garygid
Well-known member
Table 1 says connect L2 according to NEC 625, which DOES (625.13) allow qualifying L2 to be plugin, indoors.
garygid said:Table 1 says connect L2 according to NEC 625, which DOES (625.13) allow qualifying L2 to be plugin, indoors.
garygid said:There is no L2 hardwire requirement in the J1772 ... that I can find.
Not in Table 1, page 9, or page 11 or 12.
Please, where do you think the hardwired requirement is?
I have a copy right here.
garygid said:Like I said, an appropriately designed Level 2 EVSE can be used plug-in indoors.
2.2 Safety is Foremost
Safety was and is the primary reason charging equipment and safety standards have progressed in the direction they have. Related to this is the issue of liability.
Some EV enthusiasts assert that existing plugs and receptacles, such as NEMA 14-50R or -30R, provide sufficient safety for an EV application. As far as we know, this claim is unsubstantiated by any independent testing. While RVs, clothes dryers, welders and so on use these receptacles, the duty cycle of these do not compare to that of EVs. With EVs, regular connection and disconnection of the vehicle to the charging equipment happens twice a day at a minimum (e.g., when leaving home in the morning and when returning in the evening). When public or workplace charging is used, this number is more.
Clothes dryers and welders on the other hand are typically plugged in when installed and are not unplugged until removed (e.g., once or twice over a span of years). Even portable welders are not moved with great daily frequencies. RVs on average are only temporarily used (e.g., during vacation periods each year). As such, they do not get plugged in and unplugged daily throughout the year.
California wants 35,000 EVs operating in California by 2003. This would equate to 25.6 million connections/disconnections per year. Potential for an accident to occur where someone inadvertently touches an energized plug that is partially inserted into a receptacle is greatly increased. Therefore, the connection method for EVs to the off-board equipment must be fool proof.
Level 1
Power Requirement: Dedicated branch circuit with NEMA 5-15R or 5-20R Receptacle.
Level 2
Power Requirement: Dedicated branch circuit hardwired to a permanently mounted
EVSE with the following specifications:
240VAC/Single Phase, 4-wire (2 Hot, GND, Neutral), 40Amp Breaker
Section 625.13 Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment.
Electric vehicle supply equipment rated at 125 volts, single phase, 15 or
20 amperes or part of a system identified and listed as suitable for the
purpose and meeting the requirements of 625.18, 625.19, and 625.29
shall be permitted to be cord-and-plug-connected. All other electric
vehicle supply equipment shall be permanently connected and fastened
in place.
Section 625.14 Rating:
Level 1. 125vac. This method, which allows broad access to charge an
EV, permits plugging into a common, grounded 125-volt electrical
receptacle (NEMA 5-15R or 5-20R) when cord-and-plug is approved.
Level 2. 240 VAC, 40 amp. electric vehicle supply equipment shall be
permanently connected and fastened in place.
LEAFer said:Why do you quote 625.14, when the green part talks about three sections, none of which are 625.14 ?
AndyH said:Because that was one of the NEC excerpts ETEC presented to Canadian regulators when showing why L2 was hardwired.
"Level 1" EV charging employs cord & plug connected portable EV supply equipment (EVSE) that can be transported with an EV. This equipment is used specifically for EV charging and shall be rated at 120 VAC and 15A, and shall be compatible with the most commonly available grounded electrical outlet (NEMA 5-15R).
"Level 2" EV charging employs permanently wired EVSE that is operated at a fixed location. This equipment is used specifically for EV charging and is rated at less than or equal to 240 VAC, less than or equal to 60A, and less than or equal to 14.4 kW.
"Level 3" EV charging employs permanently wired EVSE that is operated at a fixed location. This equipment is used specifically for EV charging and is rated at greater than 14.4 kW.
garygid said:Strange, my pdf copy of 625 on scanned pages from the 2008 NEC has a Rating section 625.14 ... but it does NOT contain the language quoted above. Level 2 is apparently limited to 32 amps, requiring at least a 40-amp breaker, but there is NO mention of hard-wired.
Level 2. This is the primary and preferred method of
EV charging at both private and public facilities. It requires
special equipment and connection to an electric power sup-
ply dedicated to EV charging. The voltage of this connection
is either 240 volts or 208 volts. The maximum load is 32
amperes (7.7 kVAat 240 volts or 6.7 kVA at 208 volts). The
minimum circuit and overcurrent rating for this connection is
40 amperes (32 X 1.25 = 40 amperes) .. Electric vehicles
are treated as continuous loads. See 625:21 for sizing over-
current protection devices.
garygid said:Strange, my pdf copy of 625 on scanned pages from the 2008 NEC has a Rating section 625.14 ... but it does NOT contain the language quoted above. Level 2 is apparently limited to 32 amps, requiring at least a 40-amp breaker, but there is NO mention of hard-wired.
Most of this section 625.14 is "highlighted", probably indicating a change from previous versions of the NEC.
Is it possible your quote comes from something other than the 2008 NEC?
625.14 Rating. Electric vehicle supply equipment shall have sufficient rating to supply the load served. For the purposes of this article, electric vehicle charging loads shall be considered to be continuous loads.
The last change of note deals with how EVSE is installed. Earlier code versions did not clearly reflect the specifications outlined in the IWC Record of Consensus items shown in Table 1. EVSE is intended to be permanently installed, meaning the equipment is permanently fastened to a wall or bollard, and the wiring is hardwired in a junction box or some similar fashion. Level 1 EVSE is permitted to be cord and plug connected as long as it has ground-fault protection. The 1999 NEC® language specifies all EVSE is to be permanently connected and fastened in place except equipment rated 125 volts, 15 or 20 amperes which can be cord and plug connected. [Per NEC 625.13]
All EVSE is fixed except for that that's specifically portable - and the ONLY type of device that's specified as portable is..you guessed it......shall not be required for portable cord-and-plug-connected electric vehicle supply equipment intended for connection to receptacle outlets rated at 125 volts, single phase, 15 and 20 amperes.
The higher voltage of Level 2 allows a much faster battery charge. Because of the higher voltage, Level 2 has a higher level of safety requirements than Level 1 under the National Electric Code (NEC), including the requirement that the connector and cord be hardwired to the control device and premises wiring...
LEAFer said:So how come the 80A (allowed in SAE J1772) is not mentioned ? Is it because NEC needs to catch up to J1772 ? (And in the process ... it will allow portable Level 2 up to 40amps ? )
Edit: Belay that "request". I just re-read Andy's USAF & gov't experience / "head hurts" post above :lol:
garygid said:Many "newer" documents, guidelines, etc. were apparently prepared from older standards, and, these various documents appear to be mostly "educational", even "guiding", but not the actual constraining "standards".
garygid said:The fact still remains that the 2008 NEC standards appear to allow sufficiently-featured 32-amp Level 2 to be plugin. But, states (like CA) are often behind on "adopting" new NEC versions, and CA frequently "changes" a few things in the adoption.
garygid said:Of course, after that, the local laws and building codes & practices may vary.
Finally, what gets final-inspection "approval" will often vary even from one inspector to another.
But, I think that we currently can have hope that a plug-in Level 2 EVSE is at least a possibility.
Who knows how or if we could build, sell, or use a 40, 50, or 80-amp Level 2 EVSE!
garygid said:Andy,
You do really good work finding things, but I am a bit (OK, a lot) lazy. Thanks for your continued support and dedication, Gary
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