"Pure EVs" and other plug-ins

[DANandNAN]

I didn't start this thread. I did not chose this topic. Clearly evnow started this "pure EV" topic. Since a mod started this thread, can a mod close it?

68kW is still weak. It's weak compared to the Leaf @ 80, it's really weak compared to the Volt @ 111kW but it's stronger than the i-MiEV @ 49 :lol: So, it'll be even slower than a Leaf unless you use the gas engine. Range is another weak point. We'd burn a lot of gas on a daily basis with it (our Volt is 95% electric). The FCME is better than the PiP, but so is a Segway Meh, not impressed. If they'd made it an EREV or forgone the engine I'd be interested.

I guess if you were considering a PiP you'd probably jump.

Rather myopic statements - there is more to a car than kW ratings. My wife couldn't care less about kW ratings.

Energi is a plugin that gives higher seating and more space - something that neither PIP, nor Volt give. It puts Energi in a new category - with Mitsu Outlander Plugin as the only known competitor.

It would have been myopic, except that I replied to posts about the power and motor.

If you like the car, and your wife likes the car that's great. From an EV prospective I don't. Toyota, Honda and Ford all had time to see all the hard work that GM, Nissan, Tesla & Fiskar put in. The gauntlet has been laid, right? It's been several years, time to show what they can do. And, they all come out with rinky-dink cars that burn gas at the first chance they get. None put a real motor in it - one that can propel or accelerate the car at any setting without gas assistance. None put a battery in theirs that's worth a darn - sure the FCME is better than the PiP but ... LOL. Basically it's another hybrid with a plug. Impressive innovation? Nope. I equate it more to putting lipstick on a pig. Someone guestimated the FCME would see 15 EV miles out of the forecasted 20, I'm guessing it'll be much close to the PiP max of 11.

If this was 5 years ago I'd be impressed, it would be a great stepping stone. Now it's just a step back.

 

[evnow]

From an EV prospective I don't.

Well, you like hybrids from an EV perspective ? :lol:

Volt fans are trying too hard to differentiate. The world doesn't care. Afterall, Volt isn't a pure serial hybrid either.

If you want an EV, get a pure EV.

 

[DANandNAN]

evnow,
LOL, they differentiate themselves. But, for the uninitiated, the Volt will go 0-60 much faster in EV (and it’s faster than the Leaf). The Volt will accelerate to 100 in EV (again, faster than the Leaf). The Volt will travel 40+ miles in EV, more than double what the FCME will do (and more than enough for the average Leafers daily drive).

LOL, “pure EV”. Nissan doesn’t sell one. They sell a Range-Limited BEV who’s “oops plan” is a tow-truck, owning/leasing a 2nd vehicle or begging for $40,000-$100,000 government handouts for L3 stations that almost no Leafer will pay actual cost to use. 65 miles of range definitely doesn’t qualify as a “pure EV” (what’s the Segway range again? :lol: ). For a “pure EV” I’d have to spend $95K with Telsa – Nissan only sells a RLBEV. And, we want to get a Leaf or FFE, but I'm not blind to the facts. Maybe if we own one we'll become obtuse fans.

grommet,
Sorry, but I give the EPA ratings very little credence when it comes to EV. The PiP is supposed to get a max of 11, yet many report half of that. Expecting a real-world reduction of the estimated 20 mile range is par for the course.

 

[TomT]

I do love Dan's alternate reality! I pay it absolutely no heed, but I do love the laughs I get from reading it! :lol:

LOL, “pure EV”. Nissan doesn’t sell one.

 

[grommet]

DANandNAN, the EPA EV-only range for the Prius Plug-in is 6 miles. It's on the window sticker, and the owners I know always exceed this. For Volt, it's 35... and it's often exceeded as well.

And for pure EVs, I've always found the EPA ranges as fair representations as well. I regularly exceed the 73 EPA in the LEAF, and the one deep pocket early Tesla Model S (85 kWh) owner I know was able to hit 260 miles on a single charge (with some spirited driving), which is just under the EPA range of 265.

I'll just ignore the other ridiculous commentary... ;-)

 

[DANandNAN]

So wait, 95% of Leaf owners don't own/rent/lease another vehicle because the Leaf's range is way too little to be someones (or a families) only vehicle(s)?

Definition of pure:

• not mixed: not mixed with any other substance
  free from contamination: clean and free from impurities
  complete: sheer or complete

The Leaf requires 95% of owners to rent/lease/borrow another vehicle because it's a RLBEV. How can it be considered a "pure EV" except for the 5%? How about a quick show of hands for those of you who have not, ever, rented/borrowed/owned/leased an ICE since buying a RLBEV?

Darn it, there I go injecting reason and objective thinking into the mob (fanboy) mentality.

Also, Toyota is still claiming up to 11 miles.

 

[DANandNAN]

I didn't start this thread. I did not chose this topic. Clearly evnow started this "pure EV" topic. Since a mod started this thread, can a mod close it?

 

[evnow]

LOL, “pure EV”. Nissan doesn’t sell one. They sell a Range-Limited BEV who’s “oops plan” is a tow-truck....

You can't redfine pure EV the way that suits you. BEV is the pure EV.

What you don't seem to understand (or pretend not to) is that there are various ways to reduce oil consumption. BEV, serial PHEV, Volt, Parallel PHEV or some combination are all welcome. I'm grateful for the existance of all of them. Would I have preferred Energi to have been a serial PHEV with 100 mile EV range ? You bet. But that is not where the economics are today.

Ford came out with a PHEV that has double the EV range than PIP, is bigger and yet quite close to PIP in gas mileage. They even priced it competitively (unlike FFE).

We should celebrate the fact.

 

[TonyWilliams]

LOL, “pure EV”. Nissan doesn’t sell one. They sell a Range-Limited BEV who’s “oops plan” is a tow-truck....

You can't redfine pure EV the way that suits you. BEV is the pure EV.

Dan is making me sad that I have him blocked!!! Always worth a laugh.

 

[Stoaty]

LOL, “pure EV”. Nissan doesn’t sell one.

I must have missed the part of the manual that describes where the gas tank is located. :lol: Or perhaps the concern is that the Leaf will mate with an ICE vehicle you happen to own and become "impure". Maybe that is how the Volt came into being. Fortunately, I have a steel cage around the battery pack to prevent such "mating"... kind of a chastity belt for the Leaf.

 

[ztanos]

LEAF works for me as a "pure" EV. If I need to go more than 70 miles it means I am visiting family. Family lives 800 miles away, so no EV would work for me (even though, technically, they all would... just would take a little longer.) Therefore, there is either no EV on the market, per your argument. Or all the EVs work and I take a plane. Hmmm.... seems like the plane is quicker than the quick refill gas stations, so I guess that even those are slow when comparing it to something quicker.