Summary of EVSE options

[redLEAF]

Was deciding where to post this and thought as it discussed EVSE options should go here ... it also features one of our own experts on EVSE conversions of the OEM charger that comes with EV's:

http://www.autoweek.com/article/201...zapping_your_wallet&utm_campaign=awdailydrive

What again makes this interesting is what Nissan and AV were initially promoting (the $2K+ home charger install) and what many of us have found ... AW gets a lot of exposure so the 'secret' is out!

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Was deciding where to post this and thought as it discussed EVSE options should go here ... it also features one of our own experts on EVSE conversions of the OEM charger that comes with EV's:

http://www.autoweek.com/article/201...zapping_your_wallet&utm_campaign=awdailydrive

What again makes this interesting is what Nissan and AV were initially promoting (the $2K+ home charger install) and what many of us have found ... AW gets a lot of exposure so the 'secret' is out!

Even John Gault from Wayne State University agrees, propelled by his certainty in his rejection of future technologies.

 

[mkjayakumar]

So I had this appointment from Home Depot installation service technician today to inspect my garage and tell me how much would it cost to get a 220V plug installed. Two guys from "Jeffreys Electircals" showed up and it was immediately apparent that they have never installed anything specifically for EVSEs. He claimed no knowledge of what an EVSE is, and told me that he has come here to tell me what it would cost to get 240V plug installed. He wanted to see my 'Charger' but I don't have any at this time, and so I showed him the EVSEupgrade.com website to give an idea.

I do have a electrical panel in my garage, but apparently all 240V breakers have been utilized and there is no more space to add one more, and that means according to him adding a new 160A panel right to it, and then pull a wire and install a NEMA L6-20 plug. So here is his estimate:

- around $1600 to get a new panel installed
- $400 to get the wire across and install the plug

Altogether $2000+ just to get to the plug and then you add another $400+ to get the Nissan EVSE upgraded..this comes to close to $2500 project. Hmm.. not sure I want to spend that much given that my L1 charger does a fabulous job of charging overnight for the driving I do today. If this is how much this is going to cost, I will stick to L1 charging and use my ICE car for occasions that would need me to drive more than what my Leaf can do in a day, which hopefully is no more than one or two times a month.

 

[mkjayakumar]

Oh and another thing.. this guy that HD sent over had a total air of arrogance and an attitude, just getting annoyed when I asked him some questions, which perhaps to him is dumb, but that shouldn't matter. I am planning to send a written complaint to HD. He totally pissed me off..

 

[TomT]

You might be able to replace one with two half breakers. That's what we did in my sub panel...

I do have a electrical panel in my garage, but apparently all 240V breakers have been utilized and there is no more space to add one more, and that means according to him adding a new 160A panel right to it, and then pull a wire and install a NEMA L6-20 plug.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

You might be able to replace one with two half breakers. That's what we did in my sub panel...

I do have a electrical panel in my garage, but apparently all 240V breakers have been utilized and there is no more space to add one more, and that means according to him adding a new 160A panel right to it, and then pull a wire and install a NEMA L6-20 plug.

What TomT said. Can you post a picture of your service panel here? It sounds like you are being sold a bill of goods and need to find a different electrician.

 

[Deleted member 3147]

You might be able to replace one with two half breakers. That's what we did in my sub panel...

I do have a electrical panel in my garage, but apparently all 240V breakers have been utilized and there is no more space to add one more, and that means according to him adding a new 160A panel right to it, and then pull a wire and install a NEMA L6-20 plug.

What TomT said. Can you post a picture of your service panel here? It sounds like you are being sold a bill of goods and need to find a different electrician.

Agreed. Also, mkjayakumar, how old is your panel (or house)? Probably anyhing 20 years old or newer can take quad-breakers (2 240-volt-breakers in the space of one).

Also, where are you located? Someone here may be able to recommend a reputable electrician to give you a second opinion.

 

[Nekota]

I had a 40amp breaker installed next to the 125amp house breaker on the meter box so there is no sub panel required.

 

[planet4ever]

I had a 40amp breaker installed next to the 125amp house breaker on the meter box so there is no sub panel required.

Yes, that can simplify things for folks like you and me who have a main breaker at the meter rather than in the breaker box. But I think that is mostly older homes, and even then you have to calculate whether the load of the new breaker added to that of the existing box exceeds the main breaker capacity. (Well, not "added", exactly; it's a load calculation, not a simple addition.)

In my case it worked beautifully, because the meter was located almost exactly where I wanted my EVSE.

Ray

 

[mkjayakumar]

Thanks gentlemen. I will post a picture of the panel once the day brightens up here, perhaps tomorrow. Its been raining heavily since yesterday evening and expected to rain the whole day here. This rain is loooong over due.

The house is 12 years old. When I asked him if there is someway we can leverage or modify the breakers in the existing panel to accomodate one more, that prick rolled his eyes and almost yelled at me, "Do you want me to lose my license?".

I live in Plano, TX. Suggestion are welcome for good honest electricians in the North Dallas area. I am in no hurry, as this 120v wire that comes with the car, takes care of me very well for now.

 

[garygTx]

I'm in Garland and it cost me $240 with Milestone Electric to get a new 240V outlet off the main panel installed and wired. I had room for the new breaker in the panel, and no sub panel.

 

[ksnogas2112]

I don't have everything yet so this is 'what i was told'.... The Nissan dealer in town said that they have a preferred dealer they are working with that will provide the unit and installation for $1295 <edit...unit only, installation extra>. House inspection by them is a week from Monday, it seems reasonable since I've found the devices between 800-1000. Just have to see what happens. The city is quite anal about inspections as I found when I got a new a/c last fall.

So just got email from dealer, the installation company is LillyPadEV and it appears they likely install Couloumb chargers.


Another edit...cancelled the Monday (today) appointment with Aerovironmental. Waiting on quote from LillyPad EV from Friday for Schneider evse. Next Sat. have local maintenance company (AB MAY) out for quote plus Schneider ($800 Home Depot).

Updates when available.


Update....bought Schneider EVSE and love it. $250 install by local electrician for the school who was looking to pick up a little extra cash plus the mini circuit breakers for the panel. 2 pair. 4 months in and golden.

 

[planet4ever]

I don't have everything yet so this is 'what i was told'.... The Nissan dealer in town said that they have a preferred dealer they are working with that will provide the unit and installation for $1295.

This is a new twist, if so, since in the past the dealer had nothing to do with it, and Nissan NA was pushing AeroVironment. Do you know which EVSE they would install? And are they charging an inspection fee? In the past we had to pay $100, and the only way to get it back was to accept their outrageous quote.

Ray

 

[davewill]

I don't have everything yet so this is 'what i was told'.... The Nissan dealer in town said that they have a preferred dealer they are working with that will provide the unit and installation for $1295. ...

Sounds like a smart idea by the dealer...that way they can pocket a referral fee. Now that the cars are being sold off the lot, they need to be the conduit for EVSE installs. The only caveat I see is that I'm fairly certain that the quoted price is simply a floor for the actual price. There's too much variation in the amount of work to be done at different residences.

 

[smkettner]

Leviton Evr-Green 320 now available.
List is $1,495 for 25' cord and $1,395 for an 18' cord. Only NEMA 6-50 plug in available. No J-plug holster.
I think I like the blue 160 better.

http://www.leviton.com/OA_HTML/SectionDisplay.jsp?section=37741&minisite=10251

 

[smkettner]

Siemens Versicharge 30A Black Bottom Fed Electric Vehicle Charger
http://www.homedepot.com/Tools-Hard...splay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&storeId=10051
http://www.sea.siemens.com/us/Produ...roduct/Pages/VersiCharge.aspx?stc=usibt600037
Price $999 at home Depot. 30a & 70a models available.
30a model can be dialed down for circuits less than 40 amps. 7.2 to 1.8 kW
Nice holster. Currently sold out or not yet available.
Cord length not listed.

 

[SalisburySam]

I have the AeroVironment L2 charging station, ordered and installed as part of the Nissan LEAF reservation system. While it does charge my LEAF most of the time, there are some issues:
1- just ungodly expensive IMO for the wiring work, unit, etc. Total was just north of $4k. In our area, a permit and concomitant inspection are required.
2- there were no extra breakers on my panel so AV added a dedicated 40-amp circuit to a new breakout box outside by my SmartMeter. The power company confirmed my meter did not need an upgrade to support the additional power.
3- AV asked me if I wanted a shut-off breaker next to the charging station for convenience. I said yes and am very glad I did. See below.
4- I had the option of a 15- or 25-foot charging cable; I chose the shorter one as the station is close to where the front of my LEAF is parked. There might be value in the longer cable if you plan to charge outside your garage for whatever reason (more than one EV?). The cables are not interchangeable...they are hardwired into the station and are ordered as two different units.
5- the AV is a 30-amp unit, helpful for when I can afford that Tesla.
6- there is a red trouble light on the station front panel and it comes on during or after a charge about once a week, sometimes more often. AV tells me this is a safety feature of the device that recognizes a problem of some sort with the power coming into the unit. The ONLY way to reset this light is to cut power to the unit, hence my joy at having a circuit breaker next to the station. Power should be cut for enough time for all the internal capacitors to discharge, a few hours according to AV.

Downside: these trouble lights halt the charging function and I have awakened to an uncharged LEAF on several occasions. Although we do have the occasional power outage in Central Ohio, and more frequent power blips, none of the other electrical equipment with electronics in my home is bothered at all. After 8 months of this I am trying to get AV to replace the charging station but I've been put off for three weeks now due to "lack of technician availability."

Would I get this unit again? No. It has proven to be too annoying, expensive, and I have lost faith that I'll have a charged car in the a.m.
What would I do instead? Have a local electrician run and test the wiring, and add the Lowe's or Home Depot charging stations myself. Or at least I think I'll do that when that Tesla comes in.

 

[Nekota]

I have the AeroVironment L2 charging station, ordered and installed as part of the Nissan LEAF reservation system. While it does charge my LEAF most of the time, there are some issues:
1- just ungodly expensive IMO for the wiring work, unit, etc. Total was just north of $4k. In our area, a permit and concomitant inspection are required.
2- there were no extra breakers on my panel so AV added a dedicated 40-amp circuit to a new breakout box outside by my SmartMeter. The power company confirmed my meter did not need an upgrade to support the additional power.
3- AV asked me if I wanted a shut-off breaker next to the charging station for convenience. I said yes and am very glad I did. See below.
4- I had the option of a 15- or 25-foot charging cable; I chose the shorter one as the station is close to where the front of my LEAF is parked. There might be value in the longer cable if you plan to charge outside your garage for whatever reason (more than one EV?). The cables are not interchangeable...they are hardwired into the station and are ordered as two different units.
5- the AV is a 30-amp unit, helpful for when I can afford that Tesla.
6- there is a red trouble light on the station front panel and it comes on during or after a charge about once a week, sometimes more often. AV tells me this is a safety feature of the device that recognizes a problem of some sort with the power coming into the unit. The ONLY way to reset this light is to cut power to the unit, hence my joy at having a circuit breaker next to the station. Power should be cut for enough time for all the internal capacitors to discharge, a few hours according to AV.

Downside: these trouble lights halt the charging function and I have awakened to an uncharged LEAF on several occasions. Although we do have the occasional power outage in Central Ohio, and more frequent power blips, none of the other electrical equipment with electronics in my home is bothered at all. After 8 months of this I am trying to get AV to replace the charging station but I've been put off for three weeks now due to "lack of technician availability."

Would I get this unit again? No. It has proven to be too annoying, expensive, and I have lost faith that I'll have a charged car in the a.m.
What would I do instead? Have a local electrician run and test the wiring, and add the Lowe's or Home Depot charging stations myself. Or at least I think I'll do that when that Tesla comes in.

I also have the AV unit but have had no problems with it in the past 18 months. I used the 'STOP' button to stop a charge today and had to clear the cobwebs out of the way since I haven't used any of the buttons on the AV for more than a year. Did AV say what sort of power conditions cause the unit to red light? I thought the red light was for a GFCI condition for 'out going power' and maybe your unit requires less fault current and is tripping on noise? Does the AV ever 'red light' when it's not in use and not connected to the car? I notice you said 'during and after charging' and was not sure about what you mean by after charging.

 

[srl99]

20 foot cord: http://w3.usa.siemens.com/powerdistribution/us/en/product-portfolio/electricvehicle/versicharge/Pages/versicharge.aspx?tabcardname=Technical%20Data" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This model also has a delay timer for the start of charging.

Siemens Versicharge 30A Black Bottom Fed Electric Vehicle Charger
http://www.homedepot.com/Tools-Hard...splay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&storeId=10051
http://www.sea.siemens.com/us/Produ...roduct/Pages/VersiCharge.aspx?stc=usibt600037
Price $999 at home Depot. 30a & 70a models available.
30a model can be dialed down for circuits less than 40 amps. 7.2 to 1.8 kW
Nice holster. Currently sold out or not yet available.
Cord length not listed.

 

[SalisburySam]

Hello Nekota. Thanks for responding, and I'm glad to hear you've had no problems with your charging station. Maybe the spider webs protect it; my webs really haven't taken hold yet, and may not with all the attention the unit is getting.

AV says several things may cause the red light to illuminate. It depends on whether the illuminated light is steady, flashing slowly, or flashing rapidly. I don't know what all the conditions are but I had a slowly flashing light that AV said was due to some electric issue with the power coming into the charging station. No impact on whether my car was charging or even connected. I've also had steady red lights come on, no idea what that means. In any case, the remedy is to cut power to the unit for awhile. The red light is NOT illuminated when I reconnect power, regardless again of whether the car is plugged in or not.

By "...after charging" I mean when the timed charging cycle is compete but the car is still connected to the charging station. I've set my charging timer to FINISH its 80% charge at 5:30am, so it will be connected for a couple of hours not charging before I get to in the morning. Sorry for the confusion.

My Nissan dealer offers a complementary 1,000-mile check-up. At that time, I mentioned the charging station issue but they said the car itself is exhibiting no errors or problems. Just turned 3,000 miles this past weekend.