2013 LEAF Specs, Pricing, Options Released In Japan

[hill]

Can we effectively fast charge inductively? I if so then let's just all kick back and wait for THAT protocol to be standarized

With present day technology though, isn't there between 10%-20% loss going inductive? With shoddy grid/infrastructure, and cars pulling 3kW+ or 6kW+ (or higher) that can really add up. As far as I've read, there aren't any quick fixes for the grid in the foreseeable future. Inductive transmitters / receivers are more costly too. Ok, all done being a wet blanket here. :?

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Can we effectively fast charge inductively? I if so then let's just all kick back and wait for THAT protocol to be standarized

With present day technology though, isn't there between 10%-20% loss going inductive? With shoddy grid/infrastructure, and cars pulling 3kW+ or 6kW+ (or higher) that can really add up. As far as I've read, there aren't any quick fixes for the grid in the foreseeable future. Inductive transmitters / receivers are more costly too. Ok, all done being a wet blanket here. :?

not you Gary!. its my fault. discussing why Nissan does not put in QCs at the dealer and I suggested that only LEAFs and MiEVs charge there (since they are the only ones that can) and Reg suggested that not good idea and i said "why pay for another technology that one does not provide?" and he said he didnt think any current technology would last long which is undoubtedly true since there is not one that truly fits our needs (30 minutes to charge is better than 3 hours but still not where I want to be!) but we have already waited nearly 2 years to get what we got and we have 20,000 on the road now that use chademo so what are we waiting for?

 

[LEAFfan]

I don't think so. As I've noted about FFE and S, the actual 5 cycle test is less demanding than the compulsory adjustment (15% reduction ?) that Leaf got in the first test.

Based on what I've read, I believe that it was 30%. I share your view that just switching from the old test protocol to the new one should yield slightly improved EPA range figure if an identical test car was used. Let's see what the 2013 Leaf will get. While I think that there will be a moderate improvement, I wouldn't expect a dramatic change. Definitely not anything over 90 miles, but my guess is as good as yours.

I will predict 83-84 EPA for 2013.

 

[fotajoye]

I predict 90 EPA on the new lighter model with the Hitachi LiFePo4 battery pack. http://evworld.com/news.cfm?newsid=28590" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

 

[NYLEAF]

I predict 90 EPA on the new lighter model with the Hitachi LiFePo4 battery pack. http://evworld.com/news.cfm?newsid=28590" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

I believe that article was debunked as incorrect, due to inaccurate translations. If you follow the link to the Japanese newspaper (article is in English), http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/dy/business/T120827003564.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; you will see that the batteries are actually for Altima and Pathfinder, not Leaf.

 

[fotajoye]

Thanks for the information... since it's a guess at this point, I say 90 on the EPA...with no qualifier.

 

[evnow]

I predict 90 EPA on the new lighter model with the Hitachi LiFePo4 battery pack. http://evworld.com/news.cfm?newsid=28590" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

Even if the story was correct, LiFePO4 battery won't have a higher density. It is just better in the way it handles heat.

 

[fotajoye]

I'm not a chemist but from what I read, doping, coating, and re-structuring the anode/cathode can very decidedly change the capabilities of the LiFePo4 battery. For example: A123's nano structured battery provides for a long cycle life, a wide temperature operating range and up to a 23C discharge rate-- a more powerful, longer life, temperature stable battery. Perhaps even an improvement in the density is possible using these processes. The door is wide open for further large format battery development and the company that can scale up production of a more electron dense battery than the current offerings, will lead the parade to the bank.

So, the question is; will Nissan change their Leaf battery? I certainly hope so because their current battery has issues, i.e., temperature and density, fer sure. Yes, they can solve the temperature problem with liquid cooling and they can increase the car's range by "adding light weight," but in my mind the decision to continue without at least a reasonable improvement, about 15% or better, in battery density could be costly for Nissan in the near future.

When GM finally decides the Volt should be a BEV, it will certainly be a competing car for the Leaf. If you remove all the ICE stuff from the Volt, install an A123 battery package and the drive package from the Spark, with it's 400 foot pound motor, you would have a nice EV, especially if they cut costs and build a lesser trim model.

 

[TonyWilliams]

We are very pleased to report that Model S has exceeded our initial range expectations by about 20 miles and has achieved a Roadster equivalent 2-cycle range of 320 miles and a 5-cycle range of 265 miles. This sets a new record for electric vehicle range!

265 / 320 = 82.8%


http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/model-s-efficiency-and-range" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[Herm]

When GM finally decides the Volt should be a BEV, it will certainly be a competing car for the Leaf.

The Volt is a part time BEV, once the 40-50 miles are up then it switches mode and becomes a hybrid, until you recharge it. Some zealots find this lack of purity distasteful.

 

[TonyWilliams]

I predict 90 EPA on the new lighter model with the Hitachi LiFePo4 battery pack. http://evworld.com/news.cfm?newsid=28590" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

There is no new battery.

I guessed 79 miles earlier, but I'm going to lower that to 75 miles EPA.

 

[evnow]

We are very pleased to report that Model S has exceeded our initial range expectations by about 20 miles and has achieved a Roadster equivalent 2-cycle range of 320 miles and a 5-cycle range of 265 miles. This sets a new record for electric vehicle range!

265 / 320 = 82.8%


http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/model-s-efficiency-and-range" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Is that 320 after the adjustment or before ? I'd think before ...

 

[TonyWilliams]

We are very pleased to report that Model S has exceeded our initial range expectations by about 20 miles and has achieved a Roadster equivalent 2-cycle range of 320 miles and a 5-cycle range of 265 miles. This sets a new record for electric vehicle range!

265 / 320 = 82.8%


http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/model-s-efficiency-and-range" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Is that 320 after the adjustment or before ? I'd think before ...

old 2 cycle test = 320 miles

new 5 cycle test = 265 miles

 

[fotajoye]

@Herm:
The Volt might better be described as a plugin serial hybrid with an ICE extender. If you're calling me a purest, and a zealot, you would be very wrong, I have a '72 240Z track car with an '82 turbo engine that, I'm sad to say, sucks gasoline.

I would also like to say labeling people in a negative context does nothing to increase the knowledge level or impart information to the members of the forum; which is what forums should be about. It also can weaken any point you want to make by detracting from the subject matter and making it a personal confrontation.

 

[planet4ever]

Please, this is not the place to continue the eternal debate about what a Volt is. The subject is 2013 LEAF Specs.

We do have to keep reminding ourselves of what Tony just said:

There is no new battery for 2013.

2014 or 2015, maybe. Who knows.

Ray

 

[fotajoye]

OK,there is no new battery because someone said so. And, we are not to discuss the Volt.
How about reminding others this thread is about the "2013 Leaf." and not the range of a Tesla or the purchase of a Toyota EV.

 

[cwerdna]

OK,there is no new battery because someone said so. And, we are not to discuss the Volt.
How about reminding others this thread is about the "2013 Leaf." and not the range of a Tesla or the purchase of a Toyota EV.

There already are a couple threads for discussing the Volt. We can take that there.

BTW, I don't totally agree w/your definition about the Volt either given the design of its transaxle (two motor generators, planetary gearset, 3 clutches, ICE participating in driving the wheels in certain cases while in CS mode, etc.) Again, we should take that to a Volt thread.

 

[TonyWilliams]

OK,there is no new battery because someone said so.

The "somebody" is Nissan.

 

[RegGuheert]

There is no new battery for 2013.

From the standpoint of range, that appears to be true, but it also seems the 2013 battery is NOT the same as the 2011/2012 battery. At the module level, they should be the same, but at the battery level, apparently they are different. How? I have no idea.

Frankly, as an owner of a 2011 LEAF, I'm glad to hear they will be producing the modules for at least another year.

 

[mkjayakumar]

If you have no idea, how do you believe The battery is different with the cells remaining the same ? Different color casing may be ? :- )