Battery Replacement Program Details

[TRONZ]

Actually, I find it all very helpful that Nissan has offered everyone more options for getting the best use out of our LEAFs. This program is certainly an outline, fluid and will have a lot of different scenarios for people and situations but this is good news. We now have a number. Some may call it a perpetual payment but to others its a guarantee. Everyone is different. Some are primarily interested in range performance, others TCO and cost. The simple fact is Nissan has now opened up a lot of new choices for people and I like as many choices as I can get. I appreciate that people who always pay in cash for everything are having their ownership interests tested but Nissan has not shut the door on this point and will likely sell packs when the competition warrents it. Personally, I now have useful information that gets me to 5+1 years and the rollout of second generation EV's. Nissan after all is a CAR company and has provided the vast majority of owners a useful bridge to 2017, which I suspect, has been the objective all along.

 

[evnow]

ask them: how much are you going to pay for my old one?

The answer is - $10k is for the battery exchange i.e. it assumes you are giving them the old battery. So, now what ?

See my thread about why I think Nissan is giving us a rental deal and not outright buy. I'm sure you wouldn't have like the buy price.

 

[dgpcolorado]

Put $x in a bank account and arrange auto payment of interest & some principle every month.

Really is it so difficult to wrap your head around this idea ?

BTW, this is only till you want to keep the car - not exactly perpetuity.

And when you try to sell the car how much is a car that has a mandatory $1200 a year "maintenance payment" worth? Answer: zero. Who would buy a used car that had such an expensive maintenance contract on it? The market for used LEAFs figures to crater with this program.

Also, let me ask you this. Let us say Nissan says the battery costs $10k. What are you going to do with that information ?

Probably decide to sell the car, same as with this $100/month business. If you can't refurb the car to keep it going one has to just bail out at some point.

You leased and I can understand why you and others who did so are feeling rather smug today: "I told you so" and all that. But how about those of us who purchased our cars and assumed that Nissan would be straight with us? You don't understand why we feel betrayed by today's news? Really?

 

[ericsf]

it is the grift, EV. i want more freedom from contracts not a NEW MONTHLY BILL to go with the phone, the cable,the credit cards for gasoline, the insurance, the ip, the healthcare, the gas co, the mortgage, and on and on.

+1. Couldn't say it better.

If this is the only thing that Nissan can come up with for a battery replacement, that will be my first and last Nissan ever.
If my old battery wears out, I want to buy and OWN a new one and use it as I see fit.

Just curious - does any EV manufacturer sell replacement packs today? Nobody does, as far as I know. So if this for you is a show stopper it means that you won't buy another EV. Period. Maybe we need to accept the fact that car manufacturers - for some reason - don't want to sell replacement packs.

 

[smkettner]

Also, let me ask you this. Let us say Nissan says the battery costs $10k. What are you going to do with that information ?

Start saving $100 each month

 

[ericsf]

Also, let me ask you this. Let us say Nissan says the battery costs $10k. What are you going to do with that information ?

Start saving $100 each month

Already doing that : That's what I don't spend on gas by driving my LEAF.

 

[thankyouOB]

to LEAF owners, nissan and evnow are like the soup nazi:
no battery for you.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

What would really be cool is if there were enough leafs out there for another mfr like panasonic to produce those modules and get some competition.

 

[evnow]

And when you try to sell the car how much is a car that has a mandatory $1200 a year "maintenance payment" worth? Answer: zero. Who would buy a used car that had such an expensive maintenance contract on it? The market for used LEAFs figures to crater with this program.

I don't think so at all. What is the worth of a car that will run well for next N number of years, with a new battery ? Just reduce Nx1200 from that answer. That is the rough value of a used Leaf with no battery.

You leased and I can understand why you and others who did so are feeling rather smug today: "I told you so" and all that. But how about those of us who purchased our cars and assumed that Nissan would be straight with us? You don't understand why we feel betrayed by today's news? Really?

Well, I can legitimately say "I told you so" - given that so many told me I was making a big mistake when I leased. But I'm not saying that - I don't care about that aspect.

What I want to know is - why is there this obsession with battery cost that no one (except may be SFTaylor) wants to buy right now.

 

[TRONZ]

What would really be cool is if there were enough leafs out there for another mfr like panasonic to produce those modules and get some competition.

Well now that there is a $/month number out there for LEAF packs, others can try to beat it. That's the beauty of the free market. Are you listening Tesla???

 

[thankyouOB]

we are interested in getting a new battery to restore range. we dont want to lease it.
we want to trade in.

we want that choice: lease or buy.

why is that so hard to follow?
--
not to mention that this is a total bait and switch by nissan; another break-faith-with-the-customer moment. they told us they would give us a price. they sold cars with batteries and no hint of a leasing plan.
i get it; this is their break-it-to-them-gently announcement, with details to come shortly before it is rolled out in 7 months or longer.
well, i dont like it and want nissan to know that they will have lost a customer, if there is no change.
and nissan created a car that I love.

 

[klapauzius]

Just curious - does any EV manufacturer sell replacement packs today? Nobody does, as far as I know. So if this for you is a show stopper it means that you won't buy another EV. Period. Maybe we need to accept the fact that car manufacturers - for some reason - don't want to sell replacement packs.

No.But, I bought the car on the assumption that

a) the battery would loose 20% capacity over 10 years (Nissan's initial sales pitch)
b) being a bit of an idealist, that in 10 years, I could by a new (and probably better) battery at reasonable price, which would have made this a worthwhile investment in transportation for the next 20 years.

I had a VW Passat TDI before, a 1996 model, which is still on the road today and which will be probably a few years from now. I am hoping for the same from my LEAF. However, the idea to pay $100 "rent" for a 10+ year old car just seems ridiculous, so with this plan of Nissan my long term projections for my leaf just evaporated.

I am still somewhat optimistic, since it will be quite some time before I loose the 1st bar and I could live with a loss of up to 2 (I couldn't do with 9 though), so there is still plenty of time for things to change for the better.

Yes, if this is the future of EVs, I would go back to gas (even though I thought I'd never buy another ICE).
Hopefully it is not going to come to that, if Nissan is not going to sell batteries, somebody else will....

 

[edatoakrun]

edatoakrun...I really doubt Nissan intended this announcement was an insidious scheme to force LEAF owners into an obligation to make monthly $100 payments for a "70%" range LEAF, forever...

Well, maybe I was wrong...

...In its current form, this is more of a battery rental than a lease. The latter implies a buy-out option at some point, and the current program exists in perpetuity. This point received the most concern from the adv board as well, and as the program doesn't seem to be fully baked, it would be nice to see this point reconsidered before the final details are announced...

The point is, if this is a program intended to assist those LEAFers with unusual needs, such as those who have put very high mileage on their LEAFs quickly, and those who prefer the "insured" cost of $100 a month, this program is welcome news.

However, if Nissan's plan is to use this program not as a supplement to future battery replacement sales, but to make it the only option for LEAF owners, not allowing us either to buy a battery pack in alternative to this rental/service contract/not-actually-a-lease battery replacement program, or to exit the program by buying the pack we will already have been paying $100 a month for under this program at certain dates and terms, then it is not only (IMO) unethical, but would probably be enough of a management FUBAR as to put the entire USA LEAF program at risk.

="BBrockman"... Just trying to find the place to jump back in...

And we're all still waiting for you to do so...

I strongly suggest you make some sort of statement clarifying Nissan's plans ASAP.

 

[TaylorSFGuy]

I am a high mileage driver and I'm not thrilled with this program either. If I can't change the battery until it gets to below 9 bars it is useless to me. I need to change the battery out before then.

As for those that comment that Nissan told us there would be 20% loss in 10 years, that wasn't the case for those of us that ordered early. We got vague scenarios about sitting in traffic with air conditioning on etc. Nothing like Tesla did that clearly showed what happens if you drive 60.

I still owe a significant amount on this car and I don't see a way out other than driving it into the ground unless I want to pay my way out. Can you tell I'm not happy? I want to know how much it would cost to buy a battery. I don't want to rent/lease one.

Should have sold the ..... thing and taken my loses a couple of days ago. Values just dropped. Bring on the battery competition.

 

[Weckel]

I agree. They've offered this in Europe which helps get the purchase price of the car down. So if I can get a LEAF S for 19,000 after tax incentives etc, then a car with no battery purchase + lease battery payments may be as low as 12/13K after tax incentives.

What happens at the end of the battery lease in Europe?

In Europe there isn't an end of lease contract, it's forever. The idea of this was from Nissan's partner Renault, they sell all his EV with batterie renting. At the beginning was very exciting for the people because they thought you can buy a EV cheaper, pay for some years until came a new cheapers and with more range generation of batteries and then buy one of this. But Renault (and now Nissan too) say NO, leasing it's forever.

 

[JPWhite]

I am a high mileage driver and I'm not thrilled with this program either. If I can't change the battery until it gets to below 9 bars it is useless to me. I need to change the battery out before then.

The way I read it is you can elect to pop in a brand new battery the 1st day this new program is made available regardless of current battery state. It's subsequent battery changes installed as part of the rental agreement that are limited to 9 bars.

So let's say you get to 100,000 miles and get the opportunity for a new battery. Pop it in, rent for $100/Month run it for say 80,000 miles then trade up. 180,000 miles out of a vehicle is pretty decent in my book. Some can go further

Unfortunately I don't think we will see a significant improvement in battery technology/range until 2016. Even then it may not be 'compatible' with the current LEAF's so may not be available for rent.

 

[JPWhite]

But Renault (and now Nissan too) say NO, leasing it's forever.

Forever is rather a long time. I doubt any of us will be able to pay beyond the grave

Nissan need to put a term into the rental program, after which you can elect to go month to month or drop out as you see fit. If you want out earlier, you have to pay the piper.

If I rent a house, technically there is no 'end date'. But I am released from commitment after an agreed term but can continue to rent month-to-month. The battery rental agreement will have to be something similar.

 

[klapauzius]

In Europe there isn't an end of lease contract, it's forever. The idea of this was from Nissan's partner Renault, they sell all his EV with batterie renting. At the beginning was very exciting for the people because they thought you can buy a EV cheaper, pay for some years until came a new cheapers and with more range generation of batteries and then buy one of this. But Renault (and now Nissan too) say NO, leasing it's forever.

So, if you want to sell the car, you have to find someone willing to pick up the 'eternal' rent?
What if you don't find a buyer and you can or want not to pay the rent...do they come to take the battery away then?

 

[smkettner]

But Renault (and now Nissan too) say NO, leasing it's forever.

Forever is rather a long time. I doubt any of us will be able to pay beyond the grave

Nissan need to put a term into the rental program, after which you can elect to go month to month or drop out as you see fit. If you want out earlier, you have to pay the piper.

If I rent a house, technically there is no 'end date'. But I am released from commitment after an agreed term but can continue to rent month-to-month. The battery rental agreement will have to be something similar.

Not in my eyes.

This is more like building a house on rented land.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Financing a used car with this deal would be problematic. Would nissan record a lien on a previously free and clear vehicle? Me thinks they don't have this idea fully cooked and more changes are coming.