alembic42 said:I should point out I've been back and forth with these people for a LONG time. They have blown me off and I can't get phone calls returned and on and on. I wouldn't go there at all for a long time because I was honestly scared of what I might do when I got there. But when I did arrive, over six months ago, they treated me like such crap that I really do absolutely hate these people they are so evil and corrupt. They will not return phone calls. They lie about everything big small and in between. I knew they were lying about all kinds of stuff when I bought the car but I didn't know they were lying about the range.
As I said in my earlier response, 73 miles represents the range the vehicle received on the EPA test cycles.alembic42 said:73 miles is not represented as an ideal figure. It's called an average.
alembic42 said:Mtndrew1, I find your approachdepressing . Like basically you're saying it's fine for these people to lie lie lie lie, like there's nothing criminal there. Like there's nothing wildly immoral and abusive there. Why do you act like there's nothing wrong ...
Besides dealers lying/making things up just to make a sale, others say things out of ignorance because they themselves don't drive an EV and/or haven't driven a Leaf themselves the distance they claim on a single charge.alembic42 said:Oh and just so there's no question that the dealers are telling a lie about the range, in the time since i posted this i've asked some dealers currently selling my year and model of car (more than one, scroll down), both answered 100 miles and one said it took 2 hours to charge, the other said it goes at least 75 miles even in the winter:
alembic42 said:guys, i get this and i don't understand what leafspy is about but i'll get it and try to learn.
i did some research. did you? how am i supposed to have known about the range being a lie? they just publish a number and back then i didn't find anything to contradict it, just enthusiastic people talking about how they got even more.
But here's the thing: I spent $16000 on this thing, barely used. Did you buy yours new? How are you NOT twice as pissed as I am? How have you not burned down the dealership? I don't understand how your expectations are so lax, when you got screwed even harder. Is it just a toy to you? do you have other cars? My wife and I have two cars and the leaf is one of them. There are lots of times that I can't go places I want to go. I can't afford to sell it cause I don't have 10 grand to put into the process. Seriously I just want the thing I bought and paid for.
How are you so lassiez faire about the whole thing when Nissan just burned you for even more money? I really mean that? Aren't you just absolutely livid? Or somehow you don't mind? Can I get a real answer here?
You guys are real EV owners right? Aren't we all in this together? Aren't we all getting seriously screwed out of tons of real money? This thing was supposed to SAVE me money, not this! How do you pay for this?? Do you just have a **** ton of money and you don't care? Honestly?
+1 The instrumentation on the '11 and '12 Leaf is crap and leads to unnecessary range anxiety.LeftieBiker said:This is why you need two things. First, LeafSpy. That reads the pack in both percentage of charge, IIRC, and in "GIDs" which are much smaller units of energy. It's like the difference between a semi-broken gas gauge and a digital one that reads, precisely, in pints of gasoline left. Your car also has some hidden range below the point where the GOM shuts down, and LeafSpy lets you use that range.
The heater on/off button did not exist on the '12. It was a new feature starting with '13.LeftieBiker said:Second, the heater Off switch. Maybe the 2012 came with one, but I don't think so. You need to be able to stop the heater from running when it isn't needed, and wasting power. They are sold through a site that is linked here, somewhere - someone will tell you - and are easy to install.
http://www.autoblog.com/2011/07/19/2012-nissan-leaf-higher-price-tag-standard-equipment/LeftieBiker said:That's what I thought, but my memory is going South. Did they change anything from 2011 to 2012, aside from making the seat and wheel heaters standard?
http://web.archive.org/web/20130201145348/http://www.edmunds.com/fuel-economy/testing-electric-vehicles-in-the-real-world.html achieved 81 miles on a 2011 Leaf with 2 miles left on the GOM.mtndrew1 said:In every review from a reputable source on the 2011-2012 Leaf, none of the reviewers ever exceeded the 73 mile EPA rating. Car and driver, road and track, edmunds, consumer reports, autoblog, etc
Yep. Another nice feature of Leaf Spy it has a smarter GOM. You can specify until LBW, VLBW or 5% battery and has +/- buttons. If you need to go say 50 miles, you adjust the miles/kWh via the +/- buttons until you arrive at something higher than a computed guess of 50 miles, say 55 miles. The miles/kWh it tells you there is the efficiency level in miles/kWh (kinda like miles per gallon) you'll need to achieve in your car in order to make it to that 55 miles w/some battery remaining. You probably don't want to cut it closer than VLBW.LeftieBiker said:This is why you need two things. First, LeafSpy. That reads the pack in both percentage of charge, IIRC, and in "GIDs" which are much smaller units of energy. It's like the difference between a semi-broken gas gauge and a digital one that reads, precisely, in pints of gasoline left. Your car also has some hidden range below the point where the GOM shuts down, and LeafSpy lets you use that range.
People have gone further than 100 miles on a charge on 24 kWh Leafs, albeit not in the cold: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=7022.alembic42 said:Every single thing here is a complete lie. As I'm sure everyone on this forum is aware, the 2012 Nissan Leaf does NOT go 84, 100, or 73 miles. In reality its range is about 40 miles in the summer and even worse in the winter, and THAT'S IF YOU DRIVE WITH THE HEAT OFF WHEN IT'S ZERO DEGREES OUT.
Re: the bolded part, yes, complete BS. NO dealer should EVER tell a potential Leaf buyer/lessee in the US who is unfamiliar with EVs "100 miles" of range for a 24 kWh Leaf, even w/a brand new battery. However, if you'd come here on MNL before to ask whether the Leaf was suitable for your commute and driving speeds (e.g. 75 mph), then we would've been able to give you a better answer.alembic42 said:I had no idea that this car, said to go 100 miles, would really go less than 50 miles in reality. WHO THE HELL KNOWS THAT KIND OF THING??????
Unfortunately, your story isn't the first horror story I've heard and certainly won't be the last.alembic42 said:The people who sell electric cars need to tell you what the hell you're getting. These people didn't. They just lied and lied and lied. And lied and lied some more.
The dealer obviously misled you, but re: the corporation (If you're referring to Nissan), keep in mind that in most states (and probably yours), state franchise laws prohibit automakers from owning dealers. So, automakers have limited control.alembic42 said:Mtndrew1, I find your approachdepressing . Like basically you're saying it's fine for these people to lie lie lie lie, like there's nothing criminal there. Like there's nothing wildly immoral and abusive there. Why do you act like there's nothing wrong with this corporation behaving this way?
cwerdna said:The dealer obviously misled you, but re: the corporation (If you're referring to Nissan), keep in mind that in most states (and probably yours), state franchise laws prohibit automakers from owning dealers. So, automakers have limited control.
Enter your email address to join: