OrientExpress
Well-known member
The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
OrientExpress said:The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
What is this 'fully equipped' LEAF you speak of ?OrientExpress said:The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
Lucky me: RWD plus snow tires works really well here, as you well know. However, I can't use the federal tax credit because my income is much too low. I waited to April 1st to place my reservation so that others can be ahead of me and take advantage of the federal tax credit since I can't.abasile said:310 miles of range for $44k is pretty sweet! The larger battery is a little more expensive than I'd expected, but for more range - We're happy to see that it's actually more than 300 miles. With a coefficient of drag of only 0.23 (okay, not the hoped-for 0.21, but still impressive), the range at 80mph should be quite good.
Our only disappointment is that dual motor AWD is delayed to "Spring 2018". Given our reservation number (a 3/31/16 reservation made right after the initial reveal), the Tesla website provides the following delivery estimates:
"First production" - $49k including larger battery and the $5k option package - Oct.-Dec. 2017
"Standard battery" - $35k - Dec. 2017 - Feb. 2018
"Dual motor all wheel drive" - Choice of 220 or 310 mile range - Aug.-Oct. 2018
So, about ten months' more waiting for an AWD model, with the risk of missing out on all or part of the federal $7500 tax credit. And probably a bit less than $5k to add AWD. Hmm. Does our family need AWD badly enough to wait longer and pay maybe $10k more? Darn California snow chain rules! If we instead lived in the mountains of CO or NV, we'd almost certainly drop the AWD and just buy some dedicated snow tires. That said, I think the Model 3 is worth its price tag even without government incentives.
I'll disagree a little. My S60 starts tapering long before 50% and takes twice as long to charge — given the slower charging and the need to charge to a much higher SOC — than a bigger battery car. Some Supercharger legs are currently 140+ miles and at highway speeds they take considerably more than the rated miles, so that means charging to a pretty high SOC in a car with a standard battery, especially if using heat or AC. Those longer Supercharger legs should get filled in eventually, but for now it would take a pretty long Supercharge in a standard battery car to make them.Graffi said:...On our recent 7,000 mile cross-country trip we would drive for 1 to 1.5 hours then stop for 10 to 20 minutes (potty break and walk around to get the blood flowing to our legs and feet). We would always charge to at least 50%, sometimes to 60% or 70%, but rarely more than that. For those who do not know, the Supercharger gives you full charge speed up to 50%, then starts to slow down the closer you get to 100%. For travel with the Supercharger network you only need enough charge to get to the next Supercharger (plus a little safety margin for head-wind, and excess speed).
We never had to just sit there and wait for charge to get high enough. With the Tesla Model 3 charged to 50% you still get 110 miles. Even with a 30 mile reserve, you still have 80 miles of range which will get you to almost all the Superchargers on your route. If you need more, just charge more. If you don't, then charge to 50% and be on your way. In my opinion there really is no need for the 310 mile range version unless you have specific long distance trips off the Interstate highways that you would like to just drive for 250 to 300 miles, then stop...
dgpcolorado said:I'll disagree a little. My S60 starts tapering long before 50% and takes twice as long to charge — given the slower charging and the need to charge to a much higher SOC — than a bigger battery car. Some Supercharger legs are currently 140+ miles and at highway speeds they take considerably more than the rated miles, so that means charging to a pretty high SOC in a car with a standard battery, especially if using heat or AC. Those longer Supercharger legs should get filled in eventually, but for now it would take a pretty long Supercharge in a standard battery car to make them.Graffi said:...On our recent 7,000 mile cross-country trip we would drive for 1 to 1.5 hours then stop for 10 to 20 minutes (potty break and walk around to get the blood flowing to our legs and feet). We would always charge to at least 50%, sometimes to 60% or 70%, but rarely more than that. For those who do not know, the Supercharger gives you full charge speed up to 50%, then starts to slow down the closer you get to 100%. For travel with the Supercharger network you only need enough charge to get to the next Supercharger (plus a little safety margin for head-wind, and excess speed).
We never had to just sit there and wait for charge to get high enough. With the Tesla Model 3 charged to 50% you still get 110 miles. Even with a 30 mile reserve, you still have 80 miles of range which will get you to almost all the Superchargers on your route. If you need more, just charge more. If you don't, then charge to 50% and be on your way. In my opinion there really is no need for the 310 mile range version unless you have specific long distance trips off the Interstate highways that you would like to just drive for 250 to 300 miles, then stop...
I think the "standard" battery car would be fine for those who only do occasional road trips or those in no particular hurry when doing so — I fit this latter category. For serious road tripping get the "long range" battery.
SageBrush said:What is this 'fully equipped' LEAF you speak of ?OrientExpress said:The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
https://www.tesla.com/support/model-3-reservations-faqWill there still be a $35,000 Model 3 option?
Yes. Our first production Model 3 vehicles are preconfigured to ensure a smooth production ramp so that we can deliver more cars to more customers at a faster pace. The beginning configuration is a Long Range Battery with rear-wheel drive and premium upgrades, starting at $49,000. These vehicles come with three options for customization: wheel size, exterior color and Autopilot features.
Additional configurations, including the Model 3 with standard equipment for $35,000, will become available as production ramps, which we expect to be in November 2017.
We are shipping our first cars to employees now and expect to begin shipping the Long Range Battery configuration to customers in late October. The Standard Battery configuration will be available very soon thereafter.
edatoakrun said:The only surprise in last night's event, was that there were no surprises...
When and if TSLA starts to build them:OrientExpress said:Big takeaways, first cars are $44K.
$35K will get you a black car with black cloth interior....
http://insideevs.com/tesla-model-3-specs/...The base Tesla Model 3 was confirmed to have a price of $35,000...with deliveries to start in the Fall/November 2017...
And if production is not quickly terminated due to "lack of demand", which you may recall was the excuse given by TSLA after having sold only a handful of the "~$50k" versions of the S.
Is there a way to accelerate my Model 3 invitation and delivery?
Tesla owners receive priority Model 3 orders, so you can accelerate your Model 3 invitation and delivery by purchasing a Model S or Model X first...
Graffi said:Elon did say that the number of Superchargers will triple by the end of 2018 when so many of the Model 3's will just begin their life. So the distance between Superchargers should be shorter by then.
OrientExpress said:The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
Graffi said:OrientExpress said:The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
If it is for Local Driving only, then get the Leaf. If you wish to use it for long cross-country vacation driving then get the Tesla. Even the 200+ mile Leaf can not be practical for trips greater than 300 miles. jmho
You just might want to hold off that decision until you can actually see the $35k model 3, as opposed to the over-$50k model 3s shown last night.TomT said:It is an easy decision for me: Model 3!
OrientExpress said:The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
edatoakrun said:Will there still be a $35,000 Model 3 option?
Yes. Our first production Model 3 vehicles are preconfigured to ensure a smooth production ramp so that we can deliver more cars to more customers at a faster pace. The beginning configuration is a Long Range Battery with rear-wheel drive and premium upgrades, starting at $49,000. These vehicles come with three options for customization: wheel size, exterior color and Autopilot features.
Additional configurations, including the Model 3 with standard equipment for $35,000, will become available as production ramps, which we expect to be in November 2017.
We are shipping our first cars to employees now and expect to begin shipping the Long Range Battery configuration to customers in late October. The Standard Battery configuration will be available very soon thereafter.
You just might want to hold off that decision until you can actually see the $35k model 3, as opposed to the over-$50k model 3s shown last night.edatoakrun said:OrientExpress said:The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
webeleafowners said:Graffi said:OrientExpress said:The question that many will have to ponder is: "do I get a barebones Tesla for $35K or a fully equipped LEAF for the same price?"
If it is for Local Driving only, then get the Leaf. If you wish to use it for long cross-country vacation driving, then get the Tesla. Even the 200+ mile Leaf can not be practical for trips greater than 300 miles. jmho
Just curious. Why wouldn't a 200-mile leaf be practical for trips of 300 or greater miles?
For business travel over 300 miles, I agree that it usually makes sense to fly rather than drive. However, I wouldn't be too quick to count out ground transportation. A great many of us appreciate our long-range cars.OrientExpress said:Personally, if I am going 300+ miles on a trip like to LA or Vegas, I'm going to fly. It is cheaper, less stressful, and much faster. 80% of automobile travel is less than 50 miles, 10% is between 50 and 100 miles, and the rest is greater than 100 miles.
Yes, limited-range EVs can be extremely useful, particularly when owned by families with multiple vehicles. However, I cannot agree that it's "old fashioned" to desire 200+ miles of range. Here in Southern California, it's not at all uncommon to take day trips to destinations that involve 100+ miles of travel each way. It's ideal when we can charge at each destination, but that's quite often not the case. Sure, in our part of the country, we have the luxury of being able to stop and fast charge a sub 200 mile EV, but it's so much nicer to not need to bother (I speak from experience both ways!).OrientExpress said:The desire for 200+ miles of range is an old fashioned metric from legacy ICE travel. Today an EV with 100-150~200 miles of range is perfect because every night the car is recharged to its full range. Does it make sense to add $5-9K worth of extra capacity that you may only use a few times a year? I don't think so. Of course, there are exceptions to this, and for those edge cases, a conventional ICE or PHEV vehicle may be the better choice.
I would agree with that characterization of CHAdeMO and CCS fast charging. However, Tesla Superchargers have proven to be quite reliable and they facilitate an amazing variety of cross country travel. Sure they aren't 100% perfect and there have been lines at some Superchargers, but I would not characterize the Supercharger network as being in its infancy - it's actually quite impressive.OrientExpress said:Long distance charging infrastructure is still in its infancy, with reliability and availability spotty regardless if it is a Supercharger or a Fast charger.
You just might want to hold off that decision until you can actually see the $35k Model 3, as opposed to the over-$50k Model 3s shown last night.
We may actually see the LEAF gen 2, including full specs and prices before that happens.
Wow, OE can spin it. Certainly Tesla is way beyond infancy. Grey is supposed to be 2017. Lot of construction cones showing only what is known crowd sourced. Last night Elon stated the superchargers would triple by the end of 2018 (see SC thread).abasile said:I would agree with that characterization of CHAdeMO and CCS fast charging. However, Tesla Superchargers have proven to be quite reliable and they facilitate an amazing variety of cross country travel. Sure they aren't 100% perfect and there have been lines at some Superchargers, but I would not characterize the Supercharger network as being in its infancy - it's actually quite impressive.OrientExpress said:Long distance charging infrastructure is still in its infancy, with reliability and availability spotty regardless if it is a Supercharger or a Fast charger.
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