Chevrolet Bolt & Bolt EUV

[EVDrive]

Greencarreports.com and autobloggreen.com both list the bolt 238 mile range. This is badass. I'm rethinking my model 3 deposit.

Do LG cells catch fire as easy as the Tesla Panasonic cells? The Tesla cells are prone to fire, however, I've never heard of a Volt or Spark getting in an accident and catching fire. Maybe I missed the Volt fire articles. I think a Volt caught fire in a garage while charging, one time, can't remember why though. LG cells seem safer and with this range, I think the Bolt deserves a second look. Model 3 design is better, autopilot could be a plusTesla, and Tesla superchargers are all advantages. Not really sure about autopilot, I don't trust the current version one bit. Hopefully the next generation AP for the model 3 won't be a false sense of security like the current AP version.

 

[cwerdna]

Greencarreports.com and autobloggreen.com both list the bolt 238 mile range. This is badass.

Indeed. Assuming there wasn't some error in conducting the test (I'd assume there's no way GM would want to cheat on this), this is a very impressive number. If it turns out to be reasonably reliable, most of the other BEVs will really need to up their game or face sharply tanking sales.

 

[LeftieBiker]

In my case, the range - as long as it exceeds 120 miles - isn't as important an issue as the reliability and features. If the car keeps breaking down before it gets to 238 miles, that's a problem. ;-)

 

[WetEV]

383 km is impressive. Opens up lots of trips.

Overkill for commuting. Only one battery size option?

 

[GetOffYourGas]

In my case, the range - as long as it exceeds 120 miles - isn't as important an issue as the reliability and features. If the car keeps breaking down before it gets to 238 miles, that's a problem. ;-)

If the Bolt is anywhere near as reliable as the Volt, you have nothing to worry about!

383 km is impressive. Opens up lots of trips.

Overkill for commuting. Only one battery size option?

Indeed. This is potentially a road-trip car. Unless GM cripples it with a maximum 50kW DCQC. But with 100-150kW charging, and 238 miles of range, the Bolt would be a true Tesla fighter.

 

[palmermd]

Indeed. This is potentially a road-trip car. Unless GM cripples it with a maximum 50kW DCQC. But with 100-150kW charging, and 238 miles of range, the Bolt would be a true Tesla fighter.

90 miles in 30 min sounds like 50kW.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Evs3CgO3FZM




Here is the link to the full playlist of 15 videos on the BOLT.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOc4b81VzGI&list=PL7ufN7Cep1mFfoJFAL5geqtfoY02_1JHQ

 

[GetOffYourGas]

Yup. It is 50kW. But that doesn't mean that a near-future Bolt will not get an upgrade. Or that they don't already have this in the works behind the scenes. I was going off the fact that they removed mention of DCQC from the Bolt's page recently. Although now I see it again says 90 miles in 30 minutes.

http://insideevs.com/a-tale-of-9-hours-does-gm-really-want-to-sell-the-chevy-bolt/

By the time Tesla fulfills all of their reservations - and hence when an average consumer can choose between driving home in a Bolt or a Model III - the Bolt will be due for a facelift anyway.

 

[EVDRIVER]

This is good news on the (EPA) rating but still not a practical road trip car in many markets because there is not proper charging infrastructure nor will there be for a very long time. Presently I can go anywhere I need in a Model 3 but with the Bolt I simply can't drive on any of my longer trips, not one. Not to mention that once a few chargers are put in they will likely be limited and heavily used and abused and not in proper locations. The huge difference between any EV released today and the Tesla is simply the charging infrastructure and type of charger. Yes this is a longer range EV for many folks but I simply find comparisons to any Tesla model funny as the charging, performance, and safety differences are significant. Oh, and looks Because it may have an extra 20 miles range than others is simply moot for many. Having the Supercharger network can literally eliminate a second car for many and also eliminates DC charging costs as well. If this car had access to the supercharger network it would be much better but still not a car I would compare directly to a Model 3, to a LEAF yes.. I still gag when I see that ugly Chevy logo on the steering wheel, they really need to revise that design for the future as it looks like an ugly rental car, at least make it smaller. Back logo is hideous as well.

 

[Firetruck41]

This is good news on the (EPA) rating but still not a practical road trip car in many markets because there is not proper charging infrastructure nor will there be for a very long time. Presently I can go anywhere I need in a Model 3 but with the Bolt I simply can't drive on any of my longer trips, not one. Not to mention that once a few chargers are put in they will likely be limited and heavily used and abused and not in proper locations. The huge difference between any EV released today and the Tesla is simply the charging infrastructure and type of charger. Yes this is a longer range EV for many folks but I simply find comparisons to any Tesla model funny as the charging, performance, and safety differences are significant. Oh, and looks Because it may have an extra 20 miles range than others is simply moot for many. Having the Supercharger network can literally eliminate a second car for many and also eliminates DC charging costs as well. If this car had access to the supercharger network it would be much better but still not a car I would compare directly to a Model 3, to a LEAF yes.. I still gag when I see that ugly Chevy logo on the steering wheel, they really need to revise that design for the future as it looks like an ugly rental car, at least make it smaller. Back logo is hideous as well.

Well for the next several years, your comparison will probably be (mostly) moot, since you won't be able to go to the dealer and buy a Model 3 off the showroom floor. I do agree with some of your comparisons, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and roadtrips mean different things to different people, so it could be a practical "only" car for quite a few people. For me, my biggest concern won't be known for quite some time: real world battery degradation.

 

[LeafMuranoDriver]

I was quite surprised when I saw the email this morning. 238 is more than I was guessing (210-215).

Nissan better have Leaf 2.0 ready to go very soon or drop the price of the current leaf AND add a 40 kWh battery.

 

[knightmb]

I was quite surprised when I saw the email this morning. 238 is more than I was guessing (210-215).

Nissan better have Leaf 2.0 ready to go very soon or drop the price of the current leaf AND add a 40 kWh battery.

I've believe it when I see it for real. People were already driving +200 miles in the Leaf years ago under ideal conditions, so without some context I am weary about their 238 mile range claim. We know the CD of the Bolt is the same as the Leaf, so if you took the existing Leaf design and just stuck a 60 kW/h battery pack in, it would easily get over 200 miles of range. That is about the only way I would compare them currently, I don't know what kind of heating/AC system the Bolt uses for example that might drastically affect the range.

 

[edatoakrun]

I was quite surprised when I saw the email this morning. 238 is more than I was guessing (210-215)...

Remember that is EPA (relatively low speed average) range, is considerably higher than road-trip range at freeway speeds.

The 2014 2014 Tesla Model S 85 kWh was rated 265 miles EPA, but could only go ~228 miles in AVTA tests at 70 mph, despite favorable test conditions of constant-speed and 27 C average ambient temperatures.

https://www.tesla.com/blog/driving-range-model-s-family

https://avt.inl.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/fsev/fact2014teslamodels.pdf

The Bolt should be expected get about 200 to 205 miles from full charge to shutdown when tested under the same conditions, and will cover considerably fewer miles before shutdown when driven at more typical higher (and variable) freeway speeds, or in cooler ambient temperatures.

And of course you will always need to stop at a charge site, at some distance shorter than the full range, before the Bolt's BMS prevents you from driving further.

 

[RegGuheert]

Do LG cells catch fire as easy as the Tesla Panasonic cells?

No. Bolt uses Li-ion NMC chemistry, which is safer than the chemistry used by Tesla. (However, I would not be surprised if Tesla also moved to NMC soon.)

 

[scottf200]

Title: 2017 Chevrolet Bolt EV first drive: [we drove] 240 miles in an electric car
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1106077_2017-chevrolet-bolt-ev-first-drive-240-miles-in-an-electric-car

In other words, the Bolt EV delivers on its EPA range rating of 238 miles combined—announced earlier today—in real-world use.

Our six-hour drive route took us 235 miles from Monterey, California, south to Santa Barbara, largely along the scenic coastal Route 1.

That road was characterized as "one of the most frustrating routes in the world" by a Chevrolet team member, but it was comparatively free of slow-moving rented motorhomes and gawking tourists for at least half the drive.

We drove a 2017 Chevrolet Bolt EV electric car 240 miles on a single charge last week.

And that was the lowest range achieved among four journalists driving four Bolt EVs along the California coast.

One driver covered essentially the same trip with fully 32 miles remaining, according to the car’s display.

In other words, the Bolt EV delivers on its EPA range rating of 238 miles combined—announced earlier today—in real-world use.

Our six-hour drive route took us 235 miles from Monterey, California, south to Santa Barbara, largely along the scenic coastal Route 1.

That road was characterized as "one of the most frustrating routes in the world" by a Chevrolet team member, but it was comparatively free of slow-moving rented motorhomes and gawking tourists for at least half the drive.

2017 Chevrolet Bolt EV, road test, California coastline, Aug 20162017 Chevrolet Bolt EV, road test, California coastline, Aug 2016
Much of the route was covered at speeds of 40 to 60 mph, but over a stretch of country roads and highway toward the end of the trip, we drove to keep up with traffic—meaning 70 to 75 mph in many cases.

At the end, we crested a 2,000-foot pass over the coastal mountains before descending to sea level at our destination—with the air conditioning on low to counter temperatures of more than 90 degrees.

 

[edatoakrun]

Title: 2017 Chevrolet Bolt EV first drive: [we drove] 240 miles in an electric car
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1106077_2017-chevrolet-bolt-ev-first-drive-240-miles-in-an-electric-car

....our Bolt EV delivered 4.1 miles per kilowatt-hour used. Over our 240 miles, we had used 58.7 kwh, or 97.8 percent of the total stated pack capacity of 60 kwh...

IMO the big news from this story, is that GM (from the dash display image) seems to be claiming ~60 kWh AVAILABLE capacity from the Bolt pack, out of what would be expected to be a significantly larger total capacity, of at least ~67 kWh.

If that's all correct, I can't figure out why the Bolt gets only 238 miles on the EPA cycle...

 

[Phatcat73]

Nissan better have Leaf 2.0 ready to go very soon or drop the price of the current leaf AND add a 40 kWh battery.

I've believe it when I see it for real. People were already driving +200 miles in the Leaf years ago under ideal conditions, so without some context I am weary about their 238 mile range claim. We know the CD of the Bolt is the same as the Leaf, so if you took the existing Leaf design and just stuck a 60 kW/h battery pack in, it would easily get over 200 miles of range. That is about the only way I would compare them currently, I don't know what kind of heating/AC system the Bolt uses for example that might drastically affect the range.

Really? 200 miles in a Leaf? Maybe if I was coming down a mountain.

The EPA values are fairly reliable. If comparing EPA of a Leaf to EPA of a Bolt, I would feel very confident in the numbers.

In any case I am quite overwhelmed with the capability of the Bolt. Living in the snow belt, I would like to see the range on a frigid day. But even if 50% loss, 120 miles is still very decent. In any case I don't expect the Bolt to be available in the midwest unit next summer. I suspect the carb states will consume all that GM can produce for a large number of months.

 

[EVDRIVER]

This is good news on the (EPA) rating but still not a practical road trip car in many markets because there is not proper charging infrastructure nor will there be for a very long time. Presently I can go anywhere I need in a Model 3 but with the Bolt I simply can't drive on any of my longer trips, not one. Not to mention that once a few chargers are put in they will likely be limited and heavily used and abused and not in proper locations. The huge difference between any EV released today and the Tesla is simply the charging infrastructure and type of charger. Yes this is a longer range EV for many folks but I simply find comparisons to any Tesla model funny as the charging, performance, and safety differences are significant. Oh, and looks Because it may have an extra 20 miles range than others is simply moot for many. Having the Supercharger network can literally eliminate a second car for many and also eliminates DC charging costs as well. If this car had access to the supercharger network it would be much better but still not a car I would compare directly to a Model 3, to a LEAF yes.. I still gag when I see that ugly Chevy logo on the steering wheel, they really need to revise that design for the future as it looks like an ugly rental car, at least make it smaller. Back logo is hideous as well.

Well for the next several years, your comparison will probably be (mostly) moot, since you won't be able to go to the dealer and buy a Model 3 off the showroom floor. I do agree with some of your comparisons, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and roadtrips mean different things to different people, so it could be a practical "only" car for quite a few people. For me, my biggest concern won't be known for quite some time: real world battery degradation.

Note I never said it would not be practical for some. In two years there will be many Model 3 owners and if the timelines hold I expect to be one in about a year. I guess some may think a Bolt is nicer looking than an Model 3 and that ice milk is as good as Haagen Das, that leaves room for many markets to sell into. Forget the term road trip, you are not going to drive a Bolt from the Bay area to LA, the Eastern Sierra,etc. Supercharging is a HUGE advantage and just one of many. I am confident that after initial sales Chevy will offer big incentives and huge lease deals. If there was a pre-order list for the Bolt you could see how actually low the demand would be in comparison regardless of release dates and if the Model 3 were available at year end the Bolt would not have the same pricing for sure. Watch the sales curve go up and then drop, I expect the LEAF to suffer as well as it will not be a big platform upgrade or very stylish, think Honda Fit.

 

[edatoakrun]

C&D's report of the same test drive:

Eager to prove that the Bolt really will go that far on a single charge, Chevrolet planned out a route from Monterey to Santa Barbara, California, that spanned approximately 240 miles on coastal highways. The route included elevation changes and higher cruising speeds, conditions that do not typically favor electric cars, which do best in stop-and-go situations that make the most of their regenerative-braking capability. (Chevrolet claims that about 40 miles of the EPA-rated range is attributable to regen adding energy back into the battery while the car is underway.)

During our day with the Bolt, we did not drive in an overly aggressive manner, nor did we hypermile. Most of the time, we stayed out of the standard Drive setting and kept the car in its Low mode, which increases the amount of regenerative slowdown you get when you lift off the go pedal. (More on that later.) Temperatures were in the 60s for the first half of our route, so we left the fan blowing without activating air conditioning; as we drove farther south, the temperature rose, and we set the automatic climate control to 72 degrees.

The results speak for themselves: After driving 238 miles, we arrived at our destination with the range estimator displaying 34 miles remaining. No complicated math was required to see that the Bolt clearly can far outperform Chevy’s initial estimate. Other drivers on the same route achieved varying numbers—one vehicle finished with a range indicator simply flashing Low rather than displaying a number—but each of the four Bolts on our drive completed the tall task...

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2017-chevrolet-bolt-ev-first-drive-review

Overall very positive review, with only a few faint criticisms:

...While the Bolt’s technology palette is attractive, we were a bit disappointed with its interior quality, which is more befitting a $20,000 car than a $30,000 one. Chief engineer Josh Tavel admitted that priorities for the Bolt dictated more of a focus on innovative tech than it did on soft-touch dashboard materials and the like. This is an understandable compromise...

It’s a well-rounded, eminently usable, forward-thinking small hatchback that’s satisfying to drive—and perhaps the most compelling argument yet for the staying power of the mass-market electric car.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

I find it amusing that there is far more discussion on this thread than on the entirety of the mychevybolt.com forum, especially today.

I can't wait to see what the real range is on the highway at various real speeds. Like 70 or 80MPH. This will really highlight whether the Bolt is a road-trip capable car or not. Of course, I don't expect Chevy to provide that information. I just hope someone is inspired enough to recreate something like Tony's Leaf Range Chart for the Bolt.

 

[EVDRIVER]

I find it amusing that there is far more discussion on this thread than on the entirety of the mychevybolt.com forum, especially today.

I can't wait to see what the real range is on the highway at various real speeds. Like 70 or 80MPH. This will really highlight whether the Bolt is a road-trip capable car or not. Of course, I don't expect Chevy to provide that information. I just hope someone is inspired enough to recreate something like Tony's Leaf Range Chart for the Bolt.

Because most of the potential buyers already have a LEAF