cabin pre heat

[LEAFer]

We did ... last week. Works (heating) ... but only luke warm or slow.

(The "charge" light on the trickle charger came back on. Don't 100% remember if the LEDs on the dashboard did ... but don't think they did. IOW it uses wall, and probably lets the battery alone.)

 

[Jimmydreams]

We did ... last week. Works (heating) ... but only luke warm or slow.

(The "charge" light on the trickle charger came back on. Don't 100% remember if the LEDs on the dashboard did ... but don't think they did. IOW it uses wall, and probably lets the battery alone.)

On a full charge, my EVSE delivers about 3.6kW to the car. I also charge to 100%.

Tomorrow morning, I'll preheat the car before leaving for work and check my TED to see how much power the EVSE is delivering. I'll let you know...my guess is that it'll be under 3kW, but we shall see.

 

[AndyH]

Stumbled on this in the service manual. Does it make sense to you drivers?

TIMER CHARGE MODE
When the set time comes, VCM starts up automatically and starts charging.
When VCM receives a Li-ion battery charge completion signal from Li-ion battery controller or at a set timer
charge finish time, VCM stops the charge control.
NOTE:
When timer charge and the timer air conditioner operate simultaneously, VCM distributes power to the air conditiner
system and the charge system according to the priority set on the navigatin screen.

EVC chapter, page 38.

Air Conditioner Control During Charging
VCM allows the air conditioner to be used during charging. In this case, the air conditioner stops when charging
is completed.
NOTE:
If the Li-ion battery available charge gauge level is lower than Level 2, the A/C does not operate during battery
charge.
Timer Air Conditioning Control
When all of the following conditions are satisfied, VCM activates the timer air conditioner so that the room temperature
reaches 25 °C (77°F) before the scheduled departure time.
• Timer air conditioner timer is ON
• There is AC power input during charging (or in a state where AC power input is possible).
Regarding the timer air conditioner operation time, VCM starts the EV system 2 hours prior to the scheduled
department time, and the A/C auto amp. determines the necessary operating time in the range of 0 to 2 hrs
based on the outside air temperature and the temperature in the cabin and sends this information to VCM.
VCM back calculates the operation required time from the scheduled department time to determine the timer
air conditioner start time.
Furthermore, when the timer charge function and the timer air conditioner function are in operation at the
same time due to an overlap of the timer setting, either function can be set to be preferentially provided with
electric power.
NOTE:
• When turning on the power during timer air conditioning, switch to normal air conditioning control.
• When timer charge and the timer air conditioner operate simultaneously, VCM distributes power to the air
conditiner system and the charge system according to the priority set on the navigatin screen.
Remote Air Conditioning Control
When VCM receives the remote air conditioning request signal from the TCU, the air conditioning is operated.
Remote air-conditioner operates as follows.

Charge connector is not connected: Operating time 15 minutes
EVSE Connected and power present: Operating time 15-120 minutes
During quick charge: Operating time 15-120 minutes

EVC chapter, page 44

 

[Jimmydreams]

This morning, I used cabin pre-heat and here is the resulting TED graph for power usage:

The EVSE was pumping out around 2.0-3.0kW, but jumping all around as the heater was asking for more or less power. I only had it running for about 10 minutes or so, but you can see the downward trend of power usage as the interior of the car was heating up.

The interior was nice and toasty when I got in..... :mrgreen:

Overall, a VERY nice feature.

 

[DaveEV]

So Jimmy - I'd estimate that you used about 0.4-0.5 kWh to preheat the car?

 

[Jimmydreams]

So Jimmy - I'd estimate that you used about 0.4-0.5 kWh to preheat the car?

TED is reporting 0.6 for the 4-5am hour. I turned on the climate control via iPhone around 4:45am.

 

[Skywagon]

I have been using pre-heating every morning and I will say that it is all I would want for my 5 mile morning commute to work. The ambient temps here in Phoenix have been around 38 deg in the morning; even the low ambient temp warning displays. It is a great feature indeed!

 

[kolmstead]

I looked at TED data for last night. Car took about eleven kWh to recharge (about 50% of the pack), and my morning preheat ran for at least 22 minutes before I shut it off. Mostly at 3.7 kW. Used about 1.4 kWh just getting comfy. It was about 25 degrees here this morning. As posted in another topic, I ran the heater and blower up to max on the way to work; consumption peaked at 4.5 to 5 kW before I returned settings to my usual low blower, 64 degree, 1.5 kW preference.

I told the car I was leaving at 6 am, and it started heating at 5:35. Looked like it finally started tapering off around 5:57. Sure was nice in there!

My conclusion? There's no way you'll get full cabin pre-conditioning out of the trickle charger, unless the car can pull power from traction battery to make up the difference.

-Karl


Yes, you need more like 3-5kw, depending.

 

[smkettner]

My conclusion? There's no way you'll get full cabin pre-conditioning out of the trickle charger, unless the car can pull power from traction battery to make up the difference.

-Karl


Yes, you need more like 3-5kw, depending.

Would Leaf know to start earlier on L1?

 

[DaveNagy]

I doubt I'll ever need to do any pre-heating, but some pre-cooling might be nice occasionally. Could the trickle charger keep up with the A/C, or at least come close?

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

I find it a little surprising that you'd need 5000 watts to heat the inside of a parked car. Somebody suggested a 150 watt heater that plugged into a cigarette lighter which I certainly agree would do just about zero. An interesting experiment would be to take a generic 1500 watt-ish electric space heater and see what it does in a car in a cold location. I'd try it myself but it's 70 degrees here today

 

[EVDRIVER]

I find it a little surprising that you'd need 5000 watts to heat the inside of a parked car. Somebody suggested a 150 watt heater that plugged into a cigarette lighter which I certainly agree would do just about zero. An interesting experiment would be to take a generic 1500 watt-ish electric space heater and see what it does in a car in a cold location. I'd try it myself but it's 70 degrees here today

I originally put a 1500 watt heater in my EV and it did little to heat the car in the bay area, even when it was 55 out. I doubled it and it was adequate but it would really struggle in a cold climate. In a car you are surrounded by cold surfaces that radiate the cold and it takes quite a bit to heat the air and surfaces. This is why radiant heat is better, one feels warmer with radiant heat even when the ambient temp in the room is lower. Stand next to a glass window that is cold in a warm room and you get the idea. Heated seats are a no-brainer in an EV.

 

[kmp647]

I tried the 1500 w heater as a test to warm up my ice

It worked but was weak

 

[wsbca]

We've had a few discussions on the feasibility of pre-heating with something other than the car's own climate system...

I stumbled on the blog of a guy who has 50,000 miles on a Mini-E, in a cold climate, by way of a link to an article from the Leaf facebook page.

The Mini-E is not a cold-weather version. Turns out he actually has been experimenting with a space heater in the car to warm it up before he heads out (he also heats his garage).

The article, where he contests a FUD column targeting EVs in cold weather:
http://www.plugincars.com/electric-car-owner-challenges-washington-post-ev-critic-106755.html

The blog entry where he refers to pre-heating with a ceramic heater:
http://minie250.blogspot.com/2011/01/thermal-conditioning-for-battery-and.html

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/01/27/AR2011012706170.html

You can't recharge if you don't have electricity, and hundreds of thousands of customers were blacked out Thursday from the snow. The Post reports that this will be the case for many of them for days.

Take it from the folks who were in Florida in 2004 and 2005... if you don't have electricity you can't pump gas either - for days

 

[gmuzhik]

Does anyone notice this behavior when pre-cooling? If the car is charged up to 80% and you remotely turn on the pre-cooling, it starts charging the car at full current? This does not seem right to me. If the car is already at 80%, I don't want it to go above that but want to precool, it is not smart enough to only take current for the A/C. With all the smarts in the car, it cannot figure out to only take current for the A/C. I wanted to see how much current the A/C draws using an ammeter but it starts charging at full current of 15.5 Amps and cannot measure only the A/C. Annoying!