Leaf or Bolt?

[LeftieBiker]

I did not try taking my hands off the wheel like I did when test driving the Leaf (it drove around a sweeping curve on the freeway). It did not feel like it had that much control, although I did feel the nudging as I (on purpose) drifted toward the side of the lane.

Pro Pilot isn't a great autopilot - I'm not sure that such a thing exists yet. It's a pretty good driver aid. If your attention wanders it will usually - but not always - keep you on the road. You can take your hands off the wheel for maybe 5 seconds, after which the driver's screen lights up with a huge red warning and, IIRC, the wheel shakes.

 

[cwerdna]

Does the Bolt let you take your hands off the wheel for a while like pro pilot and the Tesla?

Most cars will let you take your hands off the wheel for as long as you like. The question is what cars will try to steer themselves when you do. I don't think an un-optioned LT will warn you, while I think that a Bolt with the driver enhancements will do just that - warn you.

As someone w/a '19 Bolt Premier w/driver confidence II, DC FC inlet and infotainment package, I can tell you Bolt's LDW/LKA is crap. I skimmed https://www.chevybolt.org/threads/request-describe-your-experience-w-lane-assist.8202/ and what people report is about right. I haven't had a chance to watch the full video yet.

Essentially, once LKA is on and the LKA light is on (car with diagonal line on the left and right) is green, if you let go of the steering wheel, it might correct or might just drift over to another lane and maybe make noise and turn that light amber. If it does correct, it does it late and might over correct a bit, which means you'll eventually be over into the lane on the opposite lane (e.g. drift left, it corrects right, you end up drifting right into the right lane). On the 2nd drift, it might not correct and you might get a prompt on the dash to take control of the steering wheel. I don't think you can keep your hands off the wheel for even 1 minute.

In short, it's virtually useless. I've used ProPilot Assist a few times on a pre-production '18 Leaf that works WAY better. I'd imagine that Tesla AP works much better than that.

You should be able to d/l the manual via https://my.chevrolet.com/content/dam/gmownercenter/gmna/dynamic/manuals/2019/Chevrolet/bolt/19_CHEV_Bolt_EV_OM_en_US_U_84214429B_2018SEP10_2P.pdf. See page 234.

It also says "The LKA system will not assist or provide an LDW alert if it
detects that you are actively steering. Override LKA by turning the steering wheel..." What's funny is that even if your hands are on the wheel and you are driving normally w/LKA on, sometimes it screws up and incorrectly "corrects" (provides a bit of resistance) you w/the light turning amber because it got confused by lane markings (e.g. at intersections or when they've vanished).

Bolt also doesn't have adaptive cruise control, not even optional. I believe Volts could have it, so Volt drivers have thought the omission was weird.

 

[DougWantsALeaf]

While I only test drove the 2018 Leaf pro pilot a couple times, the 2019 pro pilot does a better job in staying centered in the lane and does quite well even on aggressive corners. It’s also done lane merges for me, but I pay much closer attention in those cases.

 

[countryleaf]

Bolt also doesn't have adaptive cruise control, not even optional. I believe Volts could have it, so Volt drivers have thought the omission was weird.

^^^ Another thing I like about the Leaf.

We also did not like that the Bolt does not have on-board navigation without a phone plugged in (at least on the one we test drove). If you can live without the liquid cooled battery (which we can and did with our 2011 Leaf) the Leaf seems to have better features.

 

[countryleaf]

... Plus, ACC - !#?$ yeah. ...

Please excuse my ignorance, but what is ACC? I've looked around and cannot find what this is.

 

[cwerdna]

We also did not like that the Bolt does not have on-board navigation without a phone plugged in (at least on the one we test drove).

Correct. Bolt has no built in navigation system... well, not really. They intend for you to use CarPlay or Android Auto and a navigation app on your phone. I use CarPlay and it works great. I've used Waze, Apple Maps and Google Maps with it. And, no, it doesn't support wireless CarPlay. iPhone must be plugged in via USB.

You can get some directions via Onstar but you need to pay for a subscription for that. I never bothered trying that and my Moronstar subscription trial is over. I'm not planning to pay for Constar.

 

[cwerdna]

... Plus, ACC - !#?$ yeah. ...

Please excuse my ignorance, but what is ACC? I've looked around and cannot find what this is.

Adaptive Cruise Control?

 

[countryleaf]

... Plus, ACC - !#?$ yeah. ...

Please excuse my ignorance, but what is ACC? I've looked around and cannot find what this is.

Adaptive Cruise Control?

Ah, I should have guessed. Thank you!!

 

[Triggerhappy007]

Hi, Leafers!

I'm trading up out of my 2017 Nissan Leaf after I found that Carvana would pay me more than what I paid for it new (thanks, Colorado state tax credit!), and I want another great deal. In Colorado, we don't get the same incentives or model availability that you lucky Californians do, so I've narrowed it down to...

* 2019 Chevy Bolt LT w/ Comfort, DC I, and DCFC. They're offering $10k off MSRP, and minus my state tax credit and partial federal tax credit, it would end up being $21,380 + sales tax and handling.
* 2019 Nissan Leaf SV w/ All Weather. They're offering $13.5k off MSRP (including state tax credit taken at point of purchase for Nissan, dealer discount, and Nissan/utility discount) and of course the full federal tax credit. It would end up being $13,395 + sales tax and handling.

The Bolt is awesome, coming from a Leaf. Firmer handling, faster, better infotainment, and of course much longer range with CCS support that allows me to unlock the full power of the Electrify America network. Plus I can get it in Shock, an insane color that I totally love. Now, I don't \*need\* the extra range... but it would be pretty cool to turn day trips into EVentures instead of relying on my gas truck. The lack of ACC is kind of a big deal for me, I commute \~60 miles round trip, about half in stop-and-go traffic... but DAT REGEN is f\*\*\*ing amazing. L mode + regen paddle made me grin from ear to ear. However, my wife is not a big fan of the cloth seats - the leather ones feel better to her, but the Premier just takes the car out of my price range.

The Leaf is pretty cool too. To start, I \*love\* my 2017 S, it's been completely problem free over 50k miles and still gives me real-world 100mi range. This SV just perfects what I love about the S - better steering wheel with heat, hybrid heater, more power/range than the 2017 (though less than the Bolt), Android Auto, and app connectivity (that frustratingly doesn't work at my house due to lack of AT&T service). Plus, ACC - **** yeah. It's not exciting, it's just damn good - but the lack of battery cooling, CHAdeMO (CCS is starting to take over in my area), and still sticking with a small battery gives me pause.

**So what would you do, Leafers?** Obviously the answer is "pick what you like and can afford". I can *afford* either, but getting a good deal on cars brings real, enduring happiness to me and since I can't get sizzling CA/New England Bolt deals, it does give me pause. The Leaf is so cheap that, if I wanted to, I could sell it in 1-2 years and likely get what I paid for it according to Carvana - not so for the Bolt, where I'd lose a few thousand bucks (just looking at what 1 year old models with 22k miles cost). Then again, the Bolt is probably the better car - except for that damned lack of ACC.

Ramblings, input, hatred, feedback appreciated,

Based on the needs you listed, I feel the Leaf deal will be better for you. The Leaf is a great commuter with ProPilot. I agree it will cost you less to own over 2 years vs the Bolt because you're getting it at such a low price. I did something similar with a Prius Prime and got more than what I paid for it.

 

[eatsleafsandshoots]

Just bought another Leaf, a 2019 SV. $13,500 + $7,500 off was too much to resist!

 

[DougWantsALeaf]

Amazing price

 

[goldbrick]

Just bought another Leaf, a 2019 SV. $13,500 + $7,500 off was too much to resist!

Tynans' in Aurora or a different dealer?

 

[eatsleafsandshoots]

Yes, Tynan. I don't understand why they are so much cheaper than everyone else but they are. Some of their models have hail damage but mine doesn't (or maybe it was repaired?).

 

[GRA]

Please excuse my ignorance, but what is ACC? I've looked around and cannot find what this is.

Adaptive Cruise Control?

Ah, I should have guessed. Thank you!!

In this context (aka TACC, Traffic Aware Cruise Control). Since it could also be Automatic Climate Control if you're talking about the HVAC system, we should probably use TACC all the time, but the context usually makes it obvious which is meant.

 

[LeftieBiker]

Since it could also be Automatic Climate Control if you're talking about the HVAC system, we should probably use TACC all the time, but the context usually makes it obvious which is meant.

Since "climate control" pretty much debuted with an automatic (originally mechanical) thermostat, and it has thus always been abbreviated "CC," I don't see a conflict.

 

[GRA]

Since it could also be Automatic Climate Control if you're talking about the HVAC system, we should probably use TACC all the time, but the context usually makes it obvious which is meant.

Since "climate control" pretty much debuted with an automatic (originally mechanical) thermostat, and it has thus always been abbreviated "CC," I don't see a conflict.

There is a difference, as I remember every time I turn off the $#@%^&*%^# ACC (the default) in my car so I can adjust things manually :evil: I knew it'd bother me before I bought the car, and 16 years of experience hasn't altered that opinion. Besides, "CC" can also refer to basic i.e. non-adaptive cruise control. TACC is context-insensitive here, at least for now. If we ever start discussing the Total Allowable Commercial Catch, Torrance Area Community Center or the Texas Association of Community Colleges (among others) on a regular basis here, we might need to find a different acronym :lol: