PNW - Range Thread - South King County to ...

[Bullishpip]

So I'm a software engineer and bought a Leaf purely for logical and economic reasons :ugeek:.

I've been lurking around different forums and combing the interweb's searching for Leaf data to help me identify what I really can and cannot do with my Leaf. As any Leaf owner knows, the GOM is wilding inaccurate due to all the different variables which affect battery consumption. Nothing is better than real world experience to help quell range anxiety .

My thoughts are to share my experiences and routes to help other Leafers feel more comfortable getting out and about. So here we go, here are my most useful routes I've taken so far and some data around what it took to make the trip successful. As we take more trips I will add updates. Please feel free to add your own .

Route: Commute to work ~24 miles one way ~48 round trip: Maple Valley, WA to Bellevue, WA
Route taken: http://goo.gl/maps/Dx0zq" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Climate Control: ON
Charge locations: NONE
Battery used: ~8bars round trip

Route: Maple Valley to Leavenworth, WA - 262 miles round trip
Route taken: http://goo.gl/maps/0Fx55" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Climate Control: ON
Charge locations: Sultan=2, Skykomish=2, Leavenworth=1, Snoqualime=1
Battery used: ~53 bars
-- Maple Valley -> Sultan = 10
-- Sultan -> Skyhomish = 7
-- Skyhomish -> Leavenworth = 10 (We did the quick charge in Skyhomish and rolled into Leavenworth with 4 miles left on the GOM - range anxiety, OH YA... :? )
-- Leavenworth -> Skyhomish = 8 (going down hill)
-- Skyhomish -> Sultan = 6 (going down hill)
-- Sultan -> Snoqualime = 9
-- Snoqualime -> Maple Valley = ~3

 

[TonyWilliams]

Try these routes on the "LEAF Energy" app for Apple products, and let me know how it compares. Whatever you can do today, will be different with higher/lower temps, heater use, and years of ownership as the battery degrades.

 

[abasile]

...rolled into Leavenworth with 4 miles left on the GOM - range anxiety, OH YA...

We routinely get home with 3-4 miles left on the GOM. That's after doing a ~5000' mountain climb, though! (The GOM reads low after lots of hillclimbing.)

 

[Reddy]

....snip...Battery used: ~53 bars
-- Maple Valley -> Sultan = 10
-- Sultan -> Skyhomish = 7

7 bars from Sultan to Skykomish? It's only 27 mi. How fast were you going? :lol:
FYI, here's my experience over Highway 2: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=9946&p=226115#p226115

Reddy

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

wild range fluctuations are really part of the EV equation and no amount of equipment to monitor will fully address that issue. now, more monitoring will give you a better idea of where you will be when you have to plug in but that is it. to predict this in advance, you must have close contact with your weatherman for temperatures, rain, snow, etc. because they will all affect the distance you can travel.

 

[TonyWilliams]

wild range fluctuations are really part of the EV equation and no amount of equipment to monitor will fully address that issue. now, more monitoring will give you a better idea of where you will be when you have to plug in but that is it. to predict this in advance, you must have close contact with your weatherman for temperatures, rain, snow, etc. because they will all affect the distance you can travel.

I disagree. A mapping database with elevation (easy to integrate) and weather (our Infiniti already has weather) could do an exceptional job.

Not even that difficult, as the basic ingredients are already there.

 

[PracticingHuman]

wild range fluctuations are really part of the EV equation and no amount of equipment to monitor will fully address that issue. now, more monitoring will give you a better idea of where you will be when you have to plug in but that is it. to predict this in advance, you must have close contact with your weatherman for temperatures, rain, snow, etc. because they will all affect the distance you can travel.

I disagree. A mapping database with elevation (easy to integrate) and weather (our Infiniti already has weather) could do an exceptional job.

Not even that difficult, as the basic ingredients are already there.

I disagree with the disagreement. There are always variables that cannot be mapped or accounted for that affect mileage and efficiency, thus range. Weather may include winds, which certainly affect mileage. How fast is the wind blowing? What direction? Here in the Puget Sound area we ought to have 17 different words for rain, but our forecasts aren't so expansive with their types or rain.

Traffic is color coded by density on the WSDOT maps, but there's variances in that as well. Sometimes heavy traffic moves slow and steadily while other times it is a constant jerking of brakes in hurry-up-and-wait mode.

Granted this is a gradual change, but how much is one using headlights around this part of the country on November 30th vs December 30th? I will concede that an algorithm that takes into account location and sunrise/sunset times based on the date can be created but hopefully the point is made.

 

[TonyWilliams]

I disagree with the disagreement. There are always variables that cannot be mapped or accounted for that affect mileage and efficiency, thus range. .... hopefully the point is made.

Well then, I must disagree with your disagreement to my disagreement.

This argument that it "can't be done" seems just a bit out there to me. Sure, there are and will always be "variables". We sent a space ship to the moon with slide rules and computers the size of a warehouse. Thousands of airplanes lift off ever day and manage to get to their destinations with far greater variables of wind (like 200mph jet streams), temperature (a single trip can vary -50C to +50C), weather, etc. Heck, the LEAF even has traffic congestion in it.

So, your point isn't made. Right now, with the technology available (GPS elevation profiles, weather.. which includes wind, temp, pressure, forecast, rain, snow, sleet, etc) we can plan to an fairly reasonable degree of probability and accuracy.

Just saying there could be variables doesn't change that. If I drove 100 trips to Podunk, and 5 of those trips were delayed due whatever factor, does that negate the 95 trips I made that were within a few percentage points of the prediction?

Right now, you have neither the ability to manage the variables, nor the fixed issues with the GOM and fuel gauge. It would be grossly better for the general consumer to adopt this car if they could accurately predict their range. I'm VERY confident that they will understand that if Ninja Turtles block the highway one day, that unforeseen circumstance won't be too big an indictment on the original range prediction.

If, however, they drive up a hill and the GOM says 10 miles range, and they have 50 miles to go.... eh, not so good.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

let me clarify my much disputed statement. I said it would be difficult to predict before the trip was started how far you could drive. traffic weather and so on a simply too difficult to predict.

 

[HairyCairy]

Route: Commute To Work
Route Taken: http://mapq.st/PfZ7Bk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Climate Control On: Bypassed CCM, fan only
Charge locations: A least ten, not needed yet...
Battery Used: 3 bars on the way to work, 27.5 miles...Seven on the Way home,27.5 miles...speed limit the whole way. 55 miles round trip, usually arrive with two bar's left, the red ones, and twenty miles on GOM.

 

[Bullishpip]

Thanks HairyCairy. Your route and example is a good example of the battery used to get up the I90 hill from Issaquah to Snoqualime, this data is exactly what I'm looking for .

I agree with the notion that if enough data is collected around Leaf battery consumption one could reasonably predict Leaf battery consumption for a given route.