Upcoming 98 mile round trip with wife and baby -- insane??

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Thanks Ray for sharing your experience with us. I don't typically use AC so I was wondering if a higher temp., say over 70F, would increase the range noticeably. Seems 67F is quite low, but then again your wife may need the low temp. setting. Can you see the difference in energy consumption due to AC at 67F and a higher setting? I have never looked for this on the center display.

Look forward to your report on the return trip.
 
...I headed to a ChargePoint station in Pleasant Hill that I had planned on. It is not far off the freeway at the Monument exit, and only a block from what looked like a nice shopping area (though I had never been there) on Crescent Drive. The ChargePoint station was great (at Gregory and Trelany), in a free parking lot with an oversize sign saying EV only and the pavement painted bright green with bold ELECTRIC VEHICLE lettering...

Thanks for the report, Ray.

When I picked up my LEAF in Petaluma on 5/16, I found no public L2's in this area, I could use for my 250+ mile drive home.

I checked yesterday, and their are (at least) six now open within 10 miles of the 680/24 interchange. Unfortunately, details like access and time of operation are often not clear, and search sites like the one's below don't make the info easily accessible, and omit neccessary detail for planning trips.

http://www.recargo.com/search

http://openchargemap.org/

IMO, what LEAF and other J 1772/CHAdeMO BEV drivers need is an accurate and comprehensive listing of L2 and DC/L3 (when they get here) charge stations, including access, charges, etc. I'm surprised the business case for such a service hasn't attracted more attention, and better results-yet.
 
Yes, thanks for the report Ray.

The range reduction is partially due to the stop&go at such low (inefficient) speeds, but in large part due to the use of the A/C for the extended period of time such slow traffic forces you into :(

Comment about the ChargePoint station ... I might be mistaken, but I am fairly confident the 3.665 you saw "running" by was not kWh (energy) in 48 minutes, but the power draw in kW. I don't think the station displays a running total of the energy used, but a snapshot of the current power being supplied. Only logging into your ChargePoint account would tell you the duration of the session and the total kWh (energy) used.

Anyway ... thanks again.
 
linkim said:
Thanks Ray for sharing your experience with us. I don't typically use AC so I was wondering if a higher temp., say over 70F, would increase the range noticeably. Seems 67F is quite low, but then again your wife may need the low temp. setting. Can you see the difference in energy consumption due to AC at 67F and a higher setting? I have never looked for this on the center display.
Whenever we need AC, we set the temperature to 78F and aim the fan vents directly at our faces. This seems to be comfortable enough, and the effect on range seems to be fairly minimal since the compressor doesn't have to run all the time.
 
abasile said:
linkim said:
Thanks Ray for sharing your experience with us. I don't typically use AC so I was wondering if a higher temp., say over 70F, would increase the range noticeably. Seems 67F is quite low, but then again your wife may need the low temp. setting. Can you see the difference in energy consumption due to AC at 67F and a higher setting? I have never looked for this on the center display.
Whenever we need AC, we set the temperature to 78F and aim the fan vents directly at our faces. This seems to be comfortable enough, and the effect on range seems to be fairly minimal since the compressor doesn't have to run all the time.
I use 75F, and sometimes have to resort to as low as 72F with back seat passengers. Rear vents would be very helpful. In mild San Diego, this also results in minimal draw once the car cools down.
 
We are going camping this weekend to hoodsport but not much of a challenge. Its like 64 miles roundtrip and will have power available should we need a boost
 
Instead of turning on the car to cool it, you could have precooled via carwings with the car plugged in.
 
Ok camping out and plugged in. No way we can make it home without it especially since we forgot stuff and had to turn around and go back home making a 35 mile over 50. But at very EV friendly campground. We are in space 9 but plugged into space 10 since its vacant with manager's blessing. Saves us from having to share plug with the rv

**edit**
Loops forgot the plug. We are at Glen Ayr in hoodsport wa
 
davewill said:
abasile said:
linkim said:
I don't typically use AC so I was wondering if a higher temp., say over 70F, would increase the range noticeably.
Whenever we need AC, we set the temperature to 78F and aim the fan vents directly at our faces. This seems to be comfortable enough, and the effect on range seems to be fairly minimal since the compressor doesn't have to run all the time.
I use 75F, and sometimes have to resort to as low as 72F with back seat passengers. Rear vents would be very helpful. In mild San Diego, this also results in minimal draw once the car cools down.
Oops! Fat-fingered typo on the A/C. I had it set at 76, not 67.

Ray
 
I think some of you people need ceiling fans in your car if your driving with the AC on so low :)

I avg. 120 per charge in Phx where the avg. outside temp is 110 doing the summer..I keep the AC set @ 79 and I feel very comfortable with it set there...

I think most of you are just going through that learning curve and maybe after a few hundred miles of experimenting with the pedal you will find that planning a 100 mile trip should be no problem..
 
mark13 said:
I think some of you people need ceiling fans in your car if your driving with the AC on so low :)

I avg. 120 per charge in Phx where the avg. outside temp is 110 doing the summer..I keep the AC set @ 79 and I feel very comfortable with it set there...

I think most of you are just going through that learning curve and maybe after a few hundred miles of experimenting with the pedal you will find that planning a 100 mile trip should be no problem..
And how many miles have you actually driven on a full charge ? (No criticism intended.) Remember, the guess-o-meter's 120 (unfortunately) does not mean too much.
 
Interesting reading about the different trips. I've had my Leaf for a month and a half, although it sat idle for a week while we went on vacation. Just turned 2300 miles on it yesterday. I did my longest trip yesterday and am quite impressed with the car. My wife and I first drove from Glen Burnie to Westminster to check out a new charging station I had just heard about, a distance of about 40 miles. Of course we were running the air conditioner (set on 78) as the outside temp showed to be 107. (Official high was 106). We charged for around an hour and a half, maybe a bit longer. Did some shopping and grabbed some sodas. It was interesting watching people who had never seen a Leaf look over the car parked at one of what are usually empty charging stations (2 Level 2 stations there, the only ones in the county). More than a few took pictures.

From there, to a mall so my wife could do some shopping, then up and back down the highway as we missed a turn. Up to Hanover, PA for dinner, then back to Glen Burnie. I tried to keep the car between 50 and 55 most of the time. I have found that with going up and down hills renders the guessometer next to useless. I pay more attention to the bars. Not having much experience pushing the Leaf, I started getting worried when the guessometer showed 22 miles when I was still about 30 miles from home. However, between knowing that it was primarily downhill to Glen Burnie, and that I would have several miles after it hit zero, I decided to chance it and not look for a charger. I think it stayed on 22 miles for 5 or 6 miles before it started down again. I was only about 5 miles from home when the low battery light came on, and made it home with 6 miles still showing on the guessometer. Total miles covered was about 120.

As my confidence grows and the weather cools, I might be tempted to try a 100 mile round trip without charging (I have a standard 100 mile round trip I do occasionally, but stop to charge for an hour or so along the way), but it would be only an experiment. I recommend for anything over about 70 miles or so, plan in a charging stop so you can relax and not have to worry about babying the car.
 
planet4ever said:
Returning home may be another challenge, but I have decided to do it midday Saturday to try to avoid traffic jams. I just have this sneaking, but unconfirmed, suspicion that 10 mph may be worse on mileage than 60 mph, especially in a traffic jam where you are really forced to change speeds a lot.
Sigh. No traffic jams, no better. I think I've found my personal range anxiety point. After this the 90 mile trip to see our granddaughter and great-grandkids will probably be in our Prius. I had a 1-2 punch of stress today.

Stress 1: I set off from Antioch with the battery fully charged (overnight at Antioch Nissan), traveling at 55 on the freeway, occasional slight traffic slowdowns below that but nothing major. And the bars started disappearing like clockwork -- one every five miles! The m/kWh meter never got above 3.9. I have no idea why; the A/C was at 76, the lights weren't on, the windows were closed, there were no major hills and a net gain of only about 300 feet in elevation. But indeed I dropped to six bars at 30.5 miles into the trip. Sure, there's a buffer below the bottom bar, but half the bars were gone and I'd only gone about a third of the distance. To make things worse, the only place I knew to charge between Walnut Creek and San Jose was Premier Nissan of Fremont, and I hadn't read good things about them on this board.

Fortunately the last six bars seemed to hang on much better, about seven miles per bar. Even the Sunol grade (which I took at 35 behind a truck) didn't seem to hurt me much. But it wasn't enough to make up for the first thirty miles, and I was down to one bar before I took the flyover from 680 to 101 in San Jose, with nearly 25 miles left to go. Bowing to expediency I took the Capitol Expressway exit and headed for Premier Nissan of San Jose. I got the "Low Battery" warning about three miles before I arrived at the dealership. Fortunately again, they had an AV station that was not in use, and were happy to let me use it.

I pulled in next to an identical LEAF that their tech was going over with a new owner. I plugged in, overrode my (midnight start) timer, and made sure the car was actually charging. Then my wife and I went in to the customer waiting area to ... er ... wait. There really wasn't anything else we could do, other than look at cars, and we weren't interested in doing that. I knew my wife was an unhappy camper at this point, so I tried to figure how long we would need to charge. I had asked the nav unit how far we were from home, and it said 19 miles. Based on "sage" advise I have been dispensing on this board, I thought I should be able to get at least 12 miles after the Low Battery warning, which meant I still had at least nine miles of juice rather than the four that the guessometer was flashing. Therefore I would need to pick up enough charge to go ten additional miles, and 45 minutes should about do it.

45 minutes later my co-pilot was chomping at the bit, so I unplugged and we took off. I was a bit surprised that there was still only one bar, but decided that was due to the "hysteresis" that has been discussed. What I didn't do was think that through very well, or check that the car was still charging before I unplugged.

Stress 2: Not two miles from the dealer, we heard the "Low Battery" warning again. WHAT?? I only picked up five miles of electricity in three quarters of an hour? And I now had 17 miles to go? I explained to my wife that a fellow LEAF owner I knew through the internet had offered to let us charge at his place, but she put her foot down. We were not going to a stranger's house and sit there for another hour. So I gulped, and slowed down. I took "old 101" (Monterey Road) from San Jose to Morgan Hill, and held my speed to 45. The last seven miles were running on "Very Low Battery", but we didn't go into turtle mode.

Yes, I think I'll take the Prius next time.

Ray
 
Great story, Ray, thanks for sharing.

I admire your determination, and I think you'll succeed in getting your wife to like that "silly little car of yours", the way you're tying in "perks" like shopping to your charging stops. :)

Well done, sir! :)
-Brad
 
planet4ever said:
What I didn't do was think that through very well, or check that the car was still charging before I unplugged.

Thanks Ray for the great description of your trip and the anxiety you (or maybe your wife) experienced.

Is there any reason to think that the car was not charging when you unplugged? Is it because of the low SOC (i.e., 1 bar visible) or you had less SOC than assumed when charging started?

My longest trip has been to to SF from the South Bay (about 45 mi one way), but I have a place for 120 V fill up in the city. I think your experience tell me that my trusty old Prius is for longer trips, at least until there is a build out of EV charging stations.

My LEAF driving experience so far is rather uneventful, and to have peace in the family, I will keep it that way.

Thanks Ray,

Kim
 
Trying to make a 90 mile trip at speeds faster than 55pmh ... that was your big mistake. Observing a strict 50mph speed limit would have gotten you there stress free (assuming you don't anger other traffic by going so slow). You know that at slower speeds you can go farther. So, try to make it a leisurely trip where you can look out the windows and see things along the way. Use less traveled roads whenever possible as long as they don't add much to the distance. Check the range chart at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=4295 Of course, other traffic might not want to go slower than 70mph and there might be no feasible alternate routes - in that case, better pick the Prius.
 
planet4ever said:
And I now had 17 miles to go (from Battery Low). The last seven miles were running on "Very Low Battery", but we didn't go into turtle mode.


Interesting data. I'm sure you have an idea how close you came to walking (and really upsetting the spouse unit). Based on my data, you were a prime candidate:

Data Event #----A-----B-----C-----D---YOU!!!
BatteryLow----11.0---8.6---13.6---6.7---10
VeryLow-------6.7---5.5----8.4---5.2----7
-----------------------------------------
Total to Turtle-17.7--14.1--22.0---11.9---17
-----------------------------------------
VeryLow/Low--61%---64%--62%----77%---70%

Data event C above was an extreme hyper-mile event (lots of coasting in neutral) and driving at 38-45 mph. Consider that the ABSOLUTE max.
 
i dont experiment with range with my wife in the car.
that is just nuts, from my point of view.
I have gotten her used to going about 70 miles -- all freeway -- without anxiety.
On those trips, we get home with 20ish miles left, and she has no worries currently. (100% charge)
This weekend I invited her with me on a 5-mile roundtrip from home to pick up take out food, when I figured it might go into LOW BATTERY mode, so she could experience it. That went well.
I think there are wise ways to bring the spouse along on your EV adventure. With a second car to drive, I don't feature having her sit around a car dealer show room for an hour waiting for a charge, as part of the dutiful-wife, EV-break-in process.
(I burnt the toast honey but it is still edible, and ruined your silk shirt by ironing it on the wrong setting. I don't do that either.)
How long have you been married, and do you plan on making it to your 2nd :lol: anniversary?
 
mark13 said:
I think some of you people need ceiling fans in your car if your driving with the AC on so low :)

I avg. 120 per charge in Phx where the avg. outside temp is 110 doing the summer..I keep the AC set @ 79 and I feel very comfortable with it set there...
Humidity levels play a large difference in how high you can set the AC and still feel comfortable. Phoenix where the humidity is low - 20-30% - high 70s is probably OK. Out here near the coast where the humidity is usually 70%+ you need to run the temperature a lot lower to feel comfortable.
 
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