Wow, this is what happens when I post before work and then can't join the conversation throughout the day. Thanks to all who posted, I'll try and play catch up here.
edatoakrun said:
I think that waiting for the 2013's makes the most sense for those whom the relatively slight increases in range promised by the cumulative improvements, are likely to outweigh what will likely be a considerably higher final sales/lease price.
Given your short commute, and the occasional 70 mile trip you state (assuming your relative will let you plug in, if required) it doesn't sound like ~5 more miles of high-speed range in the Summer (and a few miles more in the Winter, from the heat pump) that the 2013 might provide, will be a critical benefit to you.
I'd love to get one of the zero down, 169 or 199 / month leases, but that's not what they are offering here locally (apparently NMAC has different lease programs for different regions?). I will be able to opportunity charge at my relative's house.
If you don't want to have to plan to keep a "back-up" ICEV, and/or want to make frequent longer trips without buying gas, the slightly longer range and/or 6.6 kWh option (for routes without DC chargers) the 2013 might provide a huge benefit.
My wife has a 2002 Jetta that she intends to keep for a few more years, and I have a '96 Nissan Pickup, so we have options. The 6.6 kWh would add utility, probably making that 70 mile round trip more doable in the winter with some heat / defrost. BTW, this trip that I make every two weeks is about 50% in town, 50% highway.
But I'm also already thinking of the 2014 Infiniti, (hopefully) with a slightly longer range than the 2013 LEAF...
How do you know the next bush won't have three birds in it?
I haven't thought too much about the Infiniti, mostly because I believe it will be more than I want to pay for a vehicle, but your'e right, hopefully there will be several new choices in the EV arena over the next couple of years.
DaveHanson said:
Hi Gary,
Brand new Seattle-based leaf lessee here, who happens to be born and raised in Spokane (still have property and family there). A few thoughts:
-In terms of value for dollar, the lease deals currently smoke the purchase deals IMO, just by the numbers
Hi DaveHanson. I pm'd you for some more details on the lease - but this is exactly the kind of deal I have been looking for! I could justify the lease payment largely on fuel savings. Dave, you make some other really great points. Your buyout is good, but having the option to just walk is also good. And your bet on a lower residual / buyout may be correct as well
You've already mentioned the more extreme climate compared to the coast. Will you keep the car in a (heated?) garage? That will help, but the need for heat will be an issue with range both for 2102 and 2013 models. There are still no quickcharge stations anywhere near Spokane, and AFAIK no ETA on them either. If there were one en route to the city you visit (which city?)
The "city" I travel to is Elk, WA. Yes, the car will be parked in a heated garage during the winter. The EV infrastructure is pretty poor here - even the Nissan dealers only have level 2, no quick charge anywhere.
Dealers tell me there is still significant stock on the 2102 SLs. There should be a window in the next couple months where 2012 deals will be smoking, but 2013 lease deals will become clearer. I would be tempted to inform myself with a mind to picking either a 2012 or 2013 to lease in the next 90-180 days, depending in part on how inventory looks.
FWIW...
Actually worth quite a bit. This would seem like a prudent plan of action. As Leaffan wrote, leasing a 2013 is also an interesting proposition, but for me only if the terms are great like DaveHanson's. I'm guessing they won't be.
LEAFfan said:
... there WILL be an improved pack (no chemistry change) and along with all the other improvements is why I've turned down the great 2012 deals.
Yes, please do tell!
TonyWilliams said:
I would not expect to have the 2013 S model with the needed heat pump. So, for me, depending on how far autonomously you need to drive in cold weather, that would be the determining factor.
So, both cars you are considering are likely 6kW resistance heaters, therefore I would probably be inclined to get the 2012 at the smoking lease deals that are out there, than pay a "premium" for a 2013 with the same heater.
All the other model 2013s with heat pump are well above your price point.
Damn, really. Is this what is meant by decontented? Seems to me this should be standard across the board. Then again, will a heat pump really work for cabin heat / defrost when temps. are 20 degrees F or below?
The things that are important to me for a future EV in the LEAF class is temperature control of the battery and REAL 100 mile range. The other stuff is fluff, EXCEPT that heat pump.[
How far do you plan to drive? 20 miles weekday, get the 2012. 70 miles weekend, AND CAN PLUG IN, get the 2012
Edit: if you're doing 70 miles in the cold, and can't plug in at your destination 35 miles away, then I do NOT recommend any LEAF for this trip.
Nissan can't give these things away forever, and now is the best deals and selection. It will get a bit sparse in Jan / Feb.
Tony, I assume from what you wrote that you think the heat pump is a desirable feature (along with batt. temp. control and greater range). I know nothing about how effective / efficient this device supposedly will be - please elaborate. And as far as temp. management, I'm finding it hard to push the financial envelope to purchase the existing options, i.e. Volt, Focus EV, Tesla. Even the leases for the first two are currently higher than I'm comfortable spending. I know you own a RAV EV, so from what you have written, I'm guessing you believe the battery thermal management is worth the premium. (Yes, I've been following the AZ batt. capacity threads). You mention Nissan's current giveaway pricing, but the lease quotes I got here in Spokane are nowhere near as attractive as DaveHanson's deal at Nelson Campbell. Is there any rhyme or reason to what lease pricing is offered where?
planet4ever said:
I'd say go for the lease now. (But, of course, WITHOUT that ripoff maintenance add on.)
Ray
Hi Ray. I'll look into this, unless you care to elaborate. I'm going to assume that come paper signing time someone from the dealership strongly suggests that X maintenance plan is recommended, and lessee should decline. But what about in the event of a purchase? I've read that someone (Stevens Creek Nissan) offered / offers a reasonably priced extended warranty. Anyone have any experience with this?
davewill said:
Plus the faster charger won't have much added utility for overnight charging. The number of times when it would have be helpful for me are probably well under 10 over the last 18 months...and since the charge rate has to slow down as you approach the end of the charge, it might not have helped as much as I'd've liked even then.
Yup, at least where I live, the fast charger network is currently non-existent. But, a 6.6 kWh charger would be a nice improvement over 3.3