Electric drive vehicle credit 8936 decreased/rejected by IRS

[FairwoodRed]

I remember how incredulous Nissan management were when I broached the subject of somebody actually purchasing with those in attendance at the press launch event in fall of 2010. Looking back, it was quite clear that they didn't expect anyone to purchase.

maybe they're hedging their bet that they'll be able to retrofit all these lease returns with (...) batteries that will help make them whole again and carry great resale values through the aftermarket as pre-owned LEAFs.

Ooh! That is the best idea I've seen yet for the excess battery pack manufacturing capacity in TN.

 

[Volusiano]

I remember how incredulous Nissan management were when I broached the subject of somebody actually purchasing with those in attendance at the press launch event in fall of 2010. Looking back, it was quite clear that they didn't expect anyone to purchase.

maybe they're hedging their bet that they'll be able to retrofit all these lease returns with (...) batteries that will help make them whole again and carry great resale values through the aftermarket as pre-owned LEAFs.

Ooh! That is the best idea I've seen yet for the excess battery pack manufacturing capacity in TN.

I read somewhere that the excess battery capacity in TN is actually already spoken for to supply to Europe and other parts of the world.

 

[zarwin]

UPDATE!

IRS just deposited the balance of the 7500 credit in my account. For reference, I was one of those given the CP12 notice regarding AMT/TMT cancelling a large portion of the tax credit. Everything is documented here:

http://goo.gl/l3w8W" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[gaswalla]

Great work!

and excellent summary with very good facts and resources. Thank you.

 

[WilsonSATX]

It has taken me quite a while to get through this thread, since I just joined the forum yesterday. I bought my Leaf this past March, so I'll be filing for my 8936 tax credit a year later than most of you. I'll definitely be re-reading the thread during tax season. Am I understanding correctly that, although there were some delays and complications, everyone got the credit eventually? I understand that it's a non-refundable credit, so the refund won't exceed taxes previously paid.

I also saw some discussion of a second tax credit for the EVSE on Form 8911. I hadn't heard that one before. You can't claim the EVSE that came with the purchase of the car, can you? I need to check my invoice, but I don't believe it was itemized separately. Is the second credit for the EVSE upgrade or charging stations and such?

I appreciate being able to ride the coattails of all you pioneers. Very nice of all you folks to share so much info with those of us following behind.

 

[planet4ever]

Am I understanding correctly that, although there were some delays and complications, everyone got the credit eventually?

More like, we fervently believe that everyone should get the credit eventually.

I understand that it's a non-refundable credit, so the refund won't exceed taxes previously paid.

That sounded wrong to me when I first read it, but I guess you are right, unless for some weird reason you make a payment with your return. I think of it as the total credit allowed can't exceed the total tax paid.

I also saw some discussion of a second tax credit for the EVSE on Form 8911. I hadn't heard that one before. You can't claim the EVSE that came with the purchase of the car, can you? I need to check my invoice, but I don't believe it was itemized separately. Is the second credit for the EVSE upgrade or charging stations and such?

Well, I guess that would be: No; no; maybe; yes; probably not. They could change the tax law for next year, but if they don't, very few people qualify for both credits in the same year. You have to be in a narrow income band where AMT calculations are starting to kick in but haven't fully taken hold yet. It seems like a design error around lines 15-18 of form 8911, which apply even if you don't have to file AMT otherwise, but that's the way the regs are written. Of course if you lease you don't claim the 8936 credit, and then the 8911 credit is a piece of cake.

I leased and did claim the 8911 credit for my EVSE upgrade and associated electrical work, but that too is a bit iffy, since this is not a credit for equipment, but for "property". I believe property (as opposed to personal property) is defined as something which is permanently attached to the land. In my case, I plugged that sucker in and I've never unplugged it, so I think of it as permanently attached to my house, which in turn is permanently attached to the land.

Ray

 

[Cinnabar]

Update:

One of those asked to provide Manufacturer's Certification, whatever that is.

e-filed with Turbotax: Feb 11
Return accepted by IRS: Feb 12
Notified of audit via mail: June 25
Faxed Response: July 1
Response accepted by IRS: July 2
Confirmed fax associated with my account: July 11
Letter received from IRS saying they are reviewing my response: August 1
Letter says I should receive a reply from IRS by September 15
Full refund received: TBD

My fax included the examiners report, the IRS page listing the LEAF as eligible for the $7500 rebate, my purchase agreement, my title, a copy of the window sticker and an page of explanation. I guess the 90 day window to respond started on July 2nd, so by October 2nd I should hear something.

 

[tiltedworld]

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this thread.

We filed on the April 17th, the deadline day. We've also gotten a delay letter on 5/2, the same day I received 49% of my Federal refund. Yet the letter was post-dated to 5/14. The $7500 represents 84% of the refund balance which lead me to believe the IRS was holding an extra grand or so to account for some sort of penalties to assess.

I do realize that our refund is quite large and the EV credit exacerbated the issue, but there is no changing the wife's mind on witholding after getting smacked with a ginormous AMT tax liability after we got married 8yrs ago :roll: . Remember...happy wife, happy life :lol: Plus we do live in Silicon Valley with the accompanying big mortgage, so the mortgage interest deduction does provide a lot of the refund normally.

Regardless, our taxes are prepared by a professional and the only things that were different this year was a purchase of a vacation home (additional tax credit) and the Leaf EV credit. The amount withheld points to the EV credit as the likely flag and this thread supports that as well. We filed the 8936, complete with VIN. We gave our sales receipt to our accountant, but who knows if this was recorded by the IRS.

All I know is we are now past 90 days from when we received the letter (Notice CP18) but not quite to the post-marked date, which would be 8/14. I suppose it will be pins/needles till next week, but I'm not holding my breath....

Our tax accountant has called twice and gotten essentially nowhere, with the IRS saying nothing can be done until after 90 days. Funny how they post-dated that letter....NOT!! :evil:

 

[Ready2plugin]

I filled early April, still no letter from IRS, no refund, and at this point I don't know what to think. Lets hope they get there act together soon. Interest or not, I want this to end.

 

[Lkmtleaf]

I recommend that you contact your region's IRS taxpayer advocate if you are still in limbo. The Fresno office managed to get the IRS to respond (I called the IRS every 2 weeks starting in June and finally someone transferred me to the advocate's office). I think because I mentioned the 8936 issue, they were able to speak more specifically to the examiner's office. They have been holding on to substantially more than the credit in my account (half of my mortgage deduction along with the entire 7500 credit). A week after talking with the the advocate's office, they had a response from the IRS and it sounds like they're going to be faxing me some information to complete the exam, but the advocate sounded like they were going to return all of the money to me within 2 weeks of signing this last form.

 

[Rat]

I am amazed at the stories here. I feel lucky. I used Turbo Tax, claimed the credits for Cal. & Fed., got my refund quickly, had no notices or problems. TT said my chance of being audited were down near the very bottom of the scale. It probably helps that we don't itemize, since we paid off our mortgage and Prop 13 keeps the property tax low. We're retired, which also means the income is low and we don't hit AMT. It sounds like I'm celebrating being poor! But I don't feel poor. I bought my Leaf for cash last year.

 

[sparky]

Not a word from the IRS nor the Turbo Tax audit protection folks who have been handling this claim.
But, the balance of my IRS withheld refund just showed up in my bank acct. Woohoo!

Feb: Filed taxes; long form.
May: Got notice of 8396<->8936 error from IRS and brought TT audit folks on board.
June1: Got notice that IRS was examining my claim and audit folks said they expected it to take 60-90 days.
75 days later... $

In retrospect, I would have leased my LEAF in Jan 2011 just to avoid this hassle.

 

[Cinnabar]

Not a word from the IRS nor the Turbo Tax audit protection folks who have been handling this claim.
But, the balance of my IRS withheld refund just showed up in my bank acct. Woohoo!

Feb: Filed taxes; long form.
May: Got notice of 8396<->8936 error from IRS and brought TT audit folks on board.
June1: Got notice that IRS was examining my claim and audit folks said they expected it to take 60-90 days.
75 days later... $

In retrospect, I would have leased my LEAF in Jan 2011 just to avoid this hassle.

Thanks for the update, sparky. There's hope!

 

[tzzhc4]

Just got a letter from the IRS saying I will get my full refund in 2-3 weeks!!!

 

[gascant]

Just got a letter from the IRS saying I will get my full refund in 2-3 weeks!!!

When did you file?

 

[tzzhc4]

Just got a letter from the IRS saying I will get my full refund in 2-3 weeks!!!

When did you file?

-Initially filed in early March 2012
-Didn't get my refund until late April and it was sans the EV credit
-Called the IRS and they said my EV credit was denied because of TMT so I asked for details and got sent a letter 2 weeks later that said "you asked for X computer says you get Y"
-Called back over the course of several days spending many hours finally got to someone in a department called "complex problems" that said I need to send a letter saying I was wrongly denied and TMT shouldn't apply.
-Sent a certified letter early May
-IRS sent me a response back saying it would take 45 days then mid June another letter saying another 45 days
-Finally Aug 20th I got a letter saying I would get my full EV credit in 2-3 weeks

 

[GoingGreener]

Great to hear your EV credit refund got resolved! Left hanging has been no fun. Everytime this thread gets updated, we check the IRS website for our status. :roll: Our's haven't changed since 04/18/12 ...received... still processing....

History:
03/31/12 Turbo Tax return filed electronically
04/18/12 Partial Refund received via direct deposit (less EV rebate and then some)
04/18/12 Called IRS to inquire. Said we will be getting written notice by 04/30/12. Shortly after, received a post-dated (04/30/12) CP18 that indicated... we have delayed sending you part of your tax refund... no need to contact us... we will contact you within 3 wks... etc...
06/26/12 Allowed more than double the time CP18 said we'd be contacted. Nothing received, so called IRS again. Got transferred to the Exam Dept. Our case was not even assigned to an examiner yet. That's why we hadn't been sent any correspondence. Per examiner on phone, they were backlogged. That examiner was nice (which made things less painful) and after looking at our case, said all IRS needed was a copy of our sales invoice contract. I asked, would our DMV registration or anything else help/be needed? She said, nothing else, and gave me an address to send the copy to. She also made it clear that even though we would be sending in the support document needed, it would not expedite our case. It could still be around 30-60 days because it's still dependent on their caseloads and an examiner being assigned to our's.
06/28/12 Sent a copy of our Nissan Retail Installment Sales Contract and IRS CP18 certified mail. On every page of enclosures we marked our primary SS# of joint return and Page # of enclosures. USPS records showed delivery 07/02/12.
08/21/12 Still no correspondence/refund from IRS yet.

Lucky we weren't banking on this $ for any project(s). Although the addition of more solar panels has sounded good.

 

[mwalsh]

Everytime this thread gets updated, we check the IRS website for our status. :roll: Our's haven't changed since 04/18/12 ...received... still processing.....

I do the same thing, with the same result.

 

[gascant]

Everytime this thread gets updated, we check the IRS website for our status. :roll: Our's haven't changed since 04/18/12 ...received... still processing.....

I do the same thing, with the same result.

Ditto.
I emailed my contact at Nissan again to see if they were able to find out anything. So far, no response.
I filed on 4/1

 

[kmp647]

this situation is very bad for EV adoption. It must be fixed for Ev to be sucessful

the 7,500 should be instant and handled by the dealership ala cash for clunkers.

I am so glad I leased, what a shame.