July Plugin Sales : Leaf 395, Volt 1849, PIP 688, FFE 38

[DaveinOlyWA]

Toyota is doing the same thing along with waiting for greater market acceptance and we are penalized for it

 

[EdmondLeaf]

25,000 worldwide strongly suggests that Leaf amount that is sent to USA decreased significantly, and Nissan is selling more in other countries. 20,000 was reported by end of the year.

Thanks to the Nissan LEAF, we remain the only manufacturer to have a mass produced electric vehicle on the road in America, Europe and Asia. We've now delivered over 25,000 LEAFs globally.

http://newsroom.nissan-europe.com/EU/en-gb/Media/Media.aspx?mediaid=89597

 

[adric22]

25,000 worldwide strongly suggests that Leaf amount that is sent to USA decreased significantly, and Nissan is selling more in other countries. 20,000 was reported by end of the year.

I've suspected for a while that even if Leaf sales remain weak in the USA, the demand in other countries will keep it alive. We've got a lot of really stupid people here who are really putting a lot of effort into bashing EVs. Some of them may be employed by oil companies, who knows. But the EV movement appears a lot stronger in other countries. Just look at the number of charging stations in Japan and Europe compared with the USA.

 

[EdmondLeaf]

Nissan not worried by pace of Leaf sales

http://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2012/03/06/nissan-not-worried-by-leaf-sales.html

 

[spike09]

http://green.autoblog.com/2012/03/05/toyota-widens-u-s-hybrid-lead-in-february/

Nissan Leaf = 478
Mitsubishi i = 44

Toyota Prius = 20,589
VW Diesels = 6,513
Other Toyota Hybrids = 4,224
Lexus Hybrids = 2,645
Honda Hybrids = 1,980
Chevrolet Volt = 1,023
Ford Hybrids = 1,963
Audi TDIs = 390
Porsche Hybrids = 171

 

[TomT]

Nissan bears some of the blame since they require Nissan dealers in those countries to install QC but did not require it in North America... Imagine the difference it would make if every Leaf dealer in this country had a QC!

Just look at the number of charging stations in Japan and Europe compared with the USA.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

I agree 100%! I think the early adapter is too easily impressed with L2, I'd even go a step further and say L2 is all too often a distraction. Nissan needs to show the way and install QC at the dealerships if at all possible!

Nissan bears some of the blame since they require Nissan dealers in those countries to install QC but did not require it in North America... Imagine the difference it would make if every Leaf dealer in this country had a QC!

Just look at the number of charging stations in Japan and Europe compared with the USA.

 

[Jay]

This thread always pulls me back in, lol.

Now, I am not saying that there is some huge backed-up demand in the US, or that Nissan can sell 3,000 copies a month, but...40 markets and counting now (another 7-8 coming online in next 2 months), for 5500-max cars. Numbers are going to be low all around (especially in the US) until TN is up.
---
In a related matter, and not good news...TN car assembly for the LEAF is behind schedule, and (the last I heard) SOP is now penciled in for first week of January in 2013, so US built cars won't be out until March of 2013 (with a mild refresh).

Also in a related matter, but good news. Nissan is putting the hammer down getting the battery plant operational. How far along are they? Well, the plant for all intents and purposes is done, and Nissan is now hiring engineers, specialists and battery-types,etc. Given all the hiccups in France (and at the other battery plants) this is where the focus is/has to be.

 

[adric22]

Also in a related matter, but good news. Nissan is putting the hammer down getting the battery plant operational. How far along are they? Well, the plant for all intents and purposes is done, and Nissan is now hiring engineers, specialists and battery-types,etc. Given all the hiccups in France (and at the other battery plants) this is where the focus is/has to be.

What good is the battery plant without cars to put them in? Or will they be making the cars in Japan without batteries to ship to the USA?

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

25,000 worldwide strongly suggests that Leaf amount that is sent to USA decreased significantly, and Nissan is selling more in other countries. 20,000 was reported by end of the year.

Nothing makes Americans want something faster than if they think someone is getting it ahead of them. Like the toy in the corner nobody cared about until one kid picked it up and started playing with it.

Wait until the Tennessee plant starts exporting the production not wanted here. They'll be calling for a congressional investigation.

 

[evnow]

Nissan not worried by pace of Leaf sales

http://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2012/03/06/nissan-not-worried-by-leaf-sales.html

This is the important quote.

"The technologists in them score very, very high — more so than the environmentally conscious individuals," he said.

We need to get environmentally conscious to consider EVs. That is clearly the next step in adoption.

 

[cwerdna]

It's not clear to me that either car is "not a market success". The Leaf had a bad month, but over the last few months, compared to hybrid/green cars, both the Volt and the Leaf are selling better than most. Other than the Prius and maybe the Camry I don't see anything else really outselling them, which is surprising given their price points and how new they are to the market. Not to mention the manufactured "fire" controversy.

I don't know, but from http://www.hybridcars.com/news/february-2012-dashboard-42085.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, I see 10 hybrid models (including the Prius), outselling the Leaf for Feb and 2012 YTD.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

I think sales will improve as the whether warms. This winter we've had a lot of belly aching going on due to the lack of the Cold Whether Package in a bunch of 2011 Leafs. having to rely so heavily on climate control to stay warm puts a serious dent in range. Heated seats and steering wheel make a huge difference in comfort and are crucial for EV's. As more MY2012's get out there with the cold whether package there will be more happy campers telling their friends how great the Leaf is even in cold whether.

 

[SanDust]

I don't know, but from http://www.hybridcars.com/news/february-2012-dashboard-42085.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, I see 10 hybrid models (including the Prius), outselling the Leaf for Feb and 2012 YTD.

If you look at the numbers it's exactly like I said, other than the Prius and the Camry nothing is really outselling them. For example, Ford has sold 1721 Fusions and GM has sold 1626 Volts. That small difference more or less defines "not really outselling".

 

[Yoshi]

JP Feb numbers
Leaf 1,079
Prius PHV 1,915
i-MiEV 446 <- correction from 403 (the source site was wrong, the official site below should be correct)
MiniCab-MiEV 590 <- add

source: http://www.goonews.jp/news_detail.php?view=auto&id=1615" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
JP Kei-car official site: http://www.zenkeijikyo.or.jp/statistics/4tushosoku.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yoshi@Japan

edit: correct i-MiEV number and add MiniCab-MiEV number

 

[evnow]

JP Feb numbers
Leaf 1,079
Prius PHV 1,915
i-MiEV 403
source: http://www.goonews.jp/news_detail.php?view=auto&id=1615" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yoshi@Japan

Thanks. Do you know where we can find i-MiEV's Japanese sales numbers last year ?

 

[Yoshi]

Thanks. Do you know where we can find i-MiEV's Japanese sales numbers last year ?

You're welcome.

Here is the JP Kei-car data.
The i-MiEV went on sale in July 2009.

total 986 sold in 2009
DEC-10 164
total 2340 sold in 2010
JAN-11 219
FEB-11 321
MAR-11 102
APR-11 37
MAY-11 34
JUN-11 40
JUL-11 61
AUG-11 207
SEP-11 340
OCT-11 244
NOV-11 326
DEC-11 359
total 2290 sold in 2011
JAN-12 341
FEB-12 446

And, the MiniCab-MiEV went on sale in Nov 2011.
NOV-11 102
DEC-11 747
JAN-12 467
FEB-12 590

JP Kei-car official site: http://www.zenkeijikyo.or.jp/statistics/4tushosoku.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yoshi@Japan

PS.
The US i-MiEV numbers are
DEC-11 76
JAN-12 36
source: http://www.hybridcars.com/market-dashboard.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

We need to get environmentally conscious to consider EVs. That is clearly the next step in adoption.

Good point!
One of the greatest challenges, IMHO, is that a lot of environmentalists hate cars and are diametrically apposed to buying them new due to the environmental impact of their production. The irony is that these people end up being left with someone else's choice in the used market and end up having no effect on the new car market. Even with EV's it's very slow going getting the environmental community to truly embrace Them. These folks want more bike trails and mass transit and many of them are down right apposed to finding a clean and economical solution for what is essentially a single occupancy vehicle, at least the way the masses choose to drive mostly alone.

I've come to the conclusion that the masses aren't going to embrace public transit fast enough to avert disaster and for that reason I have focused my goals on helping support the adoption of EV's for commuting. Some day we will have EV busses quick charging a little bit at every bus stop as they go! :mrgreen:

 

[EdmondLeaf]

This is where I believe Leaf production is/will be directed, lowering USA sale numbers. It looks like they make 2000/mo and appears that battery are limiting factor to increase output at this time

"Nissan eyes European LEAF expansion" http://www.businessgreen.com/bg/news/2158048/nissan-eyes-european-leaf-expansion

 

[GRA]

We need to get environmentally conscious to consider EVs. That is clearly the next step in adoption.

Good point!
One of the greatest challenges, IMHO, is that a lot of environmentalists hate cars and are diametrically apposed to buying them new due to the environmental impact of their production. The irony is that these people end up being left with someone else's choice in the used market and end up having no effect on the new car market. Even with EV's it's very slow going getting the environmental community to truly embrace Them. These folks want more bike trails and mass transit and many of them are down right apposed to finding a clean and economical solution for what is essentially a single occupancy vehicle, at least the way the masses choose to drive mostly alone.

I've come to the conclusion that the masses aren't going to embrace public transit fast enough to avert disaster and for that reason I have focused my goals on helping support the adoption of EV's for commuting. Some day we will have EV busses quick charging a little bit at every bus stop as they go! :mrgreen:

As someone who straddles the techie/greenie gap, I'd agree that a lot of greens prefer inexpensive, socially-based non-technological solutions to transportation issues. For instance, I made the decision more than a decade ago to live in a city downtown so that I could walk to all services (and ride my bike to work). Like many, I don't see the solution to traffic jams as replacing single-occupant commuter ICEs with single-occupant commuter BEVs or PHEVs; the gridlock's the same, you've just moved the location of the pollution. I believe we need to move back into inner cities and want high-density mixed communities using a mix of public transit (including car-sharing), walking/biking and low-impact vehicles (bikes/electric bikes or scooters), not suburbia 2.0 with a different fuel.

That said, many greens have also made the decision to reduce their impact by living a low production, low consumption lifestyle. As such, they don't have median family incomes of $130k+ (as the article credits the typical Leaf buyer), and don't have large amounts of discretionary income to buy or operate multiple cars, especially expensive niche cars. They don't drive that much compared to techies, but when they do they generally need to go further than currently affordable BEVs allow. So, greens will happily embrace BEV city cars via car sharing if it's affordable. And they'll continue to hold on to their old cars for trips until they rust out, because that's usually the lowest overall impact on the planet.