Bay Area: San Jose Leaf test drive

[gasmiser1]

I went Saturday and I now want to change my color. I think the Red looks much better in person more "expensive" if you will ... LOL the joy of ordering sight unseen.

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Saturday: I had a SJ test drive scheduled at 8am. I arrived at 7:40am and there were about 2 dozen people already waiting for the event to start. Side note: I found out that the majority of "Nissan" uniformed people were actually marketing service hired reps, not Nissan employees. That's why most of us on this forum know more than the "reps" at the show.

I went through the three info rooms (nothing new learned). Fit and finish seems very nicely done and I was surprised how soft the "plastic recycled seats" were, almost like suede The test drive was really quiet and responsive, although a bit short. The Leaf accelerated much quicker off the line than a Prius III series. I drove the 1.5-2 miles course mainly in eco mode and actually ended up with +5 miles more on the screen, growing a trunk and lower branches as well.
Since the line was still short, I got back in line and test drove 2 more times a bit harder in the drive and eco modes.

At 5pm, I went back with my wife and had her drive the car. I was quite comfortable as a passenger in the rear seat (I'm 6' 2''). Wifey now wants to change the color from blue to red! Actually, the red is really the most luxurious color in our opinion. I don't want to jeopardize our slot in the production queue, however I'll contact my dealership today to see if changing colors is at all possible.

 

[cinmar]

We did our drive early Sunday afternoon, and we both have no regrets after placing our order last week for a white LEAF (although we liked the red also).

When we arrived, there were 3 designated lines to check in: pre-registration, registration, and walk-ins. There was one person in each of the 2nd two lines, and we got in line for pre-registration behind about 6 people. Once the other two lines were empty, neither of the reps from those lines took it upon themselves to inform those of us waiting several minutes in the long line that we could check in with them. My husband finally walked over and asked, and they said we could check in at any of the lines. That annoyed me, but no big deal.

From beginning to end, the process took about 2 to 2 1/2 hours. The gentleman who guided us through the rooms (I forget his name, but he was younger and 6+ feet tall) was very knowledgeable, however we learned nothing new.

There was one LEAF on display (a black one), and we took the time before and after our drives to sit in it. A different rep showed us the rear view camera and some of the other features. The drive itself (around the cones and a few blocks) was pretty short, but long enough to get a sampling of how it would drive in town.

I asked the person who drove with us about the pedestrian sound (we drove the blue LEAF), and she said it was not available on the pre-production LEAFS, which this one was.

I took pics of our Chicco car seat and stroller in the LEAF, but don't have them with me to post right now. They both fit fine, but the back seat was pretty narrow, more so than our Scion xB. I don't know how 3 car seats could fit across the back seat, but then again I don't need to fit 3, so I guess it doesn't matter to me. The roofline of the car also was sort of narrow, but a very tall guy who I sat in the back seat with fit fine without bumping his head. The narrowness kind of reminded me of our smart inside.

I didn't notice too many people taking photos or video with the LEAF during our drive event.

 

[gudy]

On the logistics : They were really late on saturday, but as of 11:45 AM, they were not getting any walk-ins (you had to have a reservation to test drive it).
If you don't want to wait, just get to the line for driving the car, they don't check that your name is on the current list (I guess that this advice is too late for this event, but would be useful for later events).

On the car itself :
I only got a few minutes with it, but that was enough to get completely sold on it, I'm also really glad I picked black, it is the color I like the most, so no regret there.
We were 3 adults and 2 toddlers in the car, and while it didn't feel sporty, it wasn't sluggish either.
I tried the iphone 4 connection, it worked great (it charges the iphone, and sees all your ipod tracks, I haven't tried to play a song from an app on the iphone to see if that works). All your songs / albums / artists come up on the Leaf screen, and while the navigation is not as good as the iphone touch screen, it's decent enough, and the sound quality was good enough for me.

About the driving experience :

1. The steering is NOT too light (for me), and when I told the guy that it wasn't and that I had read online that people thought that the steering was too light, he told me that is was quite funny, cause I was the 15th guy to tell him the exact same thing. So either they've changed it, or my personal taste is quite different from some other people (and I'm used to european cars).

2. I didn't like the "automatic" feel, even though I knew about it (the car moves on its own when you release the brake pedal)

3. I thought that the brakes were too strong at really slow speed, resulting in pretty harsh full stops (and I believe that this effect compounds with 2. above, as in : you release the brake a little bit, the car starts moving forward, and as you press back on the brake, the logic shuts down the motor, engages regen and friction, and all these lead to a pretty strong full stop ...)

 

[palmermd]

My experience was the same. I had a 3:00 appointment, arrived at 3:00 and did not get called into the "battery room" until after 5:00. Then when we got to the test drive they said we could only go around the block. It was less than 1/2 mile around the block. I drove over an hour to take a drive in this car, with an appointment, arrived on time, and then after waiting over 2 hours go to drive the car for 3 minutes tops. No real driving experience. I was trying to get a feel for some of the controls before I drove off the lot, and they just rushed me out and said I had to get going, and I could not do anything but adjust the seat and mirrors for safety and take a trip around the block. I'm really "pissed" to say the least. On top of that the display car that was there to use for playing with the buttons and screens was dead. There were plenty of people trying to figure out how to charge the accessory battery. Shouldn't they just plug the demo car in permanently for the road show? Seems like a simple solution for a vehicle that will be "on" all day long with people getting in and out and pushing buttons. There were plenty of people around to answer questions, but none of them seemed to know anything.

I was going to try and get a reading from the charging of the car with a trickle charger with my kill-a-watt, but the car being charged was across the lot and they would not let me over there to speak with anybody. Needless to say at this point I was a bit miffed and I did not want to press the issue.

What I can say is that I did like what I saw for the limited exposure I got. Heck this is the first time I got to touch the car. The previous two times I've seen the car it was behind velvet ropes and I could not even touch it.

NIssan really needs to do a better job of scheduling these test drives. What they had on display Saturday afternoon was a terrible display of organization. Nobody there knew anything and would not direct me to somebody who had any answers. Test drives were nothing more than the ability to put your foot on the brake and accelerator pedal a few times. I'm not sure if all the people who were there were reservation holders, but they definitely need to treat reservation holders different than non-reservatino holders. The entire presentation was geared more for somebody who has never heard of the leaf. Maybe they could put reservation holders on different days than non, and give reservation holders longer drives than non. The whole thing would probably been perfectly acceptable if I was just there to get an introduction to the Leaf.

Nissan sent me an email with a questionnaire about the event. I wrote about my experience and suggested some changes for the event to make it run smoother. Unfortunately the questionnaire was connected to their lousy website, and when I hit the submit button it "crashes" and says there was some sort of an error submitting my report. I typed all the information in again a second time and it crashed again. Apparently the site is good at blocking unwanted information because I also had some complaints and suggestions about the EVSE program they are pushing and that questionnaire also had the same resulting crash.

So my cathartic unloading of information has only resulted in more frustration.

 

[lemketron]

I was laughing at how many bay area people are buying in Petaluma... One gent told me that one dealership was trying to charge 2-3K over sticker?

As noted in other threads here, I think best choice for South Bay residents is Brendan at Boardwalk Nissan in Redwood City (see banner ad on this forum as he also supports the MyNissanLeaf forum). I wish the Sunnyvale dealer would've been more interested in keeping my tax dollars in Sunnyvale, but in any case I'm much happier with a ~15 mile drive to Redwood City than a ~95 mile drive to Petaluma.

 

[greenleaf]

I was laughing at how many bay area people are buying in Petaluma... One gent told me that one dealership was trying to charge 2-3K over sticker?

As noted in other threads here, I think best choice for South Bay residents is Brendan at Boardwalk Nissan in Redwood City (see banner ad on this forum as he also supports the MyNissanLeaf forum). I wish the Sunnyvale dealer would've been more interested in keeping my tax dollars in Sunnyvale, but in any case I'm much happier with a ~15 mile drive to Redwood City than a ~95 mile drive to Petaluma.

That's unfortunate for some. I talked to one guy and he is paying MSRP at Stevens Creek. He mentioned that it was only later that he learnt about the discounts.

 

[lemketron]

Nissan sent me an email with a questionnaire about the event. I wrote about my experience and suggested some changes for the event to make it run smoother. Unfortunately the questionnaire was connected to their lousy website, and when I hit the submit button it "crashes" and says there was some sort of an error submitting my report. I typed all the information in again a second time and it crashed again. Apparently the site is good at blocking unwanted information because I also had some complaints and suggestions about the EVSE program they are pushing and that questionnaire also had the same resulting crash.

So my cathartic unloading of information has only resulted in more frustration.

I had the exact same experience with the feedback site. The only thing more annoying than a frustrating experience (like this past weekend's test drive event) is a request for feedback that chokes on (and loses) my carefully compose response. Argh!!! :evil:

 

[gasmiser1]

One other thing I learned at the event: An AV rep was there. She said that there is a $1,000 rebate on the EVSE through the end of this year(may get extended if funded). My total installation price for the charging dock and installation with AV is currently $2,027.77. The equipment is backed by a 3 year warranty that says if it fails within that warranty, they will come and replace the equipment within 24 hours or less. Also, preference for installation before end of 2010 is given to those whom have ordered a Leaf and have the assessment already completed with quote.

Originally, I thought I'd go with a Leviton or Schneider EVSE. Now I'm considering getting the AV equipment.

Any thoughts, guys?? (AV was quite convincing with the sales pitch.)

 

[greenleaf]

One other thing I learned at the event: An AV rep was there. She said that there is a $1,000 rebate on the EVSE through the end of this year(may get extended if funded). My total installation price for the charging dock and installation with AV is currently $2,027.77. The equipment is backed by a 3 year warranty that says if it fails within that warranty, they will come and replace the equipment within 24 hours or less. Also, preference for installation before end of 2010 is given to those whom have ordered a Leaf and have the assessment already completed with quote.

Originally, I thought I'd go with a Leviton or Schneider EVSE. Now I'm considering getting the AV equipment.

Any thoughts, guys?? (AV was quite convincing with the sales pitch.)

First time I heard of a rebate. Is this new? Or is the rep referring to the 50% tax incentive? 50% x $2200 average installation cost ~ $1000.

As mentioned many times before, this tax incentive is useless if you pay AMT.

 

[gasmiser1]

One other thing I learned at the event: An AV rep was there. She said that there is a $1,000 rebate on the EVSE through the end of this year(may get extended if funded). My total installation price for the charging dock and installation with AV is currently $2,027.77. The equipment is backed by a 3 year warranty that says if it fails within that warranty, they will come and replace the equipment within 24 hours or less. Also, preference for installation before end of 2010 is given to those whom have ordered a Leaf and have the assessment already completed with quote.

Originally, I thought I'd go with a Leviton or Schneider EVSE. Now I'm considering getting the AV equipment.

Any thoughts, guys?? (AV was quite convincing with the sales pitch.)

First time I heard of a rebate. Is this new? Or is the rep referring to the 50% tax incentive? 50% x $2200 average installation cost ~ $1000.

As mentioned many times before, this tax incentive is useless if you pay AMT.

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I may have misstated the 50% as a rebate, when it may be a tax incentive. There was quite a bit of chatter around the AV booth and I didn't take notes. But, I do have her card an plan on giving the rep a call to clarify.

 

[lemketron]

Oh, and to top it off, I talked to the rep from PG&E to find out that since I have a PV system, I am REQUIRED to put in a second meter AND a second utility box before I get the car. :x :x :x :x

Sure, they can really enforce that. As if they even know you are buying the car. Another irony is that in SF they forbid the E9B and will NOT allow anyone to have two meters in the city as an SF rule. I won't be telling PGE I have an EV until I decide which rate plan I want with my existing solar.

Actually, it appears they will know! Looks like the dealers may be reporting sales to utility companies under some PUC guidelines (or something like that, according to a PGE rep in San Jose.)
And I'm pretty sure the "forbidden" second meter is the reason E9B usage will be restricted to EV charging only, possibly with a one-circuit-only panel. City officials don't want furtive in-law units sneaking in and will no doubt try to closely monitor or even prevent their installation.

I'm actually bummed I didn't get a chance to talk to the PG&E rep about this on Saturday. Does anyone have more details on this? As I would assume to be the case with many early-adopter LEAF owners (to be), I also have a PV system with a "net metering" meter. I'm not (yet) on TOU, but was considering expanding my system and shifting to TOU, but may or may not do that.

In any case, I'm not at all interested in switching tariffs or installing a separate meter for my car. In fact, I've often told friends that I could charge (over 110V) at work once/week to get all the power I need, so I may not even need to charge at home (and may not even bother installing L2 EVSE).

I find it incredibly hard to believe that PG&E can force me to install a separate meter for an EVSE that I might not even bother to purchase. Does anyone know if that would be tied to the fact that I'm a LEAF owner? Or would it (more appropriately) go along with the purchase of an EVSE?

In addition, what about PV owners who are sizing their system BASED on the assumption of net metering INCLUDING their EV recharging consumption? A second meter for EV charging sounds like it takes the EV charging power out of the net metering calculation. I know about the "EV tariff" that PG&E has, which is less desirable than the various PV TOU tariffs. Sounds like someone at the PUC needs to reconcile these two complementary cases into a single tariff that allows a single meter to work for PV/TOU and EV charging... (sigh)

 

[LEAFer]

Any thoughts, guys?? (AV was quite convincing with the sales pitch.)

I agree ... I think the rep was referring to the 50% federal tax credit and giving you an unabashed sales pitch.

 

[gasmiser1]

Oh, and to top it off, I talked to the rep from PG&E to find out that since I have a PV system, I am REQUIRED to put in a second meter AND a second utility box before I get the car. :x :x :x :x

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I briefly spoke to the PG&E rep. I don't have a PV system, but wanted to know what would be required for E9 rates. He said I'd have to have an electrician install a new dual meter system panel, if I wanted to keep the panel within by internal wall box that currently contains our meter and panel. PG&E may also charge an additional $300-500 for inspection and testing. Since we will be moving in the next 2-3 years, for us, I don't think spending a couple thousand more to have the electrcian replace a 2 year old 200 amp service is justified.

 

[evnow]

One other thing I learned at the event: An AV rep was there. She said that there is a $1,000 rebate on the EVSE through the end of this year(may get extended if funded).

That is just the 50% of tax credit.

What AV is saying is that because of the credit they are overcharging. They would rather that they get the money than you.

 

[leaf561]

That's unfortunate for some. I talked to one guy and he is paying MSRP at Stevens Creek. He mentioned that it was only later that he learnt about the discounts.

I felt the same way. Lot of folks in my group were pretty much unaware what was going on, even though they had paid $99 for the reservation.

Probably we should make small cards (like business cards) with mynissanleaf.com on it and distribute it in future test drive sites. Or put our banner out there or have some of the experts in this forums volunteer in a booth at the test drive site.

 

[planet4ever]

I may have misstated the 50% as a rebate, when it may be a tax incentive. There was quite a bit of chatter around the AV booth and I didn't take notes. But, I do have her card an plan on giving the rep a call to clarify.

As others have said, I'm sure she was talking about the tax credit. The important thing to remember, contrary to what some people have apparently been told by AV, is that the IRS doesn't care what EVSE you got or who installed it. If you spent money for the product and/or installation you can reduce your taxes next spring by half of what you spent, assuming you met the other requirements (mostly that the device had to be operational by the end of this year, that you had to pay taxes, and that you didn't have to use AMT).

 

[planet4ever]

I briefly spoke to the PG&E rep. I don't have a PV system, but wanted to know what would be required for E9 rates. He said I'd have to have an electrician install a new dual meter system panel

I said it before, and I'll say it again. NONSENSE! It really makes me angry that someone representing PG&E would be giving out information that makes no sense and is contrary to everything else we have read and been told. That one person at that one event has done a great disservice to the future of EVs.

 

[DeaneG]

PG&E has an updated EV charging FAQ which is actually pretty good, and covers charging with and without solar PV. See my post in "PG&E" thread:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=661&start=69