's support of the LEAF.
2. I'd like to see Nissan improve, if possible. Not only for the early adopters they have abandoned but for current and future owners.
3. I dislike spin

 

[jlv]

If only Nissan had ramped up on EVs like Toyota ramped up on hybrids. They'd have introduced EV versions across their model line.

370z-EV

 

[GetOffYourGas]

370z-EV

https://www.nissanusa.com/future-and-concept-vehicles/esflow

Sadly, it exists only in concept. But boy would that be a great car!

 

[WetEV]

I think potential owners deserve a transparent understanding of Nissan's current battery tech and its limitations, and Nissan's support of the LEAF.

Then give an honest understanding of Nissan's current battery technology, its limitations and its advantages.

In cooler climates, battery life will be better without a TMS, and a TMS will only add cost, weight and remove reliability, energy efficiency. Why must I have more cost, less range and less battery life again?


Why would someone in Seattle want a TMS? Only if you do frequent long drives with multiple DCQC sessions, sure I get that. I mostly don't do that. But beyond that?

In order to effectively cool the battery in hotter places, insulation needs to be added to the battery case. This makes the battery pack average higher temperatures with a TMS than a passively cooled battery like the Leaf until the TMS starts actively cooling. Higher temperatures mean shorter battery lifetime for a TMS equipped car relative to the Leaf.

TMS costs money, energy, and adds mass.

I've got logs of battery temperature for my two Leafs going back years. My battery almost never goes over 30C, where many TMS designs start cooling. I don't see the slightest reason why I would like a TMS for a commuter car. Got one?


Tesla is a different case as they are aiming at performance. Higher power density, less stable batteries and wanting 0-60 in under 2.3 seconds... OK, I get that a TMS is a requirement for something like this.


Nissan's current battery technology isn't ideal for AZ. And there is a broad range between AZ and WA, ranging from "Please please no TMS" to "who cares coin flip" to "Yes yes please TMS". One size fits all doesn't.

 

[SageBrush]

Then give an honest understanding of Nissan's current battery technology, its limitations and its advantages.

Sure, have a go

In cooler climates, battery life will be better without a TMS

I call hogwash, but go ahead and show me data that the LEAF battery degrades slower in Seattle than e.g. a Tesla

In order to effectively cool the battery in hotter places, insulation needs to be added to the battery case.

Ridiculous. And you are the arbiter of an honest understanding ?!?

Nissan's current battery technology isn't ideal for AZ. And there is a broad range between AZ and WA, ranging from "Please please no TMS" to "who cares coin flip" to "Yes yes please TMS". One size fits all doesn't.

Here is the problem: Nissan's claims regarding expected battery aging fail waay too often outside of a Seattle type climate. This isn't a case of AZ ownership being iffy, it is a case of frequent -- I'll say anticipated -- degraded performance outside of Seattle.

 

[finman100]

TMS is ABSOLUTELY needed for long-distance, REAL fast charging. You know, something above 50 kW, ha.

To travel 250 or 300 miles in a Leaf is possible in one day, but you may not want the 120 F battery temps. Or, the longer trip times since 50 kW is not that fast. Been there, ACTUALLY done that. But the mainstream masses won't do that. Not even close.

Replacement of gas cars. That should be the end game. Nissan ain't there yet, 'cause, well, they make A LOT of money selling gas rigs. This is where a certain other EV maker is going for mainstream.

My Next EV HAS to be more capable...and I love my current Leaf. For what it does. And I expect many can use such a car. That is great! Some may have an issue with 'limitations', even if they are perceived limitations. Another fault in our human DNA...

The mainstream masses will not tolerate anything that they can't (theoretically) drive across many miles of roads.