2013 versus 2011/2012 LEAF trickle EVSE

[Kelangst]

Guess I need to make sure to always check the forums before making any decisions about my car. I traded in my leased 2011 LEAF on Friday for a new 2013 SL. Love it. But, the new trickle EVSE cable seems to be a problem. Is is documented to provide a slower charge than the previous portable cable/brick? My previous vehicle would reach 80% after 7 hours of charging. This vehicle shows according to the app that it will reach 80% on the same outlet after 16.5 hours? What? I realize that the loss of 1 bar of capacity would reduce the time to reach that 80%, but it should not be this dramatic.

I am guessing this is already an active topic and my searching ability just did not uncover what is already a widely known issue. Will performing the after market upgrade to this device help me at all? I would love to be able to charge to 80% at night rather than the full 100%. But at this rate, I won't be able to leave for home until like 9:30 in the evening....

 

[TomT]

It should be exactly the same as your previous unit on 120...

Is is documented to provide a slower charge than the previous portable cable/brick? My previous vehicle would reach 80% after 7 hours of charging.

 

[Kelangst]

Well it isn't. Not even close. Been plugged in for 6 hours. Have received all of 3 bars of charge. Usually was close to 1 bar/hour on old trickle EVSE. Even accounting for the different battery capacities, this seems a bit slow.

 

[TomT]

Was your old EVSE modded? If not, they both charge at 12 amps on 120 volts - exactly the same...

Well it isn't. Not even close.

 

[Kelangst]

No my old EVSE was not modified. It was the out of the box unit. I wish I would I would have thought to measure the draw of each, but it never occurred to me that the newer EVSE would deliver power to the vehicle any differently. I had 23% charge when I plugged it in at 9:00am. As of right now, it is showing I will need until 9:40pm to get to 80%. So that is more than 12 hours to charge 57%.

My guess based on your response is that there is something wrong with this device so I should pop back by the dealer and either ask for my old one back in exchange or swap it for a new one out of parts supply and see if that makes a difference tomorrow. Explains why my searching didn't have any conversation around this topic.

 

[mwalsh]

I think there is something wrong with your recollection. There is no way to get 0%-80% charge on 120v/12a in just 7 hours. It is completely impossible. You are going to get around 8.5kWh into the pack, which is around 40%.

 

[davewill]

Mwalsh is correct. 0-100% on 120v is nominally 21 hours. The numbers you're reporting now fit in with that perfectly. I can only think that you are misremembering either the time, or how low the battery was on the old vehicle.

Performing the upgrade will only help if you can plug the EVSE into a 240v outlet. If so, then yes, the upgrade will let you easily charge 0-100% overnight.

 

[Kelangst]

Look, I may not be as technical about the car as others on the forum. I posted simply to find out whether there was a known difference in the portable EVSE. What I can tell you is that as of last week with the old car, I would pull into the parking lot with 1-2 bars. I would charge the car with my portable EVSE for 7-9 hours, and I would never leave with less than 80-90% charge. Bottom line. I always needed at minimum with the other car 8-9 bars to get home from the office, and 10-11 bars to get to work due to hills and elevations. I understand that my pedestrian reliance upon the "bar" display is a little naive. But that is what I used.

With the new car, I plug it in and I get an estimate of more than 19 hours to charge to 80%. I stayed plugged in today for a total of 9 hours and went from 23% to 56% charge.

Nothing else plugged into the dedicated line. Same place I have plugged into for over a year. They specially installed it for me and I am the only person using it right now.

So either the EVSE or the car has an issue. I doubt it is the car. The dealer agreed to let me have my old EVSE and to perform some trials with it. So I will use my little electricity usage monitor and see if there is a difference between the two units this evening.

 

[Ingineer]

The only difference between the two EVSE's is that the 2013 model has thermal protection in it's plug end. This means if it is taking much longer than the old one, it could be your outlet is worn out and is getting hot. Easy to check for.

If you can locate a way to get 240V for charging (existing outlet, Quick220, new outlet, etc) and get your new 2013 unit upgraded by us, your charge time will drop to about 4 hours. (Assuming you have a 6kW LEAF)

-Phil

 

[mwalsh]

Look, I may not be as technical about the car as others on the forum. I posted simply to find out whether there was a known difference in the portable EVSE. What I can tell you is that as of last week with the old car, I would pull into the parking lot with 1-2 bars.

1-2 bars in your old car is almost 30% charged already. Not what you insinuated in your original post. So, yeah, with another 7+ hours I've no doubt that you'd get up to 80%. My understanding of the new car is they've once again done away with the mapping that "hides" bars, so it would look different. So I'm going to change my answer to "you don't understand the difference in your new car".

 

[Yogi62]

I think the difference is that your old battery was degraded and didn't need as many KW to go from 30% to 80%. 8KW might have been enough.

Now you have a fresh battery, it will hold more KW so it takes longer to "fill up".

Congrats! Now you have more range.

 

[mwalsh]

^ Entirely probable.

 

[planet4ever]

I'd say it's a combination of what mwalsh posted on the previous page and what Yogi62 suggested above. Kelangst, try to ignore for the moment what the bars seem to be saying, what the new %charge gauge is saying, and what the "time to charge" report is telling you. Focus instead on how long it actually takes to charge after your commute. I'm betting that once you settle into the routine it won't take any longer than it used to. Looking at it that way excludes the effects of the bars being mapped differently (they are) and of your previously degraded battery.

Ray

 

[Kelangst]

Well I know when I am wrong and I should admit it. So I agree with all of the items everyone pointed out, and I thank you for that. I of course understand that after 3 years of owning the last car, it did degrade in its capacity by 1 bar - about 15% if I understand it correctly. And you are right that the way they have calibrated the new car is different. So everyone is probably right that I am just not used to the new car. Of course I did almost run out of power on my normal commute home...

And.... there is this one little detail. When I plugged in my old EVSE tonight attached to the new car and measured the pull it was stable between about 11.65-11.70 amps measured over the course of about 10-15 min. When I plugged in the new EVSE into the new car and measured the pull it bounced significantly between 8.70 and 10.4 amps pretty randomly and inconsistently over the course of 10-15 minutes. So I guess what I will say is that yes everyone is right that of course my new car has more battery capacity and of course my perception was off. I do completely agree with this. But perhaps I also might have a defective EVSE? I am hoping that they will just give me a new one tomorrow, and that I will be able to happily report that I am charging just fine and have no commute issues tomorrow.

And oh, I am going to do that sweet upgrade on the unit once I have one I know is stable.

Regards.

 

[Yogi62]

the pull it bounced significantly between 8.70 and 10.4 amps

Now that is a good measurement of a possibly bad EVSE. I'd try to get it replaced.

 

[Kelangst]

Replaced with a new cord this am and no surprise it works at 11.4-11.6. So confirmed, bad EVSE. Carwings reading a more reasonable time to charge today and feeling much better this morning. Nothing like a meter to confirm sneaking suspicions- completely worth the investment on Amazon.

 

[davewill]

Replaced with a new cord this am and no surprise it works at 11.4-11.6. So confirmed, bad EVSE. ...

Feel free to say you told us so. The CarWings numbers just didn't really strike me as out of bounds. Good for you nailing down the exact draw and getting this put to bed.

 

[mwalsh]

Feel free to say you told us so. The CarWings numbers just didn't really strike me as out of bounds. Good for you nailing down the exact draw and getting this put to bed.

+1

 

[Yogi62]

Thank you for opening our eyes to a potential problem!

By the way, what meter are you using?

 

[Kelangst]

Sorry didn't see the question until now - just was using a regular Kill a Watt meter. Not as precise as some other tools, which is why I left it plugged in for awhile and watched the draw over at least 15 minutes for both chargers. Was very visible difference even with this consumer tool.