I think the dark times are behind us.

[adric22]

When the Leaf and Volt first came to market in lat 2010 and early 2011 I was very optimistic. I was complaining that GM's production goal of 45,000 per year would not be enough to meet demand.

By 2012 I was feeling very pessimistic. Plug-in sales were in the crapper and the election season was just fanning the flames of the EV-hating crowd. I was almost afraid that by this time in 2013 that we'd be having a second EV funeral as everyone pulled the plug on their EV programs. Every news story that even mentioned EVs was so full of negative, ignorant, and uninformed comments that it painted a picture that most Americans were against this movement. We still had no charging infrastructure in Dallas/Ft.Worth worth speaking of. I never saw any other plug-in vehicles on the road.

Update to June 2013, things have improved a lot. Sales are picking up steadily on the Leaf and at least remaining stable on the Volt with most people predicting a price drop soon which would probably double sales of the Volt. Tesla is now considered a success story by even the right-wing news media, casting a halo over the entire EV industry. Charging infrastructure here in my city has quadrupled in the last year and there are now enough stations to pretty much get around wherever you need to go. And I'm actually starting to see other EVs about once a week at least. And when those news stories come out, they still have a few of those ignorant, negative comments. But there seems to be far less of them and there seems to be plenty of people commenting back explaining to those ignorant people why they are wrong. I think with election season behind us, some of the partisan bickering has calmed down and also made a huge difference.

So, I think we took a huge leap forward in 2011, but then had to take a step back in 2012 and regroup so to speak. Now I think 2013 is shaping up to be another step forward. I think things will be easier from this point forward and I'm looking forward to seeing continual growth.

I predict by next election season NEITHER candidate will be poo-pooing electric cars, instead both will be praising them and trying to take credit for them. The republicans will suddenly restore their memory and be giving Bush credit for the success of the EV industry as Tesla releases its lower-cost vehicle, shaking up the entire industry.

 

[eclecticflower]

.I predict by next election season NEITHER candidate will be poo-pooing electric cars, instead both will be praising them and trying to take credit for them.

Would be interesting to see candidates owning/driving EVs!

 

[RegGuheert]

So, I think we took a huge leap forward in 2011, but then had to take a step back in 2012 and regroup so to speak. Now I think 2013 is shaping up to be another step forward. I think things will be easier from this point forward and I'm looking forward to seeing continual growth.

Agreed! This excellent chart from evnow (Thanks, evnow!) looks like a healthy new market pushing through its challenges.

IMO, EVs are here to stay this time!

 

[DNAinaGoodWay]

.I predict by next election season NEITHER candidate will be poo-pooing electric cars, instead both will be praising them and trying to take credit for them.

Would be interesting to see candidates owning/driving EVs!

Candidates drive? There was a nice Leaf limo for sale, or a Tesla, the S is limoish and a US brand.

 

[TomT]

What will have to happen for EVs to become completely mainstream is for them to eventuality be able to survive and flourish with no local, state or federal subsidies... The current model of rebates and tax credits is unsustainable...

 

[Nubo]

What will have to happen for EVs to become completely mainstream is for them to eventuality be able to survive and flourish with no local, state or federal subsidies... The current model of rebates and tax credits is unsustainable...

Yep, that's the next hurdle. I don't think the right is ready to embrace them just yet. The talking point has changed, but instead of "they don't work", now it's "Yes, they work but only because you're taking OUR tax money". Which conveniently ignores their tenet that having my taxes reduced is merely letting me keep more of MY money. :roll:

 

[apvbguy]

Yep, that's the next hurdle. I don't think the right is ready to embrace them just yet. The talking point has changed, but instead of "they don't work", now it's "Yes, they work but only because you're taking OUR tax money". Which conveniently ignores their tenet that having my taxes reduced is merely letting me keep more of MY money. :roll:

could you provide me a link or a source of the quote or comment that you are referring to

could you also explain to me how having taxes reduced IS NOT letting you keep more of YOUR money

 

[adric22]

What will have to happen for EVs to become completely mainstream is for them to eventuality be able to survive and flourish with no local, state or federal subsidies... The current model of rebates and tax credits is unsustainable...

I don't think it will be so much of a problem. Right now people are willing to "try out" an EV because the price is so low. But once they are proven in the minds of people and there is more infrastructure, the "value" of an EV will increase. With Nissan's lower entry model, I think a lot of people would still be able to afford one without the rebates.

 

[Nubo]

Yep, that's the next hurdle. I don't think the right is ready to embrace them just yet. The talking point has changed, but instead of "they don't work", now it's "Yes, they work but only because you're taking OUR tax money". Which conveniently ignores their tenet that having my taxes reduced is merely letting me keep more of MY money. :roll:

could you provide me a link or a source of the quote or comment that you are referring to

No. I'm not defending a dissertation here. Just sharing my observation from reading a lot of comment sections in recent online Tesla news articles. You can call BS if you like.

could you also explain to me how having taxes reduced IS NOT letting you keep more of YOUR money

I guess I wasn't clear. I agree that the tax credit is letting me keep more of my money.

 

[Kwillscherer123]

I agree that getting rid of government subsidies is the next step but I do not see it happening anytime soon. EVs are too expensive to make, until they become more cost effective to produce the subsidies will have to stay. I wish more of my tax money would go to the EV industry.

 

[mbender]

I guess I wasn't clear. I agree that the tax credit is letting me keep more of my money.

+1 Nubo! Well put.

The other thing that EV-haters conveniently never talk about are the subsidies for petroleum, both obvious and subtle (let alone all the other issues having to do with dependence, national security and sending a billion or more per day out of the country). Get rid of those subsidies and the value proposition of EVs will become obvious and the industry will easily take root and flourish without subsidies.

 

[DeaneG]

The main thing I've noticed is that more and more acquaintances seem to be realizing that an EV is a reasonable, viable choice, not a green-freak fetish. There are now 4 Leafs on my short street and the adjoining cul-de-sac, and a Tesla S on the high-priced cul-de-sac adjacent. Kind of cool parking next to another Leaf so often.

Sure, EVs are well subsidized for now and hence artificially priced. But without a notable functional advantage over an ICE, that's what is required to build volume, with the technical progress and cost reduction that will eventually result. I wonder how much I've paid in taxes over the years to support imported energy (trade imbalance, wars, etc) compared to the $12K I received in incentives on purchase of my Leaf.

 

[apvbguy]

The main thing I've noticed is that more and more acquaintances seem to be realizing that an EV is a reasonable, viable choice, not a green-freak fetish. There are now 4 Leafs on my short street and the adjoining cul-de-sac, and a Tesla S on the high-priced cul-de-sac adjacent. Kind of cool parking next to another Leaf so often.

PR/changing people's perceptions can be a long slow slog,all current EV owners can do is be good ambassadors for this new technology and explain away the ignorances some may have about EVs

 

[lion]

Considering oil companies are still receiving our tax monies, I think it's only fair that EV monies shouldn't go away until the oil industry gets cut off.

But I do feel that the worst is slowly is passing us. It's up to us now to help explain EVs to non EV drivers, and the manufacturers to stop sabotaging their own product line (looking at you, Ford and Toyota!).

In fact, I started the ChargeNY project because I believe this time, EVs are here to stay, and I want to build upon this momentum to explain EVs to my fellow road warriors in New York State. I'm not trying to sell an EV to everyone, I just want them to understand them, and maybe even accept them. When I hear things like 'I thought that charging station was an air pump!', or 'they have electric cars for adults?', I know there is a lot of work left to do. But when an octogenarian expresses interest in my car, and wants a ride, I know there is hope!

The new few years will be very interesting, and determine the course. Plenty of opportunities for the manufacturers to screw it up, but it would have to be almost intentional at this point.

 

[ERG4ALL]

The one area that seems to be overlooked is how the EVs have been marketed. Nissan came out with the Polar Bear and the receding glaciers which really pointed out how many value the polar bears versus their wallet. My LEAF saves me about $200 per month and yet I have seen little if any advertising of that fact. When you charge at night and don't have to buy gas, oil, oil filters, air filters, fuel filters there can be a big savings that should be brought to the fore to show the total cost of ownership. Thus, when the tax subsidies go away, the EV can still make economic sense.

 

[apvbguy]

Considering oil companies are still receiving our tax monies, I think it's only fair that EV monies shouldn't go away until the oil industry gets cut off.

I guess you don't like eating, living in heated/well lit homes and paved roads, just to mention a few things derived from oil

 

[lion]

Considering oil companies are still receiving our tax monies, I think it's only fair that EV monies shouldn't go away until the oil industry gets cut off.

I guess you don't like eating, living in heated/well lit homes and paved roads, just to mention a few things derived from oil

wow, I'm just making a point showing how people bitch about the EV incentives, but fail to ignore the tax breaks oil companies are getting. Oil companies are making plenty of money, they don't NEED our tax money. Never said I had a problem with oil as a product, most of us understand it's needed, chill

 

[GRA]

What will have to happen for EVs to become completely mainstream is for them to eventuality be able to survive and flourish with no local, state or federal subsidies... The current model of rebates and tax credits is unsustainable...

I don't think it will be so much of a problem. Right now people are willing to "try out" an EV because the price is so low. But once they are proven in the minds of people and there is more infrastructure, the "value" of an EV will increase. With Nissan's lower entry model, I think a lot of people would still be able to afford one without the rebates.

They could probably sell them to the mainstream for the current price without rebates, but not (I think) for the current price with the current performance - I think we'll need at least double the range at the current price to do that. But we're getting there, and things are certainly looking a lot better than last year, when the overpromising, especially about infrastructure, was readily apparent. I realize that infrastructure improvements are mainly noticeable if you're on one of the coasts or in a few inland EV enclaves, but we'll take them where we can get them.

Even though I consider much of it to be a bubble, I'll give credit where it's due - Tesla has done more to boost my opinion of how fast we can change people's minds about BEVs than I thought possible, so kudos to them. Without them I think the last year things would have really stalled, if not shifted into reverse. Instead, the reality of the S and the installation of Superchargers has nearly lived up to the hype, while eliminating most of the caveats re BEVs. It's been very pleasant to see a company, or at least a CEO, with a long-term development plan for a _system_ instead of just one or two parts. Although they've had their hiccups and shortfalls, on a macro level Tesla has gone from strength to strength. Don't we all wish the other BEV companies were as responsive and agile?

Edit: Along that line, not owning a Leaf with or without a battery needing replacement I will be paying more attention to this announcement on June 20th (via insideevs.com):

"Musk Discusses When Tesla Will Demonstrate How Model S Charges Quicker Than Filling a Tank Full of Gas"

http://insideevs.com/has-ev-quick-charging-surpassed-filling-with-gas/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Edit: Of course we still don't know if anyone, even Tesla, has yet managed to sell BEVs and make a profit _on the cars_. I expect most of the affordable BEVs are being leased/sold at prices that lose their companies several thousand dollars each.

 

[apvbguy]

wow, I'm just making a point showing how people bitch about the EV incentives, but fail to ignore the tax breaks oil companies are getting. Oil companies are making plenty of money, they don't NEED our tax money. Never said I had a problem with oil as a product, most of us understand it's needed, chill

 

[DeaneG]

At the SFBay Leafs meeting this morning I learned that Evernote (the company) is subsidizing EVs to their employees at $250 per month, with free on-site charging expanding from their current 10 L2 + 1 DCFC. The justification is that shorter employee travel time due to HOV lane access pays back the monthly $250 subsidy in the first 2-3 days.

I remain bewildered why Nissan doesn't mention HOV lane access in their ads in California's metropolitan areas - even the Volt ads say "Charge down the HOV lane" or something like that.