Official Coda Electric Car thread

[GRA]

No rational analysis of long term viability, parts and warranty service availability could conclude anything except that the CODA is a very risky purchase... One is immeasurably better off buying from a large, profitable, company with a track record... Hence, the choice of the Leaf was easy for me... I wouldn't buy from Mitsubishi, their survival in the American market is questionable.

Saab just went completely bankrupt, so what are CODA's odds?

Personally I think Tesla is a risk as well but is more likely to be bought out or merge with a bigger company.

Steve, this is not exactly news to me. Here's the email exchange:
---------------------------------------------------

Regarding

General Question

Message


What plans do you have to offer Quick charging for the cars? California has been very slow in rolling out L3 chargers and there are now three competing standards (CHAdeMo, SAE, Tesla). However, as soon as any of them are available in reasonable numbers, the inability to use at least one of the QC types will largely negate the Coda's one main advantage - maximum onboard range for the price. Obviously your main concern is just getting some cars available to sell, but you need to make plans as soon as possible to offer QC as an option.
-------------------------------------------------------
Guy,

Thank you for your interest in the CODA, the all-electric car from the all-electric company.

Since level III does not have an industry standard, we feel confident that charging at an industry- agreed level II is the most efficient way to have the best charging experience for your vehicle. CODA uses the standard SAE J1772 level ll connector. When the electric vehicle industry agrees to a common level III standard, we will support level lll charging.

The CODA can be recharged at any standard outlet, but for the quickest home charging experience, we recommend the GE WattStation charging at a 220-2240V outlet (just like the one your clothes dryer plugs into.) The CODA also has an 110V trickle charge cord that comes standard in the trunk of the car which will allow you to charge while on the road traveling. A 50-60 min charge will give 4-5 miles of range.

Regards,

[Name removed]

Customer Service Team

[email protected]

855-GO 4 CODA (855-464-2632)
------------------------------------------------------

Unfortunately, while _your company_ may feel confident that "charging at an industry- agreed level II is the most efficient way to have the best charging experience for your vehicle", odds are your _potential customers_ (of which I am one) are unlikely to agree. Obviously, L2 is fine for local use involving overnight charging or at destinations, but the Coda's sole advantage to me over other current or soon-to-be available BEVs is its range/price point. Once L3 chargers start to become available in California, that advantage will disappear except for trips between the maximum un-recharged range of competitor vehicles and the maximum un-recharged range of the Coda.

Since I only use a car for out-of-town trips, normally of 100-300 miles one-way at highway speeds, quick charging capability is essential to make use of an EV remotely practical for me. The Coda can probably just about make a 100 mile trip without recharging under ideal conditions, but is unlikely to do so under the real-world conditions (speed, temperature, load) I normally need it to, especially once the battery ages. Everything beyond that point will require re-charging, and L2 just doesn't cut it for en-route charging.

I recognize the problem with multiple standards, two of which are yet to appear on any actual vehicles, but some space and weight provision needs to be made now rather than later, installing whichever standard is first widely available (or offering the customer their choice; either way, an extra cost option) ASAP. Despite the near-total lack of L3s, the majority of Nissan Leafs have been ordered with the L3 charging option (their 3.3 kW charger makes it somewhat more essential than for those companies like yours which use 6.6 kW chargers).

As it is, Coda is fighting against built-in sales headwinds of being a start-up using a Chinese-built glider of a 10 year-old Japanese car of extremely bland exterior design, and trying to sell it for $40k. Given all that, you have to capitalize on your one real advantage, which is your range @ price point. Give up that advantage by not providing any way to L3 charge when your competitors can, and I believe the odds of your company failing are significantly higher than they already are. And I don't want you to fail.

Sincerely,
------------------------------------------------

Guy,

Thank you for your interest in CODA Automotive. Unfortunately, we do not have the capacity to fulfill your request at this time as we are 100% focused on the successful launch of our all-electric car. We thank you for your thoughtful interest and consideration and please do keep us in mind for future opportunities. If there is any other way we can be of assistance, please let us know. We wish you the best with your endeavor.

Regards,

[Name Removed]

Customer Service Team

[email protected]

855-GO 4 CODA (855-464-2632)

 

[abasile]

It's silly to wait for the electric vehicle industry to agree on a QC standard. That's letting the perfect be the enemy of the good.

Considering that there is already a QC at the bottom of our mountain waiting for a replacement part so it can be turned on within weeks, I am glad to have a LEAF with this capability. Hopefully soon, the Southern California mountain resorts will be easily accessible to a large percentage of LEAF drivers in the region. Try that with a Coda or Ford Focus Electric.

 

[edatoakrun]

It's silly to wait for the electric vehicle industry to agree on a QC standard. That's letting the perfect be the enemy of the good.

Considering that there is already a QC at the bottom of our mountain waiting for a replacement part so it can be turned on within weeks, I am glad to have a LEAF with this capability. Hopefully soon, the Southern California mountain resorts will be easily accessible to a large percentage of LEAF drivers in the region. Try that with a Coda or Ford Focus Electric.

Who's installing "your" DC?

Are they planning any more for CA?

 

[GRA]

Drove one today at the GGEVA meeting. According to the dealer rep (Del Grande Dealer Group)who was there, they will have cars to sell in about 2 weeks. Let the manufacturer's reps know I wanted L3 and a 'B' mode.

 

[Randy]

Haven't read the entire thread, but I just found out recently that the Coda doesn't have a built-in timer on the on-board charger...Interesting...And in order to make the price point, they have decided to reduce the battery size down to approximately 31kWH (final size not definite yet, but it won't be as large as previously announced at 36kWH)...

 

[ttweed]

No one's impressed with the styling. My personal take is that I spend the majority of my time inside a car looking out rather than outside looking at it, so exterior styling plays a relatively small part in my buying decision...

The exterior styling is definitely uninspired, but when I finally got an up close and personal look at a Coda at the San Diego International Auto Show in January, I was totally unimpressed with the interior styling, quality, fit and finish as well. Some people make fun of the Leaf's "mouse" shifter, but have you checked out the "Twisto-dial" selector on the Coda? It looks like a bad joke from out of the Wayback machine:

TT

 

[adric22]

No one's impressed with the styling. My personal take is that I spend the majority of my time inside a car looking out rather than outside looking at it, so exterior styling plays a relatively small part in my buying decision...

The exterior styling is definitely uninspired, but when I finally got an up close and personal look at a Coda at the San Diego International Auto Show in January, I was totally unimpressed with the interior styling, quality, fit and finish as well. Some people make fun of the Leaf's "mouse" shifter, but have you checked out the "Twisto-dial" selector on the Coda? It looks like a bad joke from out of the Wayback machine:

Oh my God.. That looks soooo 1960's. What were they thinking?

 

[TomT]

Having spent a considerable amount of time driving them - one pre-production and one production - it actually works better than you might think...

Oh my God.. That looks soooo 1960's. What were they thinking?

 

[edatoakrun]

... Some people make fun of the Leaf's "mouse" shifter, but have you checked out the "Twisto-dial" selector on the Coda? It looks like a bad joke from out of the Wayback machine:

Oh my God.. That looks soooo 1960's. What were they thinking?

I wish the LEAF had that.

Turn all the way one way to drive, the other way to park. I'm expect at the end of the the first day of use, drivers will do it without taking their eyes away from other priorities.

After almost a year, the counter-intuitive LEAF mouse still requires me to glance down.

And if you don't think the 60's were cool, you weren't there...

 

[GRA]

No one's impressed with the styling. My personal take is that I spend the majority of my time inside a car looking out rather than outside looking at it, so exterior styling plays a relatively small part in my buying decision...

The exterior styling is definitely uninspired, but when I finally got an up close and personal look at a Coda at the San Diego International Auto Show in January, I was totally unimpressed with the interior styling, quality, fit and finish as well. Some people make fun of the Leaf's "mouse" shifter, but have you checked out the "Twisto-dial" selector on the Coda? It looks like a bad joke from out of the Wayback machine:

Oh my God.. That looks soooo 1960's. What were they thinking?

They're trying to convince you it's really a modern Jaguar:

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=jaguar+xf&um=1&hl=en&client=firefox-a&sa=N&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&biw=1024&bih=638&tbm=isch&tbnid=7rneweTfWC6NiM:&imgrefurl=http://www.britishmotorcar.com/custom/Jaguar-XF-vs-Infiniti-M&docid=u4zWGHgGhpiSCM&imgurl=http://www.britishmotorcar.com/dealerimages/Dealer%2525202721%252520Images/xf%252520interior.jpg&w=1280&h=725&ei=z1JVT8aXEevaiQLUw-W0Bg&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=253&vpy=201&dur=446&hovh=88&hovw=155&tx=160&ty=78&sig=111555843664738205901&page=1&tbnh=88&tbnw=155&start=0&ndsp=15&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Added] It appears from their website that Coda has now abandoned the larger (36kWh) battery, and will only offer the smaller 31kWh version. Maybe this was mentioned at the GGEVA meeting, but the acoustics in the garage were too much for my hearing aids and I only got about one word out of ten from the speakers. As even the 36kWh battery was marginal for my needs the 31kWh battery definitely won't cut it, and the range of the larger version was the only reason I had any interest in the car. I guess I'll have to wait for a few more years yet for a BEV that makes sense for me.

 

[Boomer23]

EPA mileage figures are in for the Coda. I imagine that the Coda execs must be chagrined by the very low 73 MPGe as compared with LEAF's 99 and Ford's 105 MPGe. Especially surprising because the Coda uses a 6.6 kW on board charger, which should give them an efficiency advantage over the LEAF. They're accentuating the positive, though, that their 88 mile range is the largest EPA range figure for the recent crop of EVs, excluding Tesla's.

I'm assuming that this is for the 31 kWh pack, as the original 34 kWh option seems not to be offered at this time.

Let's see, if we assume that 88% of the pack capacity is used, if a LEAF with a 24 kWh pack can go 73 EPA miles, a Coda with a 31 kWh pack should be able to go 94 EPA miles if it were as efficient as a LEAF. Lots of assumptions there, of course, and lots to be learned about the Coda's performance as the next few months unfold.

http://green.autoblog.com/2012/03/08/coda-get-official-epa-nubmers-73-mpge-with-an-88-mile-range/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[kmp647]

I think they had the heat on ! :roll: during the test!

or maybe 20lbs of air in each tire. or they were towing a trailer

or they had a mattress ties to the roof! :lol:

 

[TimeHorse]

Especially surprising because the Coda uses a 6.6 kW on board charger, which should give them an efficiency advantage over the LEAF.

???

Sorry I guess that's a typo. Recall the only major forces on a car when driving, which is what the EPA is trying to test, are:

• Weight when going up hills (power proportional to height and velocity)
• Rolling Resistance (power proportional to velocity)
• Acceleration (power proportional to velocity squared / Kinetic Energy)
• Drag / Air Resistance (power proportional to air speed velocity cubed, where air speed is the vector dot product of actual speed and the current wind speed)

Time to charge the car shouldn't come into it except per se in the efficiency of the EVSE and on-board charger regardless of its wattage.

 

[Boomer23]

Especially surprising because the Coda uses a 6.6 kW on board charger, which should give them an efficiency advantage over the LEAF.

???

Sorry I guess that's a typo. Recall the only major forces on a car when driving, which is what the EPA is trying to test, are:

• Weight when going up hills (power proportional to height and velocity)
• Rolling Resistance (power proportional to velocity)
• Acceleration (power proportional to velocity squared / Kinetic Energy)
• Drag / Air Resistance (power proportional to air speed velocity cubed, where air speed is the vector dot product of actual speed and the current wind speed)

Time to charge the car shouldn't come into it except per se in the efficiency of the EVSE and on-board charger regardless of its wattage.

Information posted by evnow leads me to believe that the EPA measures energy consumption from the wall and that a 6 kW charger would be more efficient than the 3 kW one on the LEAF.

 

[TimeHorse]

Information posted by evnow leads me to believe that the EPA measures energy consumption from the wall and that a 6 kW charger would be more efficient than the 3 kW one on the LEAF.

It would be logical to measure from the wall but going from 3.3kW to 6.6kW doesn't imply more efficiency. In my experience the 3.3kW is actually drawing about 3.8kW (my observed at Coulomb chargers, SemaConnect chargers and the 1.9kWh per half hour on my TOU data from Dominion Virginia Power) and I assume that approximately 15% difference is just par for the course in terms of the charger's efficiency though I'm also willing to grant that the charger may be a little better than 3.3kW. My guess is the LEAF charger is really closer to 3.45kW and the other 10% is heat, noise and other dissipating effects to efficiency. Ingineer? Any thoughts?

 

[Herm]

It would be logical to measure from the wall but going from 3.3kW to 6.6kW doesn't imply more efficiency.

The 6.6kW charger could actually be less efficient.. but the reasoning is that since the battery charges faster less power is wasted by the system in housekeeping duties.

God knows what CODA is doing while charging.. conditioning the batteries, balancing them, pre-cooling the car etc. MPGe is mostly a useless number.. the important one in a BEV is the range you get out of the battery.. and that is very disappointing..

 

[GRA]

EPA mileage figures are in for the Coda. I imagine that the Coda execs must be chagrined by the very low 73 MPGe as compared with LEAF's 99 and Ford's 105 MPGe. Especially surprising because the Coda uses a 6.6 kW on board charger, which should give them an efficiency advantage over the LEAF. They're accentuating the positive, though, that their 88 mile range is the largest EPA range figure for the recent crop of EVs, excluding Tesla's.

I'm assuming that this is for the 31 kWh pack, as the original 34 kWh option seems not to be offered at this time.

Let's see, if we assume that 88% of the pack capacity is used, if a LEAF with a 24 kWh pack can go 73 EPA miles, a Coda with a 31 kWh pack should be able to go 94 EPA miles if it were as efficient as a LEAF. Lots of assumptions there, of course, and lots to be learned about the Coda's performance as the next few months unfold.

http://green.autoblog.com/2012/03/08/coda-get-official-epa-nubmers-73-mpge-with-an-88-mile-range/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The number Coda's been claiming for over a year was 36kWh 'officially' (and 39 kWh unofficially), not 34 kWh. Moot for the moment, but the EPA range and MPGe are disappointing. We'll have to see how they do in the real world as soon as someone like Tony gets their hands on one. I plan to rent one for a day or two as soon as one's available locally, just to try it out even though I know it won't meet my minimum range requirement.

 

[Randy]

My guess is the LEAF charger is really closer to 3.45kW and the other 10% is heat, noise and other dissipating effects to efficiency. Ingineer? Any thoughts?

I think part of the difference between the 3.7kW drawn from the wall and the 3.3kW delivered to the battery charger is taken up by the cooling system on-board. There is a pump, a fan or two, etc. So it's not all efficiencies or heat losses....

 

[Boomer23]

EPA mileage figures are in for the Coda. I imagine that the Coda execs must be chagrined by the very low 73 MPGe as compared with LEAF's 99 and Ford's 105 MPGe. Especially surprising because the Coda uses a 6.6 kW on board charger, which should give them an efficiency advantage over the LEAF. They're accentuating the positive, though, that their 88 mile range is the largest EPA range figure for the recent crop of EVs, excluding Tesla's.

I'm assuming that this is for the 31 kWh pack, as the original 34 kWh option seems not to be offered at this time.

Let's see, if we assume that 88% of the pack capacity is used, if a LEAF with a 24 kWh pack can go 73 EPA miles, a Coda with a 31 kWh pack should be able to go 94 EPA miles if it were as efficient as a LEAF. Lots of assumptions there, of course, and lots to be learned about the Coda's performance as the next few months unfold.

http://green.autoblog.com/2012/03/08/coda-get-official-epa-nubmers-73-mpge-with-an-88-mile-range/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The number Coda's been claiming for over a year was 36kWh 'officially' (and 39 kWh unofficially), not 34 kWh. Moot for the moment, but the EPA range and MPGe are disappointing. We'll have to see how they do in the real world as soon as someone like Tony gets their hands on one. I plan to rent one for a day or two as soon as one's available locally, just to try it out even though I know it won't meet my minimum range requirement.

I stand corrected, thanks.

 

[GRA]

First production car supposed to roll off the assembly line today:

http://www.businessinsider.com/2012-coda-sedan-production-starts-88-mile-range-73-mpge-efficiency-2012-3" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;