POWER Loss when skid light comes up: traction control activation?

[Leafprobs]

POWER Loss when skid light comes up: traction control activation?

My 2021 Nissan Leaf lost all power last night going uphill every time the skid light came on (it came on a lot- never has before), downhill my brakes locked if I went over 10MPH. Anyone know why this would happen?

 

[Leafprobs]

Nissan is claiming that the skid light came on because two tires were balding, but no one seems able to explain the power loss. It was pretty clear I only lost it when the car-skidding icon was up. As soon as it went off, I got power back, then it came back on, and I lost power again. It did that a bunch of times. Not safe.

 

[EVPowers]

When you say losing power do you mean all the electrical systems turned off? Like the dash went dark? No speedometer, no radio, etc? That would be unusual.

Or are you saying the car wouldn't propel itself forward? This is common when an ABS car is skidding. It's trying to keep you from skidding so it reduces propulsion to the slipping wheels. It can actually make you come to a stop as it reduces propulsion to the skidding wheels.

Again, not sure of your mean of losing power.

 

[EVPowers]

I see you mean the second thing.

And this was answered for you in a different post you made.
https://mynissanleaf.com/threads/sudden-temporary-loss-of-power-today.10786/
Sounds like it was the normal activation of antilock brakes.

To get a feel for how they work, you could go into a deserted icy lot and drive around slowly. Aggressively slamming if the brakes to force the car to skid. The ABS should activate in the way you described.

 

[Leafprobs]

When you say losing power do you mean all the electrical systems turned off? Like the dash went dark? No speedometer, no radio, etc? That would be unusual.

Or are you saying the car wouldn't propel itself forward? This is common when an ABS car is skidding. It's trying to keep you from skidding so it reduces propulsion to the slipping wheels. It can actually make you come to a stop as it reduces propulsion to the skidding wheels.

Again, not sure of your mean of losing power.

Yes, it wasn't the dashboard lights, just all forward propulsion. And it wasn't slippery out! I'm concerned that this is the norm when the car is skidding, as it seemed very dangerous to me to have lost control that much.

 

[Leafprobs]

I see you mean the second thing.

And this was answered for you in a different post you made.
https://mynissanleaf.com/threads/sudden-temporary-loss-of-power-today.10786/
Sounds like it was the normal activation of antilock brakes.

To get a feel for how they work, you could go into a deserted icy lot and drive around slowly. Aggressively slamming if the brakes to force the car to skid. The ABS should activate in the way you described.

Can the ABS be turned off?

 

[Leafprobs]

Yes, it wasn't the dashboard lights, just all forward propulsion. And it wasn't slippery out! I'm concerned that this is the norm when the car is skidding, as it seemed very dangerous to me to have lost control that much.

Can the ABS be turned off?

 

[EVPowers]

My 2015 SL has a dash button to turn it off. Don't know about the 2021.

 

[paulmichmat]

Nissan is claiming that the skid light came on because two tires were balding, but no one seems able to explain the power loss. It was pretty clear I only lost it when the car-skidding icon was up. As soon as it went off, I got power back, then it came back on, and I lost power again. It did that a bunch of times. Not safe.

Same thing happening to 2021 (used) leaf plus I bought last week..

 

[paulmichmat]

Same thing happening to 2021 (used) leaf plus I bought last week.. we were on highway going a good speed when the car just seemingly braked/lost power…. Really scary..

Were they able to fix it? Has it happened again.

 

[Leafprobs]

It hasn't happened since I bought new tires, but I expect it will eventually.

 

[Leafprobs]

It hasn't happened since I bought new tires, but I expect it will eventually.

I still want to know how to turn the ABS off on my 2021. Can't figure it out.

 

[Ez2517]

I still want to know how to turn the ABS off on my 2021. Can't figure it out.

You cannot switch off the ABS on a Leaf. ABS = anti lock brakes, wouldn't make sense to switch those off to prevent power loss. What you want to switch off is the traction control which is the one that reduces power when the car detects (or thinks it detects) spinning front wheels.
What I can switch off on my 2019 is the ESP (stability control), which might also deactivate the traction control. There is no button for that, it can be switched off in the drivers display main menu using the buttons on the steering wheel.

 

[Leafprobs]

Thanks for this. What does the button look like for traction control or stability control?

 

[Drew21]

As others have stated, your car was performing exactly as it was designed. If you exceed the traction provided by your tires in the conditions you're driving in, the car is taking action to keep you on the road.

More generally, if you need to switch off traction control during normal driving activities, you're probably trying to drive your car in ways it wasn't meant to be driven (e.g., accelerating uphill with bald tires, speeding around curves on a wet/icy road, etc.).

I can only think of two situations when you might want to disable traction control.
1) attempting to get yourself unstuck - I've had to switch off our Leaf's traction control a couple times to get up our steep snowy/slushy driveway, even with Nokian winter tires. Sometimes you need a bit of wheel spin to keep moving forward in a low traction situation.
2) auto-cross or track racing on a controlled course, where you again are okay (and presumably experienced) with a bit of slipping and sliding to maintain speed.

On the highway around other drivers, traction control is a good thing.

 

[DunanyDon]

As others have stated, your car was performing exactly as it was designed. If you exceed the traction provided by your tires in the conditions you're driving in, the car is taking action to keep you on the road.

More generally, if you need to switch off traction control during normal driving activities, you're probably trying to drive your car in ways it wasn't meant to be driven (e.g., accelerating uphill with bald tires, speeding around curves on a wet/icy road, etc.).

I can only think of two situations when you might want to disable traction control.
1) attempting to get yourself unstuck - I've had to switch off our Leaf's traction control a couple times to get up our steep snowy/slushy driveway, even with Nokian winter tires. Sometimes you need a bit of wheel spin to keep moving forward in a low traction situation.
2) auto-cross or track racing on a controlled course, where you again are okay (and presumably experienced) with a bit of slipping and sliding to maintain speed.

On the highway around other drivers, traction control is a good thing.

Anyone used to driving in loose snow that is more than a couple of inches deep will be very frustrated by the operation of traction control. Under these conditions, when traction is low, the car will just sit there or inch along regardless of the throttle position. This can be very dangerous if you are in an intersection.

 

[saleem]

I have traction control on my other cars, and there's definitely something different with the way my 2012 Leaf does it. Others keep you moving while pulsing power on and off at a high rate to the slipping wheel so it stays exactly at the limit of traction.
The Leaf seems to just shut off power almost completely and it even seems to remain off for some time after the conditions have passed and force a very slow acceleration.
It's almost like it's a very naive implementation of "traction control."

 

[Drew21]

Under these conditions, when traction is low, the car will just sit there or inch along regardless of the throttle position.

That pretty much sums up my description of the first reason to turn off traction control. You're stuck (or nearly stuck) and need wheel speed and wheel spin to get moving. For me, it's a steep driveway in snowy conditions; for you, it's moving through a slick intersection from a complete stop. If you know it's slick, turn off the traction control to get moving. That's why they give you the ability to quickly toggle it on/off. Once you're moving, your momentum helps keep you moving forward. I'll also note that winter tires make a big difference when you're regularly in snow, ice, or even just cold wet roads. I've driven our Leaf (briefly) in snow on Ecopia Plus tires and extensively on snow/ice/wet with Nokian Hakkapeliitta winter tires and it's a night-and-day difference.

I have traction control on my other cars, and there's definitely something different with the way my 2012 Leaf does it.

Perhaps the traction control in an EV has to be calibrated differently than an ICE vehicle because of the power application properties of an electrical motor = immediate max torque. In contrast, my similarly sized (but much lighter) 2010 Honda Fit has both lower horsepower and significantly lower torque, and the power curve is shifted towards high rpm. The Fit doesn't have traction control, but if it did I doubt it would activate in the same road conditions and throttle application as occurs with the Leaf because there's just not much power at the low end of the rpm range.

Further, I think that many traction control systems operate through quick on/off brake application, which would produce the sensation you attribute to other cars you've driven. In contrast, it does seem like the Leaf significantly reduces power output (probably easier to do quickly in an electric vs ICE motor) which kills forward momentum.

I still think your main complaint came from worn-out tires. You mentioned in a followup post that the issue hasn't occurred with your new tires. Has it happened since? In 2.5 years of ownership the only time we've had traction control activation in our Leaf is the specific situation I described: making a (slow) 90 degree turn and then trying to drive up our steep driveway when it's snow covered. If it was a straight shot I don't think it would be a problem, but slowing down for the turn kills forward momentum. Now that we know this happens, it's as easy as turning off the traction control as we slow to turn into the driveway and then driving up with just a bit of wheel spin. As noted above, having appropriate tires for the prevailing traction conditions also helps quite a bit.