2012 heated seats increasing range?

[Scowbay]

We're waiting on our 2012 arriving Dec 16th in Seattle area.

I'm curious if there is any real-world experience with the cold weather package of the 2012 (seats and steering wheel.) How much less energy does it take and how might that translate into range - as compared to having regular heater on.

 

[Gonewild]

I will be much better then using the 3kw's heater. Down to only a few 100 watts I sure. As for range you will loose that is a given.

 

[TomT]

It will depend greatly on whether or not the heated seats and wheel are sufficient to keep you warm. If so - and that is likely in temperate climates - you will see a corresponding increase in range. In the colder climates where you will likely need to use the heater as well - or when you have to use the heater to defog or demist the windows in any climate - it likely will not make as much difference. My experience has been, in the winter 50s and mid to high 40s here, that the heater current consumption levels off at the about .75 to 1Kw on average when I use it, so it is generally not that big an influence on my range. I, of course, do not have the cold weather package.

I'm curious if there is any real-world experience with the cold weather package of the 2012 (seats and steering wheel.) How much less energy does it take and how might that translate into range - as compared to having regular heater on.

 

[padamson1]

The heated seats and heated steering wheel are definitely a more than efficient to keep you warm as they barely register on the Energy Usage monitor.

Unfortunately when it is really cold out, or there is sufficient humidity, you are going to have to use the climate control to keep your windows from fogging up. Here in the Pacific NW I can't drive for more than 10min without switching on the defroster to clear the window (less if there are passengers in the car). I don't like waiting that long for safety reasons there are too many bikers and pedestrians around in the Portland area (I see people driving with the side windows fogged up during the day and know its just a matter of time before they kill someone). Of course only the front windshield defroster is costly battery-wise. [It is well documented on MNL that even if you select a low temperature for your defroster, it will use the heater unless it is warmer than 60deg outside, which translates to the heater is used whenever I use the windshield defroster]

The upshot is that the CWP definitely has a more efficient way to keep warm, but that doesn't necessarily translate into mileage improvements for everybody, unless of course you are OK with driving by Braille.

 

[Jay]

We're waiting on our 2012 arriving Dec 16th in Seattle area.

I'm curious if there is any real-world experience with the cold weather package of the 2012 (seats and steering wheel.) How much less energy does it take and how might that translate into range - as compared to having regular heater on.

I think I have a fairly unique prospective on this. I have both versions on the winter roads...with this being my second 'Canadian' winter (first with the cold weather package...got the Canadian LEAF (with CWP) the beginning of October)...so I can do a 'apples to oranges' direct comparison on my own usage/energy savings.

The CWP is hugely more effective in retaining energy that would have been expended by the operation of the heater, at least in my case. Now how that translates to range obviously depends on your driving style and tolerances, but here is what I find for myself.

With the CWP, I find I do NOT engage the heater at all above 45ºF (8ºC), whereas without (in the original version), anything below 65ºF has me working the heat controls. Even around 45ºF, I am not cold persae, but my lower extremities/feet are...so that is where the heater comes into play in a part time fashion. (I will note, that at this temperature you are constantly toggling the defroster on and off, but this is negligible to consumption, as the whole process of defrosting takes less than 15 seconds)

Coldest outside ambient temperature I have experienced so far this year with the CWP is 20ºF (-5ºc,) and at this temperature the heat controls run automatically as it would in the standard car...but at a lower temperature setting by 7-8 degrees. I would estimate the following savings at various temperatures on my average daily drive (75ish miles) :

Above 65ºF - nada
55ºF-65ºF - 20% usage in standard - 0% usage with CWP - less than a kWh saved - extra range: 1-2 miles
45ºF-55ºF - 40% usage in standard - 0% usage with CWP - 1-1.5kWh saved - extra range: 3-5 miles
32ºF-45ºFF - aprox 1.5 kWh saved per hour of operation of the car - extra range: 5-7 miles
sub 32ºF - has been very mild this year, so I have only had opportunity 4-5 times so far...so my sample size is small, but I would say there is less extra range than in the 32ºF to 45ºF band, as the car is really working hard to get the temperature up and maintain it, and therefore the savings are lessened. Maybe 5 miles of extra range (1.5kWh) just below freezing, with diminishing returns as the temperature drops, down to around 2 or 3 extra miles when it is really cold

(Per the subject title: I would say the heated steering wheel has as much to do initiating and maintaining a lower ambient as the heated seats. The instant gratification of toasty warm hands is a real deterrent to cranking the heat way up...especially on start-up)

 

[TonyWilliams]

Above 65ºF - nada
55ºF-65ºF - 20% usage in standard - 0% usage with CWP - less than a kWh saved - extra range: 1-2 miles
45ºF-55ºF - 40% usage in standard - 0% usage with CWP - 1-1.5kWh saved - extra range: 3-5 miles
32ºF-45ºFF - aprox 1.5 kWh saved per hour of operation of the car - extra range: 5-7 miles
sub 32ºF -

Great data, but I'm confused as to what "20%-40% usage in standard" means.

Also, when the temps are above the -20C threshold to turn on the battery heaters at 300w, can you see any measurable power draw on the climate control meter? I assume that the steering wheel plus one seat take almost nothing. Is there any way to turn off the side mirror heaters?

 

[Jay]

Above 65ºF - nada
55ºF-65ºF - 20% usage in standard - 0% usage with CWP - less than a kWh saved - extra range: 1-2 miles
45ºF-55ºF - 40% usage in standard - 0% usage with CWP - 1-1.5kWh saved - extra range: 3-5 miles
32ºF-45ºFF - aprox 1.5 kWh saved per hour of operation of the car - extra range: 5-7 miles
sub 32ºF -

Great data, but I'm confused as to what "20%-40% usage in standard" means.

Also, when the temps are above the -20C threshold to turn on the battery heaters at 300w, can you see any measurable power draw on the climate control meter? I assume that the steering wheel plus one seat take almost nothing. Is there any way to turn off the side mirror heaters?

I really wasn't sure of how to express the amount of consumption in a meaningful way, I probably should have prefaced it somewhat, but 20% of a normal full operating load usage in the standard (non-CWP version) for that temp band. I'm sure there is a better metric/way to express myself, but I was just throwing out some numbers.

In hindsight, I guess I should have said that when it is 55ºF, I would have used about .5kWh of power in my daily routine of driving 75-ish miles...whereas with the CWP, I use nothing on the heating system, but less the 75-odd watts for the CWP accessories.

As I mentioned, it has been fairly mild this year and -5C (20ºF), so I really can't answer your question about the reaction of the power meter, as the battery warmer has yet to be active, and my cars are sheltered almost all the time. It shouldn't be that much longer before I trip the warmer though...I will throw up a post on the subject if you like when it happens. You can't activate them yourself...or at the very least, I have not seen a toggle/option to do so. You pretty well versed on the technicals...if there is a way, let me know and I'll get right back to you.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

just to clarify your clarification.

so 20% is run time for heat then? on a minute off 4?

 

[evnow]

I really wasn't sure of how to express the amount of consumption in a meaningful way, I probably should have prefaced it somewhat, but 20% of a normal full operating load usage in the standard (non-CWP version) for that temp band. I'm sure there is a better metric/way to express myself, but I was just throwing out some numbers.

Do you mean 20% of the energy used for driving ?

See my experience here ...

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=6701" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[Jay]

I really wasn't sure of how to express the amount of consumption in a meaningful way, I probably should have prefaced it somewhat, but 20% of a normal full operating load usage in the standard (non-CWP version) for that temp band. I'm sure there is a better metric/way to express myself, but I was just throwing out some numbers.

Do you mean 20% of the energy used for driving ?

See my experience here ...

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=6701" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

No, more like what Dave said. At that temperature (55ºF-65ºF), I would be using 1 minute of heating for every 5 minutes that I would normally be using the heater if it was around freezing without the cold weather package...as oppsed to not at all with the CWP. I just typed the whole thing out in about 3 mins, and really didn't explain myself well at all.

I was really trying to express (albeit badly) how much I use the heating controls at that temperature, relative to an overall 'winter'. That is why I doubled back later in the thread, and tried to be more precise, saying I'd use about 500kWh of power over my 75 mile commute in this temperature range without the CWP...while I don't use the system at all with the CWP.

/thought I was being clever trying to establish my tolerances and driving range at the same time
//big fail