2016 Leaf with 10 bars

[pmeireles]

Hi,

I’m entering the world of EVs and after reading lots of articles I decided to buy a used Leaf. I found a 2016 model in Tekna trim, which is the one I want, but the problem is that it has 55000km and already lost 2 bars on the battery health meter, as you can see in the image bellow:


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Is this a reason for concern? Should I avoid buying this car? I will do mostly city and about 20/30 km max every day.

Any help appreciated.

Regards,
Pedro

 

[LeftieBiker]

I assume that this is the 30kwh Leaf, in which case the battery is known for rapid degradation. Nissan initially claimed that it was just a calibration error in the Battery Management System (BMS), but they have replaced a LOT of these batteries under warranty. There was a free BMS software update issued, so you'd want to find out if the car has had it. If not, then it's an open question whether or not that particular Leaf has a good battery or not. If it did have the BMS update, then the battery is definitely not good. The only good news is that when a 30kwh Leaf loses 4 capacity bars, the warranty replacement battery will be a 40kwh battery. If you want to avoid extra hassle, then I suggest you keep looking.

 

[pmeireles]

Thank you very much for the reply. How do I know if the BMS software update was applied? Can I get this information through LeafSpy?

 

[LeftieBiker]

Your best bet is to have a Nissan dealer - or Nissan's EV helpline - run the VIN. I'm going to link my used Leaf buying guide shortly.

https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=26662&p=538030

 

[pmeireles]

Thanks for pointing out your used Leaf buying guide, which is very informative. Reading through it, however, one gets the notion that all battery packs since the first generation 24kwh until the most recent ones can have problems.

So, in your opinion is there any model year that is a “safe” bet?

Thanks again!

 

[LeftieBiker]

Thanks for pointing out your used Leaf buying guide, which is very informative. Reading through it, however, one gets the notion that all battery packs since the first generation 24kwh until the most recent ones can have problems.

So, in your opinion is there any model year that is a “safe” bet?

Thanks again!

Any Leaf with the 24kwh "Lizard" pack is a good bet. Older Leafs that received them as warranty replacements have a somewhat higher risk of having other components (like the resistance heater) fail, but almost any Leaf whose current battery was made no earlier than 2015, and is 24kwh, should have a good battery. The exception would be Leafs that reside - or resided in the past - in Hot climates like AZ or the hotter parts of Ca. The main reason you need LeafSpy Pro and an appropriate Bluetooth dongle like the one in my signature is to try to weed out Leafs from those Hot climates. The other reason is to spot bad battery cells, which are uncommon, but not unheard of, in Lizard packs..

 

[alozzy]

Thank you very much for the reply. How do I know if the BMS software update was applied? Can I get this information through LeafSpy?

Yes, LeafSpy Pro shows the BMS software version/build and it's different if the upgrade has been done.

https://evsenhanced.com/enhanced-firmware-for-the-30kwh-leaf-our-first-custom-firmware-update/

 

[LeftieBiker]

The above site is remarkable in which they don't mention - unless I missed it reading quickly - the other, more common issue with the 30kwh Leaf: the increased degradation rate regardless (or not directly linked) of the QC speed issue. That's good info on LeafSpy reading ECU part numbers (?), though. Now, can someone post the specific designation that identifies the Nissan BMS update?

 

[goldbrick]

According to the interwebs....if the HV part number is 293A0-4NP*A or 293A0-4NP*B the update has not been done. If the update has been done the part number will end in C, eg 293A0-4NP4C.

 

[LeftieBiker]

Thanks! I'm not clear on the first part, though. Do you mean:

if the HV part number is 293A0-4NP*A or 293A0-4NP*B the update has (not) been done.

?

 

[alozzy]

This video shows the steps for reading the version number via LeafSpy on a 2018 40 kWh LEAF, but the steps are the same for a 2016 30 kWh:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-Eq93RniJ8

I'm pretty sure that for most 2016 LEAF's the version will be 4NP5C after the update. The "C" is the key identifier, if that fifth character is an A or a B, then it hasn't been updated yet.

 

[LeftieBiker]

Great. Thanks.

 

[pmeireles]

This is a little bit off-topic regarding my original post, but assuming that a Leaf has lost, for example, one bar of battery health due to poor charging habits (lots of quick charges, leaving the car at 100% for an extended period, living in an extremely hot climate etc.), if a new owner takes really good care of the battery is it possible to extend the battery life for several years? Or from the moment the car loses the first bar the battery gets irreversibly damaged and will start to degrade no matter how you treat it?

 

[LeftieBiker]

Stop the detrimental charging behavior, and the degradation slows.

I'm not feeling well this morning, folks. I'll be giving short answers only.

 

[pmeireles]

I hope you get better soon!

 

[goldbrick]

Do you mean:
If the HV part number is 293A0-4NP*A or 293A0-4NP*B the update has (not) been done?

yes, thanks for catching that. I corrected my post.

And get well soon.

 

[pmeireles]

Yesterday I went to see another 2016 Leaf. This one has about 66.000kms and 11 bars of battery health:

This time I was prepared with an OBD and was able to connect it to the car. Here are two of the main screens:





Anything I should be concerned with, or is everything "normal"?

Thank you.

 

[jlv]

30kWh battery. It looks alright. Just note that it will lose the 2nd bar at about 77.5% SOH.

 

[johnlocke]

You are well within the warranty limits. If you want, you could play the warranty replacement game and try for a 40KWH replacement battery. You still have three years left on the warranty. If you think that a 60 mile range is adequate until you get a warranty replacement, you might consider it. If you don't drive a lot or it's mostly short trips then you might never reach the warranty limits to get a replacement.

 

[pmeireles]

Just a quick update on the status of my Leaf. Approximately 2 years after I bought it I lost 2 battery bars (I bought the car used with 11 bars and I'm now at 9). Here is the history:

October 2021
Kms: 66626
Number of bars: 11
SOH: 78.88%

December 2021 (lost 11th bar)
Kms: 67646
Number of bars: 10
SOH: 76.56%

November 2023 (lost 10th bar)
Kms: 86397
Number of bars: 9
SOH: 72.25%

The car is from October 2016, so it is now 7 years old. In October next year it will reach 8 years and I will no longer be covered by the battery warranty.

Do you guys think it is likely that I lose another bar before October next year? Given the degradation it is having, I think it is unlikely. Just for context, I rarely quick-charge it. Most of my charges are made at home at L1 during the night and I try to stop charging at 80%, so I think I take good care of the battery.

@johnlocke, I wonder what do you mean by "If you want, you could play the warranty replacement game and try for a 40KWH replacement battery".

Thank you.