Capacity Loss on 2011-2012 LEAFs

[DaveinOlyWA]

My wife and I don't have a Leaf either. I guess we should shut up. :lol:

Not only that but you are misleading the whole forum because your profile shows that you have LEAF number 500 which is clearly a fabrication by your own admission.

Tut, Tut, Tut.....





:mrgreen:

Seriously, sorry things turned out the way way they did for you and you no longer have the EV Grin.

all kidding aside, i truly hope that all affected AZ LEAF'ers look at this as just a temporary setback to driving EV.

 

[jspearman]

My wife and I don't have a Leaf either. I guess we should shut up. :lol:

Not only that but you are misleading the whole forum because your profile shows that you have LEAF number 500 which is clearly a fabrication by your own admission.

Tut, Tut, Tut.....





:mrgreen:

Seriously, sorry things turned out the way way they did for you and you no longer have the EV Grin.

all kidding aside, i truly hope that all affected AZ LEAF'ers look at this as just a temporary setback to driving EV.

We are committed to EV's, no matter what happens with our Leaf. A Tesla is definitely in our future, hopefully by the end of next year. We have a showroom here in Scottsdale and the car blew me away. I'm sad about the Leaf, but still confident about electric mobility.

 

[spooka]

Not only that but you are misleading the whole forum because your profile shows that you have LEAF number 500 which is clearly a fabrication by your own admission.

Tut, Tut, Tut.....





:mrgreen:

Seriously, sorry things turned out the way way they did for you and you no longer have the EV Grin.

all kidding aside, i truly hope that all affected AZ LEAF'ers look at this as just a temporary setback to driving EV.

We are committed to EV's, no matter what happens with our Leaf. A Tesla is definitely in our future, hopefully by the end of next year. We have a showroom here in Scottsdale and the car blew me away. I'm sad about the Leaf, but still confident about electric mobility.

I stopped in also. BeautifuI EV! I asked a rep about battery warranties. He actually said the 85kw battery is guaranteed to make 300 miles in 8 years. They replace it if it doesn't. I asked where that was in writing. He said to call the number on their website. My impression is that Tesla needs to hire qualified/knowledgeable staff. Same problems as Nissan as far as technical knowledge of their product IMO.

 

[Stoaty]

I stopped in also. BeautifuI EV! I asked a rep about battery warranties. He actually said the 85kw battery is guaranteed to make 300 miles in 8 years. They replace it if it doesn't.

Under what driving conditions? The EPA rates it at 265 miles when new, I believe.

 

[JPWhite]

I stopped in also. BeautifuI EV! I asked a rep about battery warranties. He actually said the 85kw battery is guaranteed to make 300 miles in 8 years. They replace it if it doesn't.

Under what driving conditions? The EPA rates it at 265 miles when new, I believe.

Salesman driving conditions.

 

[smkettner]

I stopped in also. BeautifuI EV! I asked a rep about battery warranties. He actually said the 85kw battery is guaranteed to make 300 miles in 8 years. They replace it if it doesn't.

Under what driving conditions? The EPA rates it at 265 miles when new, I believe.

spooka, you better find that warranty in writing.

 

[Joeviocoe]

No, I don't own one. I came from Autoblog Green.

Since you do not own a LEAF, you don't really know what you are talking about.

That is pretty harsh. You can be quite informed about a car without ever owning it. That said there are a lot of half-truths and outright lies out there regarding the LEAF. There are even some that owners firmly believe are true! We should value anyone who has an intelligent opinion on a subject and ridicule the ignorant ones.

Ouch.... greet everybody that way?

I'm here because there is a LOT of crap and lies floating around Autoblog about the Leaf. And I want to understand better.

Plus, Autoblog Green discusses a LOT of EVs other than the Leaf... and it is good to compare and contrast the approaches to EV tech.

My engineering background doesn't make me an expert on this forum, but it does make me curious to learn, and allows me to ask more specific questions, and hopefully a better grasp once I get a few answers. And you know what, I have already learned much about the TMS in the Volt that I didn't know before.

There is a LOT of factors that are involved with this phenomenon, and even an outside perspective (just asking the right questions) may be beneficial to someone.

 

[Joeviocoe]

Since you do not own a LEAF, you don't really know what you are talking about.

That is pretty harsh. You can be quite informed about a car without ever owning it. That said there are a lot of half-truths and outright lies out there regarding the LEAF. There are even some that owners firmly believe are true! We should value anyone who has an intelligent opinion on a subject and ridicule the ignorant ones.

It is not that harsh.
Every five pages or so, someone comes from who knows where and throw his two cents in our faces.
I'm not saying that I'm an expert (Nissan engineers are and some of the forum's members have more knowledge than others), but I have been driving this car more than a year and half and I know how it has been performing in two springs, two summers, one winter and during this second autumn.

Did anyone try to contradict you about how YOUR car is performing?

Nobody can throw a blog comment "in your face".

2 cents are for everybody. Engineering and statistical analysis of the overall issue is an objective topic, and thus is NOT subjective only to Leaf owners... regardless of how long you've been driving.

 

[spike09]

I stopped in also. BeautifuI EV! I asked a rep about battery warranties. He actually said the 85kw battery is guaranteed to make 300 miles in 8 years. They replace it if it doesn't.

Under what driving conditions? The EPA rates it at 265 miles when new, I believe.

spooka, you better find that warranty in writing.

Here is a link to Tesla Model S warranty http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/9578-Warranty-(esp-driving-through-floods!)
YOU WILL NOT FIND THIS INFO ON THE TESLA WEBSITE!

Here is the Battery Warranty Section. Degradation due to normal use is not included!

Battery Limited Warranty
Subject to the exclusions and limitations described in this New Vehicle Limited Warranty, the Battery Limited Warranty covers the repair or replacement necessary to correct defects in the materials or workmanship of the vehicle’s lithium-ion battery (“Battery”) manufactured or supplied by Tesla that occur under normal use for a period of 8 years or for the miles specified below for your vehicle’s Battery type, whichever comes first:
• 40 kWh - 100,000 miles (160,000 km)
• 60 kWh - 125,000 miles (200,000 km)
• 85 kWh - unlimited miles/km
The Battery, like all lithium-ion batteries, will experience gradual energy or power loss with time and use. Loss of Battery energy or power over time or due to or resulting from Battery usage, is NOT covered under this New Vehicle Limited Warranty. See your owner documentation for important information on how to maximize the life and capacity of the Battery.

Most assume Tesla would replace any battery pack with accelerated loss (unless they seriously abused the battery pack) to keep the customer happy. But assuming makes an ASSofUandME!

I encourage everyone to post their months of ownership, total miles and number of capacity bars info into their forum signature. And of course their location and VIN in their forum profile.

 

[JRP3]

Regarding a TMS, I think one of the main benefits would be cooling the battery when plugged in and charging. Even if the TMS can't keep the pack cool when not plugged in my impression is that charging while hot is doing the most damage to the pack.

*Disclaimer, I do not own a LEAF so I have no idea what I'm talking about :lol:

 

[JPWhite]

I stopped in also. BeautifuI EV! I asked a rep about battery warranties. He actually said the 85kw battery is guaranteed to make 300 miles in 8 years. They replace it if it doesn't.

Under what driving conditions? The EPA rates it at 265 miles when new, I believe.

Salesman driving conditions.

Also the Tesla company is a loser
http://atlanta.cbslocal.com/2012/10/04/romney-calls-tesla-electric-vehicles-a-loser/

 

[Stanton]

Here is the Tesla Battery Warranty Section. Degradation due to normal use is not included!

This shouldn't be a surprise: does anyone think that Telsa is DUMBER than Nissan? Tesla wouldn't be immune to all the dog-piling on Nissan if they didn't have such a big battery pack to begin with (I wouldn't even know what to do with all that range) and have a "degradation" gauge staring you in the face right in the dash.

 

[TonyWilliams]

I do know that one of our LEAF / Tesla Roadster owners said there was a 7 year / 70% warrantee.

Is Renault dumb with a 75% "guarantee" on their leased batteries? Volt must offer it, apparently at 80%, to handle emission requirements.

 

[spike09]

I do know that one of our LEAF / Tesla Roadster owners said there was a 7 year / 70% warrantee.

Is Renault dumb with a 75% "guarantee" on their leased batteries? Volt must offer it, apparently at 80%, to handle emission requirements.

His Tesla Roadster probably does have a 7 year / 70% warranty. I understand you can purchase an extended warranty on the Roadster.

 

[JPWhite]

I understand you can purchase an extended warranty on the Roadster.

I bought an extended warranty on my LEAF. Guess what it doesn't cover!

 

[planet4ever]

Since you do not own a LEAF, you don't really know what you are talking about.

That is pretty harsh. You can be quite informed about a car without ever owning it. That said there are a lot of half-truths and outright lies out there regarding the LEAF. There are even some that owners firmly believe are true! We should value anyone who has an intelligent opinion on a subject and ridicule the ignorant ones.

It is not that harsh. Every five pages or so, someone comes from who knows where and throw his two cents in our faces. I'm not saying that I'm an expert (Nissan engineers are and some of the forum's members have more knowledge than others), but I have been driving this car more than a year and half and I know how it has been performing in two springs, two summers, one winter and during this second autumn.

Sorry, leafwing, I agree with spike09 on this one. Joeviocoe has not been claiming to be an expert on the LEAF. He has mostly discussed the effect of climate on machinery in general. I have found his thoughts to be well expressed, and his perspective refreshing. He also seems ready to learn from those who have more experience with specific EVs. I welcome his presence here.

Ray

 

[LEAFfan]

there are a lot of half-truths and outright lies out there regarding the LEAF.

Please list these. I' m curious to see which ones they think are in these two categories. Thanks!

 

[leafwing]

Sorry, leafwing, I agree with spike09 on this one. Joeviocoe has not been claiming to be an expert on the LEAF. He has mostly discussed the effect of climate on machinery in general. I have found his thoughts to be well expressed, and his perspective refreshing. He also seems ready to learn from those who have more experience with specific EVs. I welcome his presence here.
Ray

Pardon my ignorance and poor reading skills; Please go back and read his post and let me know what is refreshing about it, the defective $20 sensor or heat does not matter or active cooling is not going to help the battery in hot climates? What does he know that we didn't beat to death in this gigantic thread.
These voices are distracting the community with baseless speculations and trying to create more noise than substance with regard to the main issue of this thread.

 

[spooka]

Under what driving conditions? The EPA rates it at 265 miles when new, I believe.

spooka, you better find that warranty in writing.

Here is a link to Tesla Model S warranty http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/9578-Warranty-(esp-driving-through-floods!)
YOU WILL NOT FIND THIS INFO ON THE TESLA WEBSITE!

Here is the Battery Warranty Section. Degradation due to normal use is not included!

Battery Limited Warranty
Subject to the exclusions and limitations described in this New Vehicle Limited Warranty, the Battery Limited Warranty covers the repair or replacement necessary to correct defects in the materials or workmanship of the vehicle’s lithium-ion battery (“Battery”) manufactured or supplied by Tesla that occur under normal use for a period of 8 years or for the miles specified below for your vehicle’s Battery type, whichever comes first:
• 40 kWh - 100,000 miles (160,000 km)
• 60 kWh - 125,000 miles (200,000 km)
• 85 kWh - unlimited miles/km
The Battery, like all lithium-ion batteries, will experience gradual energy or power loss with time and use. Loss of Battery energy or power over time or due to or resulting from Battery usage, is NOT covered under this New Vehicle Limited Warranty. See your owner documentation for important information on how to maximize the life and capacity of the Battery.

Most assume Tesla would replace any battery pack with accelerated loss (unless they seriously abused the battery pack) to keep the customer happy. But assuming makes an ASSofUandME!

I encourage everyone to post their months of ownership, total miles and number of capacity bars info into their forum signature. And of course their location and VIN in their forum profile.

THANKS! I've been looking for this. Like you said, not to be found on their website. And yeah, the 300 mile quote was totally "salesman miles". Do any of these people understand these cars at all? This remind me of the oil change coupon I got for my LEAF last week for my Nissan dealer in the mail. I'm hoping arbitration comes soon...

 

[spooka]

Here's a link to Nissan's latest disaster video. 7,500 miles per year is confirmed.

Quote from Facebook

Nissan LEAF
Watch Chelsea Sexton, Founder of the Lightning Rod Foundation, Consulting Producer of Revenge of the Electric Car Car, and Co-Founder of Plug In America have a frank discussion about the Nissan LEAF with Andy Palmer, Executive Vice President of Nissan Motor Co., Ltd.

This video runs a little long - about 17 minutes - but we felt it was important to provide our Nissan LEAF Owners & our supporters with as much transparency into many of the questions being asked by the LEAF community.

Entire clip
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=R1tfX7fRWPI" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Jump to AZ issues (7,500 miles, etc)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=R1tfX7fRWPI#t=193s" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

and my response on FB

I have lost 2 capacity bars at 13 months and 13,300 miles. 15 to 20% capacity loss in total at this point. Your company has told me that 20% capacity loss in a year is NORMAL. 7,500 miles a year = 20 miles a day! Who the HELL drives a car only 20 miles a day? My battery will be below 70% in less than 3 years and I have 5 years of payments on this disaster. I am asking you to buy my car back Mr. Palmer. Mr Lundy Flowers continues to ignore my repeated calls to him to address my capacity loss. You want to address my concerns seriously? Buy my lemon back now. IF YOU HAD TOLD ME I COULD ONLY DRIVE MY CAR 20 MILES A DAY I NEVER WOULD HAVE BOUGHT THIS GLORIFIED GOLF CART. Will you help me Mr. Palmer?