cwerdna
Well-known member
Thanks to a post from chevybolt.org, TIL that Solterra reservations begin tomorrow (https://www.solterraforum.com/threads/2023-subaru-solterra-reservations-start-tomorrow.192/), Feb 8th.
OldManCan said:Any new vehicle released with 200 ish mile range with price tags above $35K - $40K will be a hard sell IMHO. Wonder if the battery pack has active TMS in this case. Could not find much on this as of now. Ex-Outback user and I do like Subaru as a car maker but not enticing enough for me.
gcrouse said:I haven't gotten much sleep lately so maybe I'm reading this wrong - but if I'm not mistaken that's most of the models on the market for EVs is $35k and up for 200ish to 350ish mile range.
gcrouse said:The Subaru model will still have the tax credits and Toyota is danger close to phase out so it seems like the only reason to buy the Toyota model over the Subaru is if Subaru doesn't have any dealers in the area.
I'm a bit skeptical on that price since everything else on the market seems to be in the $39-42k MSRP rate for the bottom trims.
gcrouse said:Car and Driver seems to think approx $37k for the soltera. https://www.caranddriver.com/subaru/solterra
I'm a bit skeptical on that price since everything else on the market seems to be in the $39-42k MSRP rate for the bottom trims.
the Solterra makes for a useful travel companion with up to 30 cubic feet of cargo space withthe rear seats folded flat.
GRA said:gcrouse said:Car and Driver seems to think approx $37k for the soltera. https://www.caranddriver.com/subaru/solterra
I'm a bit skeptical on that price since everything else on the market seems to be in the $39-42k MSRP rate for the bottom trims.
The following from the C&D article had better be a typo:the Solterra makes for a useful travel companion with up to 30 cubic feet of cargo space withthe rear seats folded flat.
The trend towards ever longer wheelbases with ever lower seats-up cargo volumes is seemingly unstoppable, as apparently most people have a need to drive around with their cars full of NBA players most of the time, but this compact CUV is considerably longer than my now 19-y.o. sub-compact Forester. which has 32.0 cu. ft. of cargo volume rear seats-UP, and 64.1 cu. ft. seats-DOWN, i.e. folded flat. If the C&D number is accurate, that's beyond pathetic. These are supposed to be CUVs, for people who need/want flexible Utility, fa' chrissake! :roll: Anything under 50 cu. ft. seats-down would be totally unacceptable for anyone who actually needs to carry stuff, and it should be 60+ in a car of this size.
It does not make sense to have such a wide range as if it is one market segment.gcrouse said:for 200ish to 350ish mile range.
SageBrush said:It does not make sense to have such a wide range as if it is one market segment.gcrouse said:for 200ish to 350ish mile range.
300+ is a full ICE replacement.
Low 200 is an overweight suburban commuter.
Toyota to provide bZ4X customers with DC fast charger access through EVgo
. . . Customers who purchase or lease a new 2023 Toyota bZ4X will get one year of unlimited complimentary charging at all EVgo-owned and operated public charging stations nationwide.
Customers will be able to use the Toyota App on their mobile device to sign up for this offer, locate EVgo stations and initiate complimentary charging for their new bZ4X.
The bZ4X will have a manufacturer-estimated range of up to 250 miles for XLE front-wheel drive models, with a 355V, 71.4 kWh battery pack. . . .
gcrouse said:SageBrush said:It does not make sense to have such a wide range as if it is one market segment.gcrouse said:for 200ish to 350ish mile range.
300+ is a full ICE replacement.
Low 200 is an overweight suburban commuter.
EVs represent less than 4% of all autos sold in the US. EVs are for all intents and purposes - one market segment entirely composed of early adopters at this point.
If we are talking ICE replacement for majority of Americans - I've said elsewhere and the DoE has previously concurred - 280 miles of range and a payback period of 5 years for the difference in cost between an EV and ICE vehicle are the minimum metrics needed.
danrjones said:I think it needs to be even more than that. And it depends on where you live and what type of vehicle it is, and what you do.
As an example, I went skiing with my son in Mammoth a week back on a Friday. We left my house around 4:30 and got to the resort around 7:30, in order to make sure we had a good parking spot and had time to rent his gear. (Growing too fast to buy expensive gear for him)
It is 178 miles one way, plus about 7,000 feet NET elevation gain - probably more gross. There is no time to charge, unless I want to leave even earlier in the morning. There is no chargers at the ski resort parking lot. So I require enough range to get to the resort, ski, and then get back down to a charger on the way home. Even better, my current Outback didn't even require a refuel on the way home! It made it both ways easily. That would be ideal for a REAL EV replacement, that is, it truly matches a ICE. But at a minimum, it needs to get me to the resort and then back down in the evening to a charger.
danrjones said:So some examples using ABRP:
The Ioniq 5 RWD: it can MAYBE make it one way without charging, leaving my house at 100% and arriving at 7% but it would NOT make it back to a charger, thereby requiring at 20+ minute stop in Bishop on the way there and another stop in Coso Junction on the way home. So, this is a FAIL.
A tesla model 3: Arrives at the lodge with 25%, but requires a stop in Bishop on the way home. So it isn't a fail, but it isn't an ICE replacement either.
Both of these are run with limiting my speed to 72 mph, no wind, no battery degradation, and weather at 50f. Not realistic.
For second or third vehicles, both are great. But neither could have done the trip I wanted, how I wanted, and that means FOR ME they aren't true ICE replacements. If you look at the 10-80% range, I'd need 400 miles or more of REAL WOLRD highway range within that 10-80%. And I can think of even harsher scenarios... last summer I went camping in my truck, and I had to get out to eastern Nevada through the desert, with long stretches of nothing. Certainly no chargers.
And that's really the crux of the issue, it totally depends on who you are and what you do. If you live in a city, and never do big trips, almost any EV works. You live in the west, like to go places especially off grid, nothing yet works. Not if you truly looking in terms of requiring parity.
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