BMW Owner sitting on the fence.....

[caffeinekid]

We've had several BMWs. Among them were the mid-sized 525i and a 530i, an X3 SUV and a 318ti a long time ago, which is what I would compare the Leaf to so far as handling. We have also had several VWs, so we really 'get' the German engineering and at one time swore that I would only ever buy German in the future. That being said, I don't really miss any of them except maybe the VW GTI, which was my favorite for speed & handling. I drove a couple of BMWs long enough to exceed warranty coverage and that much at least I certainly do not miss. We now have 2 Leafs that I find surprisingly enjoyable to drive. I think they handle just fine & have plenty of pickup "straight out of the box." But I won't deny that if BMW comes through with some solid EVs, I would probably favor the roundel.

 

[surfingslovak]

I'd love to hear from members who replaced a BMW or other nice handling car with the Leaf, and how they're doing after a few months. What kind of therapy sessions they've needed, etc.

Good on you to consider a Leaf. It's a very competent EV, and a whole new way to drive. There are some challenges as well, many of which are covered in great detail on this forum and elsewhere. Please be sure to check out a Huffington Post article written by an owner who went from an M3 to a Leaf. We had an older thread, where we covered a lot of what has been said here as well.

That said, I'm someone who went in the opposite direction, and went from a Leaf to a BMW. You can read my first impressions when I test drove the car. Boomer penned a great review a few days later. The production car is expected to be out late next year. While I really like the concept, it will likely be much more expensive than the current lease deals on 2012 Leafs.

And finally, if you were on Facebook, be sure to check out our owners group.

 

[EVDrive]

We need a bit more info to see if a Leaf would be right for you:

What city/state do you live in?
How far is your commute?
How far do you expect to drive on a charge for non-commute activities?
Are you thinking of leasing or buying? If lease, how long?

I'm in San Jose, CA. Commute is 44 miles RT. I'm looking at a 36 mo. lease.

But I think this information is irrelevant to my question. I'm asking from a purely driving experience standpoint. Are driving enthusiasts missing their former cars?

I love driving the Leaf. I drive it really hard and it handles like a dream. I had a sporty scion before that Leaf and I burned through gas like crazy. The only real issue is that the Leaf has mad torque of the line but when you are going 75mph, it picks up speed cautiously.

The EV grin I get from driving it and the double grin I get from passing the fools pumping gas every morning makes me really happy. With your commute, go for it!

 

[TonyWilliams]

2012 Leaf (2013 Leaf will have the same 6.6 kW charger as the FFE/HFE).

6.6 will be optional.

 

[TonyWilliams]

I drove a couple of BMWs long enough to exceed warranty coverage and that much at least I certainly do not miss.

My BMW 330 CiC went on the auction block the very second it came off warranty (100,000 mile). BMW motorcycle was better, but plenty of quirks that typical Japanese bikes don't have. I really enjoyed driving them both, however.

 

[Cheezmo]

I left my '97 BMW M3 for a Leaf and was happy, but in the end let my daughter have it and got myself a Volt. Much more fun to drive, handles much better, and no worries for my longer trips (I'm 200 miles from home tonight). I also had a 540i previously.

So, before you jump in to the Leaf, at least test drive a Volt and see what you think. If a 4 seater will work for you, it would be worth a look. Make sure the dealer has charged it so you get the electric feel. The first dealer I test drove one at the battery was dead.

 

[sgoyal]

Given that driving qualities are important to the OP, I'd say he might find the Ford Focus Electric (FFE) more to his tastes, or especially the Honda Fit EV (HFE) already mentioned, particularly in Sport mode. See an example in Brad Berman's review here:

http://www.plugincars.com/first-drive-honda-fit-ev-combines-power-and-practicality-110736.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The FFE is now being offered on similar lease terms to the Leaf (~$199/month + taxes), albeit with a 10,500 mile/year limit, which is slightly problematic for a 44 mile daily commute (44 x 5 x 48 weeks = 10,560 miles/yr). You'd want to get a lease with a greater mileage allowance.

Unfortunately the HFE hasn't been offered with comparable lease terms, although they do include collision insurance in the $389/month + tax lease cost, which accounts for its lackluster sales despite the fact that IMO it's the best combination of performance, handling and efficiency currently available in a sub-$40k BEV. And the car is only available for lease, with no option to buy at end of term, which scares off some people who went through the EV1 experience.

In any case, give all three a try, and see which one you like best. Driving enthusiasts seem to vote hands down for the HFE, with the FFE second.

Edit: Oh, one downside to both the FFE and HFE compared to the Leaf is that you can't get CHAdeMo DC Quick Charging. Not a big deal for a car used primarily for commuting and local driving, and their internal chargers are twice as powerful as the one on the 2012 Leaf (2013 Leaf will have the same 6.6 kW charger as the FFE/HFE).

GRA - Thanks for your comments. The FFE homepage is pegging the lease at $344.00/month with matching downpayment and annual mileage allowance as the 2012 Leaf SL(which I can get for $175/month). Are you sure you didn't mistakenly see the base gas model of the Focus. When you're on the FFE page, then click on 'Payment Estimator' it shows you numbers for a GAS base model Focus. Also, I'm not a fan of the Ford Sync system, and the Leaf interior is some how a more relaxing place to be, IMO the Focus seems too busy and overwhelming.

The Honda Lease is also double the Leaf lease at this point, making it hard to justify the BMW sale.

 

[surfingslovak]

The Honda Lease is also double the Leaf lease at this point, making it hard to justify the BMW sale.

I very much doubt that. While the lease is not cheap when compared to current Leaf deals, it includes comprehensive insurance, and it's a zero down lease. The Fit also qualifies for the $2.5K CA CVRP. The Ford Focus Electric is matching Nissan's lease deals right now, which I believe was confirmed by a forum member. I had an Audi A6 in the past, and when I look at how much I was paying for gas, I could cover monthly lease payments on some of these EVs from those savings alone. If you don't mind me asking, what gas mileage does your BMW get, and how much do you spend on annual maintenance?




Click to open

 

[sgoyal]

I left my '97 BMW M3 for a Leaf and was happy, but in the end let my daughter have it and got myself a Volt. Much more fun to drive, handles much better, and no worries for my longer trips (I'm 200 miles from home tonight). I also had a 540i previously.

So, before you jump in to the Leaf, at least test drive a Volt and see what you think. If a 4 seater will work for you, it would be worth a look. Make sure the dealer has charged it so you get the electric feel. The first dealer I test drove one at the battery was dead.

Wow, I'm just floored with the helpful responses here, what a great place !! Thank you all for your help, I'm feeling very confident about this. I read many responses and took a long (10 mile) test drive today, and loved the smooth instant power. There is something about the Leaf interior that made me feel very relaxed. Maybe its the absence of dark colors inside, or maybe the the tiny shifter, or maybe the overall airy feeling. I have to admit, for some reason, that is hard to explain, I found myself not paying too much attention to the handling. It was a very cool experience.

My brother bought a Volt last month, and I drove it. Interior has a completely different feel to it, and I just don't like the capacitive touch dash. I want real buttons to push. I prefer having the extra space in the Leaf's back seat for our dog.

So I drove home in a Blue SL with mudguards and floor mats . Paid $2k down and $175+Tax/month for a 36 mo Lease. Now I have to apply for the free 240v charger from Ecotality.

BTW, my two girl have never been so excited to see a new car, the middle schooler is already calling it 'her' car, and how badly she wants to drive it. Think I might let her take the wheel for a few yards in a parking lot. Eco mode of course

Thanks again, I truly appreciate the advise and support.

 

[surfingslovak]

So I drove home in a Blue SL with mudguards and floor mats . Paid $2k down and $175+Tax/month for a 36 mo Lease. Now I have to apply for the free 240v charger from Ecotality.

Congrats, and welcome! I called the Leaf my zen car. Looks like you will have a fun journey together. Did you get it at Boardwalk?

 

[Boomer23]

Very cool news, glad we were able to help you with your decision. The LEAF is a great family car and it sounds like it will fit in well with your family as well as your commute.

Please keep us posted about life with your new LEAF. You have some fun times ahead.

 

[sgoyal]

So I drove home in a Blue SL with mudguards and floor mats . Paid $2k down and $175+Tax/month for a 36 mo Lease. Now I have to apply for the free 240v charger from Ecotality.

Congrats, and welcome! I called the Leaf my the zen car. Looks like you will have a fun journey together. Did you get it at Boardwalk?

Yes, I got it at Boardwalk, best price by far..

 

[MrIanB]

Man, that did not take much time to convince you. Perhaps we should all be Leaf salesman.

Congrats,

Ian B

 

[TonyWilliams]

Ok, now to start improving it. The single biggest improvement in my driving experience has been the Michelin MXM4 tires. Your stock tires will not likely make it to the lease turn in, and I personally dislike buying new tires for the dealer, so I replaced mine now.

I have kept the original Ecopia tires in storage for lease turn-in day. I love the Michelin tires from every measure, particularly handling and highway speed stability.

 

[sgoyal]

Ok, now to start improving it. The single biggest improvement in my driving experience has been the Michelin MXM4 tires. Your stock tires will not likely make it to the lease turn in, and I personally dislike buying new tires for the dealer, so I replaced mine now.

I have kept the original Ecopia tires in storage foresee turn in day. I love the Michelin tires from every measure, particularly handling and highway speed stability.

That makes sense to replace your tires sooner than later. I wonder what is the turn-in criteria for tread depth. Car and Driver also did a test with a few different tires to improve the skid pad performance. You guys have probably seen it already.

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/the-nearly-10-g-nissan-leaf-getting-an-ev-to-grip-like-a-911-feature" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[TonyWilliams]

Yes, that article has made the rounds. Any of the sticky "quasi race car" tires will kill the range. The Michelin MXM4 and slightly less rolling resistant MXV4 are just superior to the originals in every measure. If you appreciated the BMW handling, I strongly suggest changing at least the tires.

I changed my wheels also, from stock 16x6.5x42mm offset to the Nissan Juke wheels at 17x7x47mm.

At 25,000 miles on the original tires, I didn't have to worry about tread depth. They were balding.

 

[ksnogas2112]

Welcome to Team EV. Enjoy the grin.

tom

 

[thankyouOB]

Ok, now to start improving it. The single biggest improvement in my driving experience has been the Michelin MXM4 tires. Your stock tires will not likely make it to the lease turn in, and I personally dislike buying new tires for the dealer, so I replaced mine now.

I have kept the original Ecopia tires in storage for lease turn-in day. I love the Michelin tires from every measure, particularly handling and highway speed stability.

what is highway speed stability?

 

[TonyWilliams]

what is highway speed stability?

Stability of the car at highway speed.... it's not as "twitchy". Tracks and handles far better. Smoother. Less tire noise over bumps. Looks better. Lasts longer.

 

[Axel]

Hi Folks, first time here, considering a 2012 Leaf SL.

I love my 2006 530i, drives like a dream, very reliable, etc. I'm nervous as hell about replacing it with a Leaf, although the handling didn't seem bad on the limited test drive, I wonder how it is day to day. With my 530i, I still get a smile on my face every time I take it out, and I don't drive it hard.

I'd love to hear from members who replaced a BMW or other nice handling car with the Leaf, and how they're doing after a few months. What kind of therapy sessions they've needed, etc.

Appreciate the comments.

As an ex-bmw driver I can assure you that the Leaf drives and handles just as well as a bmw up to about 80mph. In fact it handles much better at take off than a bmw ever will and the low center of gravity from the batteries makes for an awesome and stable driving feeling on curvy mountain roads.

Above 80mph the handling goes downhill but I usually only need those sorts of speeds when I visit Germany. I dont think the Leaf would make a good Autobahn car.