80% or 100% charge?
- Thread starter evmike
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Bassman
Well-known member
Longer Range 100%
jcesare
Well-known member
80% for my daily commute (known routine).evmike said:
100% for Saturday when I need to run around doing who knows what.
Azrich
Well-known member
Same as jcesare, with sometimes 100% for Sunday if I know of things we need to do. Last weekend we didn't go anywhere so no charging on Sat or Sun night.
DarkStar
Well-known member
Since the credit union won't let me only pay 80% of my monthly payment when I charge to 80%, I charge to 100%.evmike said:
Randy
Well-known member
Bought the car, so I'm interested in maximizing battery life...
I charge to 80% using the Leaf timer (midnight to 5am for the lower rates), and occasionally charge to 100% if a longer trip is on tap for that day.
I also get the side benefit of the increased regen when starting out from home at 80%, as we live on a slight hill.
Randy
I charge to 80% using the Leaf timer (midnight to 5am for the lower rates), and occasionally charge to 100% if a longer trip is on tap for that day.
I also get the side benefit of the increased regen when starting out from home at 80%, as we live on a slight hill.
Randy
Ready2plugin
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I bought the car as well, but since the software "upgrade" I get home with only 2 bars remaining on a full charge (it use to be 4)...so 100%, 100% of the time for me!
IBELEAF
Well-known member
80% charging 100% of the time :lol:
evmike said:
I've sworn off driving my Leaf on the freeway. So I'd been charging at 80% like a good boy. But just for kicks, I charged to 100% last night to see what would happen to my Old Man Slow city range.
Well, I just returned from 4 trips of about 6 miles each. All were driven in geriatric mode on surface streets. I left with 100% charge and a 112 mile range in ECO. As it sits in the garage rat now, it's showing 92% charge with 111 miles of range.
Now I'm really confused.
Could there be something other than 80% or 100%? Such as, OK for 100% if you don't rapidly deplete the cells in heavy freeway, hills or A/C use?
My first day to work with my Leaf. Charged it overnight to 100%. Started the drive with 112 miles range. My work is 21 miles from home. When I reached work, the range left was 65, and now after my return it is 25. I have one white bar left. 70% of my drive is on 5 frwy. Seems like a 50 mile round trip commute is what one can safely do without range anxiety setting in. Its lower than I expected, but serves my commute.
DaveinOlyWA
Well-known member
neither. i charge it up to what i need it for. that can be 50-90%. this morning was charged to 100% for first time in 3 weeks. my SO wont take it on her 60 mile RT commute unless its full.
now, i have a meeting after work tomorros, so will do a total of about 55 miles RT. at 120 volts, it will only be charged to about 85% by tomorrow morning. i should be able to make it without too much trouble
now, i have a meeting after work tomorros, so will do a total of about 55 miles RT. at 120 volts, it will only be charged to about 85% by tomorrow morning. i should be able to make it without too much trouble
evnow
Well-known member
sksingh said:
What was your speed ?
Gonewild
Well-known member
I charge daily to 100% and weekends to 80% or less. Most weekends I only charge 1 day about half way because I don't need the extra miles.
Boomer23
Well-known member
When I got the car a month ago, I routinely charged at 80% since our intended use of the LEAF was just for local errands and fun driving (retired, no commute). In fact, some nights I wouldn't charge at all if I had 6 bars or so remaining. Then a few times, I wanted to use the car on a whim and there wasn't enough of a charge remaining, so we had to drive the Prius.
Mrs. Boomer suggested we charge to 100% routinely to avoid occasional disappointment, so that's what we do now.
Here's another reason that I just tumbled to, though (I admit to being slow on occasion, well usually ). It makes good sense to charge to 100% nightly if your LEAF is one of two cars in your family because life is unpredictable. We don't intend to drive the LEAF on a 70 mile one way trip, but we might need to unexpectedly if someone in the family needs help, or whatever. We have several family members who live between 45 and 70 miles away, too far for a round trip, but close enough for a one way trip in case the other car is unavailable for some reason.
To paraphrase a common truism, we might need to drive the LEAF first and ask questions about where we're going to recharge for the return trip later.
Mrs. Boomer suggested we charge to 100% routinely to avoid occasional disappointment, so that's what we do now.
Here's another reason that I just tumbled to, though (I admit to being slow on occasion, well usually
). It makes good sense to charge to 100% nightly if your LEAF is one of two cars in your family because life is unpredictable. We don't intend to drive the LEAF on a 70 mile one way trip, but we might need to unexpectedly if someone in the family needs help, or whatever. We have several family members who live between 45 and 70 miles away, too far for a round trip, but close enough for a one way trip in case the other car is unavailable for some reason. To paraphrase a common truism, we might need to drive the LEAF first and ask questions about where we're going to recharge for the return trip later.
sdbonez
Well-known member
sksingh said:
I'm in exactly the same circumstance except with I-15 for 70% of my 50mile roundtrip commute. I still haven't charged at 80% because I think I'll be cutting it too close... also lower than I expected (~25miles after my commute)
Volusiano
Well-known member
The question is do you really buy more longevity if you only charge up to what you need it for? Especially in the case of leaving it (or charging it) at only 50% as opposed to at 80%. I personally don't think you buy any more longevity.DaveinOlyWA said:
Nissan only says 80% is better for longevity as opposed to 100%. Nissan never said that anything lower than 80% is even better. That's only a deduction from owners that may not be true. It may actually be the reverse that you're doing more harm by not topping off at 80% every night. I've heard from other sources that Lithium Manganese chemistry likes to be in the topped off condition as soon as possible after use.
Nissan never clarifies this point, but I think it's safe to say that it's because Nissan assumes it's not necessary to clarify because most people would want to top off to 80% every night anyway so that they can have the optimal range at their disposal the next day, regardless of whether they'll need the whole 80% or not, just in case.
If topping off at even lower than 80% would have really increased your battery even further, I'm sure Nissan would have made it a point to let users know so they can choose between charging to optimize for life or for range. But they didn't make this point.
DaveinOlyWA
Well-known member
optimum SOC for storage is 40-60%. this is what Cellphone batts are manufactured and stored at, so this would make sense.
the Prius which does use different chemistry. NiMH runs at 40-80%.
it has become apparent thru all discussions that one thing (or maybe 2) is pretty clear. too low; bad, too high; bad
that kinda implies that middle; good since its the farthest from the "bads"
as far as charging to 90%. i do it not because i need to go that far. which is rare. i do it in case i need to go that far.
like today. already knew it would be a extra drive around day. drove 72 miles and this included the Nissan recall and 25 minute L2 boost while waiting for car to go in (which was good because i lost 2/10th on MPK?) but came home with 28 miles to spare.
but who knows, could have detoured for something unexpected.
the Prius which does use different chemistry. NiMH runs at 40-80%.
it has become apparent thru all discussions that one thing (or maybe 2) is pretty clear. too low; bad, too high; bad
that kinda implies that middle; good since its the farthest from the "bads"
as far as charging to 90%. i do it not because i need to go that far. which is rare. i do it in case i need to go that far.
like today. already knew it would be a extra drive around day. drove 72 miles and this included the Nissan recall and 25 minute L2 boost while waiting for car to go in (which was good because i lost 2/10th on MPK?) but came home with 28 miles to spare.
but who knows, could have detoured for something unexpected.
Volusiano
Well-known member
I'm no expert in Lithium Ion batteries, but I read that cell phone and laptop batteries are of the Lithium Cobalt Oxide type, while the Leaf and Volt are of the Lithium Manganese Oxide type, and there's another type, Lithium Iron Phosphaste, which was in the run for consideration for use in the Volt until GM decided to go with LG's Lithium Manganese Oxide in the end due to its more readiness. So what's good for cell phone batteries with the Lithium Cobalt Oxide may not apply to the other chemistry.DaveinOlyWA said:
The reason I think it's better to top off Lithium Manganese Oxide type batteries (which the Leaf's is) at 80% is because I own an electric bike (A2B by Ultra Motor) that runs on the same Lithium Manganese Oxide chemistry that the Leaf does. The owner manual says that "to maximize the life of your battery, and to ensure that your bike is always ready for use, recharge the battery as soon as possible after every use. A lithium ion battery left in a discharged condition will deteriorate much faster than a fully charged battery." I would consider that 50% SOC is a discharged condition. While not a "DEEP" discharged condition, it's still a discharged condition nevertheless.
I would bet you that Ultra Motor already conditions their charger to stop at 80% automatically because they don't even want to give users a choice to charge to 100%, since users can always pedal the bike if out of juice. In the case of the Leaf, it's in Nissan's interest to give users a choice to charge to 100% so Nissan can claim the most range, and users can choose longer range at the cost of shorter life if they need to once in a while.
NiMH is a very different chemistry than Lithium Ion so it's not apple to apple comparison anyway.DaveinOlyWA said:
Agree that too low is bad and too high as in 100% is also bad. But I don't agree that it implies that middle is good. This is the exact point I want to argue. I think too high as in 100% is bad, but while high as in 80% is better than 100% (Nissan says so), I also contend that high as in 80% is better than middle as in 50%. Why? Because of what Ultra Motor says so in the A2B manual for their Lithium Manganese Oxide battery as quoted above.DaveinOlyWA said:
I would guess that if we were to ask Nissan which is better? 50% state or 80% state?, they would probably say that it does not make much difference in terms of battery longevity. But they would probably add that you should charge to 80% every time you have a chance because the advantage of having optimum range at 80% far outweighs any reason to keep the battery at 50% only. I wouldn't be surprised either if they confirm that 80% SOC is better than 50% SOC for longevity.
Cell phone batteries manufacturers may have other reasons to keep their new batteries stored between 40%-60%, other than it being the best SOC for longevity. It may very well be that because that level is safe enough from being in a deep discharged state, but they just don't need to fully charge to 80% to save their own time and energy because users will do that anyway.
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