Ok to take my leaf home with NO Charger yet?

[abasile]

I'm getting over 2800 watt from my modified EVSE. Thats 2800/3300 = 85% of the full charger rating. I don't have an EVSE that can let the onboard charger pull its full capacity to see if it is underrated, but if it is rated to the specification than the EVSE upgrade gives you 85% and not 75% as you noted. Just noting this to help others make a decision. That extra 10% makes a difference.

With a standard Level 2 EVSE wired to 240 V service, the LEAF actually charges at about 3.7 or 3.8 kW. 2800/3800 = 74%

 

[garygid]

1. Correct, the "3.3 kW" designation for the charger in the LEAF is
just a "nominal" value, not what it actually draws from the wall.

2. The AV unit offers a max of 30 amps, not 32, but requires a 40-amp
breaker and circuit. A 12-amp unit requires only a 15-amp breaker.
A 16-amp unit requires at least a 20-amp breaker and circuit.

 

[smilingbee]

Thanks for making me aware of the possibility of converting the included 110v cord to 220/240v. It was a "WOW" moment for me when I read that. Nissan should have just made the cord the way the folks at EVSEupgrade are retro-fitting it. Here is my understanding of the pros and cons of upgrading the EVSE vs installing an L2 unit in my house:

Pros:
* Much cheaper ($1500+ savings over installed L2 unit)
* Portable

Cons:
* Rate of charge is only 75% of the installed L2 unit (12a/16a = 75%)
* Would require unplugging/plugging cords every time I want to use my dryer. I don't have an unused dryer outlet.

Did I miss anything?

 

[planet4ever]

LEAF Owner's Manual page CH-7 states "Trickle charging is not recommended for regular use". Trickle here means charging with the supplied the cable under 110-120 volt. I always thought slower charging is better for the battery. Or may be the 7 hours Level 2 charging is slow enough. Can anyone comment on this?

The disclosure form we had to sign before we took our new LEAF home covers Nissan's concerns in more detail:

Trickle Charge. Although not recommended for regular use, a dedicated 120V outlet may be used with the supplied charging cord or an SAE J1772 compliant cord. Charging by this method will take much longer than 240V charging. Warning: to protect against electrical hazard, serious personal injury or death: (1) Do not plug in the charging cord until it [ed: I think they mean the outlet] is inspected by a licensed electrician to confirm that the electrical circuit can accept a continuous 12 amp draw and (2) Do not use this charging cord in structures more than 40 years old, or structures using fuse-based circuit protection, and use only with an electrical circuit protected by a dedicated circuit breaker.

 

[planet4ever]

Would require unplugging/plugging cords every time I want to use my dryer. I don't have an unused dryer outlet.

I wouldn't recommend unplugging/plugging that much. The correct solution is to have an electrician run a new 20A circuit terminated by an L6-20R outlet. If your breaker panel is in the garage, and isn't full, that shouldn't be very expensive.

If that isn't practical, and I was in your shoes, I might do something myself on the QT that is not according to code. I'd go down to Home Depot, pick up a surface mount box, an L6-20R outlet, and a foot each of black, red, and green #12 wire. I'd install that right next to the dryer outlet, leave the EVSE plugged into it all the time, and tell the family not to use the dryer when the car is plugged in. Worst case: If both are using power at the same time the breaker will trip. Hopefully the wet clothes will be discovered before the under-charged car in the morning.

Ray

P.S. Forgot to mention the cover plate for the box. But I expect the parts would still be under $30. As for meeting code, no, putting a 20A breaker in the car side of the circuit wouldn't do it. You still have the potential of 50A on a supposedly dedicated 30A circuit.

 

[smkettner]

Code might require a 20a breaker between the 30a circuit and the 20a connector.

 

[smilingbee]

Would require unplugging/plugging cords every time I want to use my dryer. I don't have an unused dryer outlet.

I wouldn't recommend unplugging/plugging that much. The correct solution is to have an electrician run a new 20A circuit terminated by an L6-20R outlet. If your breaker panel is in the garage, and isn't full, that shouldn't be very expensive.

If that isn't practical, and I was in your shoes, I might do something myself on the QT that is not according to code. I'd go down to Home Depot, pick up a surface mount box, an L6-20R outlet, and a foot each of black, red, and green #12 wire. I'd install that right next to the dryer outlet, leave the EVSE plugged into it all the time, and tell the family not to use the dryer when the car is plugged in. Worst case: If both are using power at the same time the breaker will trip. Hopefully the wet clothes will be discovered before the under-charged car in the morning.

Ray

P.S. Forgot to mention the cover plate for the box. But I expect the parts would still be under $30. As for meeting code, no, putting a 20A breaker in the car side of the circuit wouldn't do it. You still have the potential of 50A on a supposedly dedicated 30A circuit.

Thanks for the suggestion, Ray. My breaker panel is in the garage and isn't full. The panel is on a wall about 15 feet of wall-length away from the current dryer outlet. I'll have to get some quotes to see how much this would cost. Like you, I'm in Silicon Valley.

 

[palmermd]

I'm getting over 2800 watt from my modified EVSE. Thats 2800/3300 = 85% of the full charger rating. I don't have an EVSE that can let the onboard charger pull its full capacity to see if it is underrated, but if it is rated to the specification than the EVSE upgrade gives you 85% and not 75% as you noted. Just noting this to help others make a decision. That extra 10% makes a difference.

With a standard Level 2 EVSE wired to 240 V service, the LEAF actually charges at about 3.7 or 3.8 kW. 2800/3800 = 74%

I'm happy to hear that it is underrated. Thanks for the correction. 10% makes a difference. Still not enough to get me to want a fixed evse for my garage, but perhaps for others it is.

 

[Volusiano]

Thanks for making me aware of the possibility of converting the included 110v cord to 220/240v. It was a "WOW" moment for me when I read that. Nissan should have just made the cord the way the folks at EVSEupgrade are retro-fitting it. Here is my understanding of the pros and cons of upgrading the EVSE vs installing an L2 unit in my house:

Pros:
* Much cheaper ($1500+ savings over installed L2 unit)
* Portable

Cons:
* Rate of charge is only 75% of the installed L2 unit (12a/16a = 75%)
* Would require unplugging/plugging cords every time I want to use my dryer. I don't have an unused dryer outlet.

Did I miss anything?

Well, the permanent L2 unit will have a standby draw of 15W easily (if not more in some cases), while the modified EVSE will have a minimal stand by draw of only about 1.5W or so. So here's another pro.

The permanent L2 will most likely have internet connection and a built-in timer and data collection. But none of this is a big deal since you can use the timer in the LEAF's built-in charger as well, and Carwings keeps stats for you as well. Very minor con here.

If you use the modified EVSE as a permanent solution, you'll most likely leave it at home on a daily basis and therefore will be driving around town without a portable backup charger in case of emergency when you're out of juice. But if you anticipate the need, you can always unplug and bring it with you when you need to, so it's not a big deal. So this is a legit but small con.

 

[garygid]

I bought a 2nd Mod-L1 EVSE to:

1. avoid having the last "con" (no emergency EVSE if you left it on the wall in the garage).

2. have an immediate spare in case one EVSE dies, is lost, stolen, vandalized, etc.

 

[abasile]

My primary reason to purchase the AV EVSE was convenience. I don't want to have to move the modified EVSE back and forth between the trunk and a 240V outlet every day, and particularly as I'm not the only one driving the car, keeping things as simple as possible is worth something.

Also, my situation is somewhat out of the norm in that I do not have a garage, just a driveway in front of the house. The AV EVSE is weather rated and the modified EVSE is not.

By the way, if anyone would like to drive their LEAF up to the San Bernardino Mountains, I would be happy to make our charging dock available.

 

[garygid]

I would love to visit, but we need a QC at/near the base of the mountain because Maple is just about empty after we drive from Laguna Hills to get near the mountain.

 

[planet4ever]

My primary reason to purchase the AV EVSE was convenience. I don't want to have to move the modified EVSE back and forth between the trunk and a 240V outlet every day, and particularly as I'm not the only one driving the car, keeping things as simple as possible is worth something.

You can buy an additional EVSE from Phil, already upgraded, for $750. Gary and I are among a number of others who have done that. I leave mine plugged in at home nearly all of the time, and carry the unmodified EVSE that Nissan supplied in the car. Just as simple as having an AV EVSE, but $200 cheaper (even if you install the AV unit yourself) and better quality. The bonus being, of course, that if I want to take the 240V unit with me, I can, no problem.

Also, my situation is somewhat out of the norm in that I do not have a garage, just a driveway in front of the house. The AV EVSE is weather rated and the modified EVSE is not.

Who says? The only restriction in the instructions that came with the Nissan unit was that the control box should not be submerged in water. The only restriction in the LEAF user manual is that a waterproof socket should be used. Phil reseals the EVSE box, and it frankly looks more watertight to me than the original. I, too, park in the driveway, and I have installed an L6-20 receptacle outdoors in a weather-protective enclosure.

Ray

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

i never carry my 120 EVSE with me. when out and about, u simply need to know where you can plug in. i have enough Nissan dealers North of me that i have no worries. going South is a bit dicey at this point, but there is minimal need to go that direction nor is there much to plug into either

 

[abasile]

The AV EVSE is weather rated and the modified EVSE is not.

I stand corrected on this, and apologize for any confusion my statement might have caused. I thought that I remembered reading that the modified EVSE should only be used in dry conditions. But I searched for a statement to that effect and found the following instead:

2. Yes, we are very careful about resealing everything. Everything is re-sealed with a top-grade GE silicone rated for high thermal conductivity and dielectric strength. The original design is potted for weather resistance, and we believe our upgrade preserves or even betters this protection.

i never carry my 120 EVSE with me. when out and about, u simply need to know where you can plug in.

Makes sense. However, in our mountain location (which is not populous enough to support a new car dealer), I think it is best to carry a backup EVSE. There are a number of places I could plug in if needed. I even have permission from the general manager of a local gas station, as we attend church together and he really enjoyed the ride I gave him in our LEAF! I'm encouraging him to install a J1772 charging dock...

I would love to visit, but we need a QC at/near the base of the mountain because Maple is just about empty after we drive from Laguna Hills to get near the mountain.

A QC at the base of the mountain would not come a day too soon! Our first LEAF visitor could very well end up being tbleakne once he gets his car. His home is quite a bit closer to us (still 50+ miles).

 

[kawh]

thanks everyone.

you were a big help. in fact, when i asked my dealer this question, he called a few days later and gave me a link to my VERY OWN QUESTION and all of the answers... and said, "here-- i got your answer!"

in fact, we just got our charger about a week ago. charging by plugging it into the wall worked just fine for the 2 months. i just plugged it in when i got home and it was always charged to 80% by morning. (that was in the regular outlet.) as for the above question-- i'm not sure whether the plug goes into a dryer outlet-- but i'm sure you have a regular outlet in your garage as well??

thanks again-- kawh

 

[cwerdna]

in fact, we just got our charger about a week ago. charging by plugging it into the wall worked just fine for the 2 months...

I think you meant to say you got a 240 volt L2 EVSE installed at home. You've had a charger all along. It's inside the car.

The EVSE you got installed and the 120 volt L1 EVSE ("trickle charge cable" ) that came w/the car are not chargers.

 

[marccbr]

Would require unplugging/plugging cords every time I want to use my dryer. I don't have an unused dryer outlet.

I wouldn't recommend unplugging/plugging that much. The correct solution is to have an electrician run a new 20A circuit terminated by an L6-20R outlet. If your breaker panel is in the garage, and isn't full, that shouldn't be very expensive.

If that isn't practical, and I was in your shoes, I might do something myself on the QT that is not according to code. I'd go down to Home Depot, pick up a surface mount box, an L6-20R outlet, and a foot each of black, red, and green #12 wire. I'd install that right next to the dryer outlet, leave the EVSE plugged into it all the time, and tell the family not to use the dryer when the car is plugged in. Worst case: If both are using power at the same time the breaker will trip. Hopefully the wet clothes will be discovered before the under-charged car in the morning.

Ray

P.S. Forgot to mention the cover plate for the box. But I expect the parts would still be under $30. As for meeting code, no, putting a 20A breaker in the car side of the circuit wouldn't do it. You still have the potential of 50A on a supposedly dedicated 30A circuit.

I have a used 3 prong 30 amp dryer connection on the otherside of my garage wall is it possible to share that circuit with a L6-20R? Would like to install a Levitron 160 and since its a rental, I hate to run a line from the box all the way across the house. Of course I would make sure not to run both the EVSE and the Dry at the same time. Also if it is possible would it be legal in most places?

 

[Volusiano]

I have a used 3 prong 30 amp dryer connection on the otherside of my garage wall is it possible to share that circuit with a L6-20R? Would like to install a Levitron 160 and since its a rental, I hate to run a line from the box all the way across the house. Of course I would make sure not to run both the EVSE and the Dry at the same time. Also if it is possible would it be legal in most places?

I don't see anything illegal with shared circuits. If you forget and run both appliances at the same time, you'll just end up popping the breaker.

 

[davewill]

I have a used 3 prong 30 amp dryer connection on the otherside of my garage wall is it possible to share that circuit with a L6-20R? Would like to install a Levitron 160 and since its a rental, I hate to run a line from the box all the way across the house. Of course I would make sure not to run both the EVSE and the Dry at the same time. Also if it is possible would it be legal in most places?

I don't see anything illegal with shared circuits. If you forget and run both appliances at the same time, you'll just end up popping the breaker.

Could he have a problem with the dryer using the green wire as a neutral and the EVSE trying to use it as a ground? The dryer may have control circuits that run at 120v all the time. We get away with that when plugging into an unused dryer circuit, but in this case I'd think you'd need a dedicated ground wire going back to the panel.