ICEless in Seattle : Official Pacific NorthWest thread

[QueenBee]

Really? Too chicken to try a 65 mile drive? 65 miles to 85 miles is all I can expect to get out of a Leaf? My Leaf is on order due for a December delivery and now I'm rethinking if the car will even work for me. What happened to the 100+ miles?

The marketing may not make it clear but the paperwork you sign makes it very clear. The 100+ mile range thing is purely at the optimal speeds. Freeway driving is nowhere near the 100 mile range.

To me the better question is what happened to Level3 charging? A lot of anxiety like yours could be solved overnight by having Level 3 spread out along I-5/405/90.

If your work isn't interested in a full Level 2 EVSE you could consider just Level 1 charging by using a normal outlet or maybe you could convince them to add a dedicated 240volt 20 amp circuit and you provide your own upgraded EVSE. In my imaginary world the LEAF would have a built in locking 20 amp extension cord on an automatic roll up reel and instead of over priced EVSE's everyone would be installing 20amp 240volt GFCI protected outlets.

This chart should help you understand how speed affects the range: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=101293" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

Don't despair! Yes, the range is variable. To max it out you need to be willing to use the tools the car has to help you develop good habits. That doesn't mean you can't have fun. A lot of these fears are exadurated before you own the Leaf and then they gradually drop into the background and are hardly noticeable as you get a feel for what it's capable of. I tend not to drive in the left lane but rarely do I get to cruise at a steady 70-75 MPH for a long stretch, which is where the range starts to decline appreciably. Getting the EVSE upgrade will allow you flexibility in charging options at work. This car will save you a lot of money in gas (hundreds a month), well enough to make it worth having a 240V line/outlet installed at work even if your boss won't help defray the costs. this car takes some adjustment but is a lot of fun to drive and is hands down the most fascinating vehicle I've ever owned and the most economical.

Has anyone done a round trip from Renton -> Tacoma? It's about 65 miles on the freeway and I'm too chicken to try it.

I did Bellevue->(Recharged to full)Seattle->Tacoma->Bellevue. It was ~85 miles from when I got a full charge but I think the only way I barely made it home was because there was traffic so it was mostly not at freeway speeds and I didn't go over the speed limit on the freeway. 65 miles on the freeway will be no problem.

Really? Too chicken to try a 65 mile drive? 65 miles to 85 miles is all I can expect to get out of a Leaf? My Leaf is on order due for a December delivery and now I'm rethinking if the car will even work for me. What happened to the 100+ miles?

I commute from Tacoma to Renton on Tuesdays, round trip its 55 miles, if I eat lunch in the office. The rest of the week I commute to Lacey which is 50 miles round trip.
The caveat for me is there may be a need for me to leave the office to fix a problem at a remote site. The area I cover extends to Centralia, Shelton and Aberdeen.
Has anyone attempted a drive from Tacoma to Centralia on a single charge and made it back? I think the total round trip would be 100 miles.

It would be nice if there was a trial offer on the Leaf. I would take it work a few times to see how reliable it would be in a real world commute. The last thing I want is to be gauge watching and worrying about being stuck on the freeway! :shock:

 

[IBELEAF]

Optimal speed is just one factor, living in Puget Sound we have to deal with ton of hills that has more effect on range especially going at freeway speeds. I am doing Bothell - Aiki tomorrow roughly 60 mile trip and kind of worried not making it if I have a side trip on top.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

what MkWh are you averaging?

Optimal speed is just one factor, living in Puget Sound we have to deal with ton of hills that has more effect on range especially going at freeway speeds. I am doing Bothell - Aiki tomorrow roughly 60 mile trip and kind of worried not making it if I have a side trip on top.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

5.5-5.8 in town 4.2-4.5 on the freeway

 

[IBELEAF]

5.5-5.8 in town 4.2-4.5 on the freeway

Is that without hills at 25 Mph and what about freeway speeds/hills? Seriously, this is totally unrealistic where I live. My freeway is at 3 MkWh tops at 60 mph in town I got as high as 4.8 MkWh.

I made the 50 mile drive today, avoided the freeway for some of the trip, driving all the way in ECO and keeping speeds below 60 mph, plus I got into traffic which helped a bit, so in the end my average was 4.7 and 4 bars remaining as I arrived home. I did not use lights or climate control.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

I average about 4.5 MkWh and don't see a big drop on the highway. We traveled with 2 adults and 2 children in our Leaf from Shoreline to Issaquah on 4 bars today, doing 57-63 mph, I-5 to 90. I had a chance to plug in at the destination so I didn't get a round trip figure but lots of hills and highway speeds. IBELIEF, what is the route where your MkWh drops to 3. if you want to throw it on a map on this thread or by PM I'd like to give it a try.

 

[IBELEAF]

My Bellevue to Lynnwood commute on 405 seems to be the worst so far. There are plenty of hills and a long one after 522 crossing at freeway speeds and I am usually going there under 65 mph.

 

[JohnnySebring]

To test range ability with my Leaf on freeways in the region around Seattle, I have a test loop to drive.

Start at 100% charge, D and ECO modes used as needed, climate control on Auto @ 68 deg, XM radio on. You must maintain the speed limit, but 55 is ok on the big hills if you don't impede others. You can exceed the limit down hill to make up for it.

From my house in zip 98199, I head east to I-5 Mercer Street on ramp (about 5 miles) and head north to the 405 exit
At 405, go south all the way to Renton and to I-5 north again.
I get off at the Mercer Street exit where I got on and head home.
Total distance is for me about 68 miles and I'm back in the barn with 1 or 2 bars (6 to 16 miles left) about an hour and a half later.

You can enter the loop anywhere to suit your starting point. I-90 and 520 are bailout routes across the lake if needed.
I reverse the direction each time, counter-clock loop is a bit more juice it seems.

Driving this loop gives me a good feel for and confidence in range calculations learned here on MNL. My normal commute is only 30 miles round trip on 520, so I have no concern for range @ 80% or much hyper-mile driving skill either. My daily average is only about 3.6.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

thanks IBELIEF and JohnnySebring. Johnny, thanks especially for your stats on the loop. I live on that route, maybe we should start a different thread to compare/track driving times/speeds/ambient temperature... all to give us Seattle Metro folks some benchmarks to test over time/seasons. The hills and all should make this a pretty decent test of range and driving skills. to get my 4.6 mkWh, I keep it down to two sometimes three bubbles on the "accelerometer" and within reason I try and break steadily to increase regen whenever safe.

 

[JohnnySebring]

I keep it down to two sometimes three bubbles on the "accelerometer" and within reason I try and break steadily to increase regen whenever safe.

You got that right, managing the bubbles is the big range factor. I'm not going to shutdown climate control for range (unless it amounted to all the range left!)

I like the idea of logging the drive stats to compare cars, driving styles and weather factors. We should try for several Leafs to rendezvous on the loop sometime. This drive is right on the edge of range and it's possible to not make it if you don't pay attention.

I have a portable 5kw generator and L2 charging capability and also a brother with a mini van to bring it to me as back up. So the first run had a self rescue plan.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

Let's do it, PM sent!

I keep it down to two sometimes three bubbles on the "accelerometer" and within reason I try and break steadily to increase regen whenever safe.

You got that right, managing the bubbles is the big range factor. I'm not going to shutdown climate control for range (unless it amounted to all the range left!)

I like the idea of logging the drive stats to compare cars, driving styles and weather factors. We should try for several Leafs to rendezvous on the loop sometime. This drive is right on the edge of range and it's possible to not make it if you don't pay attention.

I have a portable 5kw generator and L2 charging capability and also a brother with a mini van to bring it to me as back up. So the first run had a self rescue plan.

 

[rdhauser]

Local Nissan Dealer in Olympia is sponsoring a get together Sunday (Sept 25) from 1 to 3. I'm going to show up just to see other owners since the Tacoma & Seattle groups would only fit my schedule for special events. Hope you other south sounders can make it also. I know DaveinOlyWa would like to get a group organized.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Crap crap crap.. Have to work sunday. I need tochange my schedule

 

[ebill3]

This Saturday I plan to visit a friend in the Redmond Union Hill area. It is 46 miles one-way and mostly freeway, ending with that climb up the hill. I will be able to get a few hours L1 charge at his abode, but I doubt it will be enough for the return to Puyallup.

I realize there are several Nissan dealers along the route, and that there are public L2 stations in Redmond and Bellevue. I would appreciate any positive or negative comments on your experiences using those dealers or municipal facilities, or any other suggestions to make my first 'out of range' trip a success.

Bill

 

[downeykp]

Why would that be a problem. 92 miles round trip. 5 miles per hour while charging. If you only got 2 hours of charging that would be like reducing mileage to 82. 3 hours of charging would equal 77 miles. I would think that either option should get you home if you keep highway speeds reasonable. Good luck.

 

[QueenBee]

This Saturday I plan to visit a friend in the Redmond Union Hill area. It is 46 miles one-way and mostly freeway, ending with that climb up the hill. I will be able to get a few hours L1 charge at his abode, but I doubt it will be enough for the return to Puyallup.

So review http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=101293" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If you set your cruise control at exactly 60 and and leave a bar of extra for good measure (15 miles) that'll give you 67 miles of range leaving 25 miles of charge needed. So at roughly 5 miles (at 60 mph) per hour of level 1 charging you'd need 5 hours. Depending on how comfortable you are going into low battery you could definitely charge for only a few hours though.

 

[Packet]

This Saturday I plan to visit a friend in the Redmond Union Hill area. It is 46 miles one-way and mostly freeway, ending with that climb up the hill. I will be able to get a few hours L1 charge at his abode, but I doubt it will be enough for the return to Puyallup.

There are two ChargePoint L2 chargers tucked away in the parking lot of the Redmond Maintenance and Operations Center (MOC); though the parking lot is marked with signage as non-public, the two charging stations /are/ public (and there are signs marking them as public once you get in to the parking lot). That's right smack at the bottom of Union Hill, a block from the Fred Meyer and Target; you can find the chargers on the ChargePoint map, and they're also marked on Recargo and PlugShare.

When I'm heading back from the stables, if I need to top off before heading across the lake that's where I tend to do it; it's right at the bottom of the hill, and I can walk over to Fred Meyer and get a bite to eat or whatever while I wait. That's my recommendation on where to go if you need a quick top-up; unlike the Redmond Town Hall ones a short ways away, they're almost always unused. (Though in fairness, RTH gives you a lot more right within walking distance.)

 

[ebill3]

Thanks for the replies, folks.

Yep, I can do the numbers and have Tony's mileage chart, and maybe I'll get enough L1 charge.
But, having been a "fill at quarter tank ICE driver" for more years than I care to admit, I'd like a little cushion until I get re-trained. :lol:

Thanks for the info on the Redmond MOC locations. I had noted them, but wondered about their availability, especially on weekends. I'll probably grab a few miles there on the way home.

Bill

 

[sirfergy]

So an update on my Renton -> Tacoma roundtrip question, loaded the Leaf up with the family (2 adults, 2 kids) and headed down. Drove in ECO with A/C on going about 63mph the whole trip of 60 miles. Made it home with three bars remaining!