TaylorSFGuy
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:32 pm
Delivery Date: 13 May 2011
Leaf Number: 1561
Location: Kent, Washington

Why is a high braking regeneration number a positive?

Wed May 18, 2011 12:47 pm

I presume this relates to braking only and not downhill initeria driven regeneration. If that is correct, to me having a lower braking number means you have successfully avoided using the brakes by letting the ECO mode do what it does when you let off. Having a high number means you have run up to a stop light and slammed on the brakes doesn't it? Perhaps my whole understanding of what this signifies is incorrect. I have been trying to avoid using the brakes and end up way down in the rankings.
Mileage as of May 19, 2016 is 150,000 - 147 GID at 100%

Ordered Jan. 21, 2011 Delivered May 13, 2011

Number of months with highest mileage on Carwings - 23

First LEAF to 100,000 Miles in USA if not worldwide
First non commercial LEAF to 150,000 Miles

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davewill
Posts: 5083
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:04 pm
Location: San Diego, CA, US

Re: Why is a high braking regeneration number a positive?

Wed May 18, 2011 12:51 pm

TaylorSFGuy wrote:I presume this relates to braking only and not downhill initeria driven regeneration. If that is correct, to me having a lower braking number means you have successfully avoided using the brakes by letting the ECO mode do what it does when you let off. Having a high number means you have run up to a stop light and slammed on the brakes doesn't it? Perhaps my whole understanding of what this signifies is incorrect. I have been trying to avoid using the brakes and end up way down in the rankings.
You're right, I think, although braking lightly to avoid using friction braking will maximize the regen much more than "slamming on the brakes". I'd look at the mpk numbers rather than the trees to determine whether you're doing a good job. Trying to "win" the rankings is probably pointless.
2014 Rav4 EV, Blizzard Pearl White
2011 LEAF SL w/QC, Blue Ocean, returned at end of lease

TaylorSFGuy
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:32 pm
Delivery Date: 13 May 2011
Leaf Number: 1561
Location: Kent, Washington

Re: Why is a high braking regeneration number a positive?

Wed May 18, 2011 1:10 pm

I am running 130+ miles and 5+ plus trees a day. You are right that most drivers probably avoid slamming on brakes but the harder you push the more regeneration dots are displayed. i'm still learning how to use the car and am struggling to get my M/kwh average above 5. It is slowly creeping up but can't comprehend how one would drive accomplishing 7 or higher average if driving on the freeway. Maybe these people just run around town. I'm not trying to win the rankings but expect to be near the top of US drivers in a number of areas and I am stumped by this KPI. I just can't figure out how why I want to have a net consumption of energy while braking (assumes it takes more to stop the car than it regenerates) when it can be used by the motor system to reduce its consumption.
Mileage as of May 19, 2016 is 150,000 - 147 GID at 100%

Ordered Jan. 21, 2011 Delivered May 13, 2011

Number of months with highest mileage on Carwings - 23

First LEAF to 100,000 Miles in USA if not worldwide
First non commercial LEAF to 150,000 Miles

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johnr
Posts: 884
Joined: Sun May 02, 2010 2:08 pm
Delivery Date: 11 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2151
Location: Exeter, CA

Re: Why is a high braking regeneration number a positive?

Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:58 am

Coasting to a stop will lower the regen number, but slamming on the brakes will also lower the regen number - because at that point you have exceeded the regen capacity and are relying on the friction brakes to contribute stopping power. Ideally for maximum efficiency you would take foot off the pedal and coast for a ways under ECO mode (to burn off most of your speed while regenerating) then lightly apply brake pedal to stop. If the power meter goes most of the way to the left without bottoming out you're doing good. HTH ;)
My trip to Mineral King and the value of regen

Charging stations, electrical adapters, and portable CHAdeMO quick chargers

2011 upgrade: Fossil < Leaf. 2014 upgrade: Leaf < imiev. 2017 upgrade: imiev < tesla. Done upgrading.

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TomT
Posts: 10645
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Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: California, now Georgia
Contact: Website

Re: Why is a high braking regeneration number a positive?

Sun Jun 05, 2011 10:02 am

The whole Carwings thing is so silly and inaccurate that I not longer even look at it any more. After the first month, when the novelty wore off and I began to realize how flawed it was, it lost any interest for me.
Leaf SL 2011 to 2016, Volt Premier 2016 to 2019, and now:
2019 Model 3; LR, RWD, FSD, 19" Sport Wheels, silver/black; built 3/17/19, delivered 3/29/19.

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evnow
Moderator
Posts: 11480
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 11:41 am
Delivery Date: 25 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 303
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: Why is a high braking regeneration number a positive?

Sun Jun 05, 2011 10:15 am

TaylorSFGuy wrote:I am running 130+ miles and 5+ plus trees a day. You are right that most drivers probably avoid slamming on brakes but the harder you push the more regeneration dots are displayed. i'm still learning how to use the car and am struggling to get my M/kwh average above 5.
Is that 5 m/kwh on Leaf dash or in carwings ? Carwings is substantially higher (and wrong). Last month my average m/kwh on the dash was 4.6 - but in carwings it was 6.0.
1st Leaf : 2/28/2011 to 5/6/2013
2nd Leaf : 5/4/2013 to 3/21/2017
Volt : 3/25/2017 to 5/25/2018
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gbarry42
Posts: 888
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:48 pm
Delivery Date: 06 May 2011
Location: Moonlight Beach

Re: Why is a high braking regeneration number a positive?

Sun Jun 05, 2011 10:57 am

When I looked at Carwings' numbers, it was clear that some of those were simply unrealistic. This suggests there are ways to "game the system". I think it may do some of the ratings based on "a trip". So if you turn the car on, coast down a long hill, and turn the car off at the bottom, you just scored an incredible rating on that trip. That's a guess, but I suspect I'm not far off.

As for regenerative braking, in the real world, regen is regen. The drag you get when you take your foot off the pedal is the same thing you'd get if you didn't have that and instead, lightly applied the brakes. Either way, it slows the car down, and it does so by generating juice back into the battery. Regen is better than friction brakes, but it's not as good as not needing help to slow down in the first place. You can do that by not going too fast in the first place. Of course, on hills, you probably don't have a choice, unless you can avoid having to go up the hill in the first place.

Unfortunately, some of the games like the rankings, and the "trees", seem to encourage using regen. This could result in some non-ideal driving habits. But, hey, having a LEAF is just so much cooler than anything else, who cares how you drive it? :)
And there goes the first capacity bar! At 24,000 mi on 9/9/2013.
Second bar at 30,500 mi on 2/7/2015.

derkraut
Posts: 1519
Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2010 7:39 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Jun 2011
Leaf Number: 004248
Location: San Diego vicinity

Re: Why is a high braking regeneration number a positive?

Sun Jun 05, 2011 11:07 am

gbarry42 wrote:When I looked at Carwings' numbers, it was clear that some of those were simply unrealistic. This suggests there are ways to "game the system". I think it may do some of the ratings based on "a trip". So if you turn the car on, coast down a long hill, and turn the car off at the bottom, you just scored an incredible rating on that trip. That's a guess, but I suspect I'm not far off.

As for regenerative braking, in the real world, regen is regen. The drag you get when you take your foot off the pedal is the same thing you'd get if you didn't have that and instead, lightly applied the brakes. Either way, it slows the car down, and it does so by generating juice back into the battery. Regen is better than friction brakes, but it's not as good as not needing help to slow down in the first place. You can do that by not going too fast in the first place. Of course, on hills, you probably don't have a choice, unless you can avoid having to go up the hill in the first place.

Unfortunately, some of the games like the rankings, and the "trees", seem to encourage using regen. This could result in some non-ideal driving habits. But, hey, having a LEAF is just so much cooler than anything else, who cares how you drive it? :)
I'd bet that the guy following you on a 2-lane road, or trying to use his cruise control cares. :roll:
Derkraut
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