ranchleaf
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Re: New EVSE maps website http://electric.carstations.com

Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:08 pm

johnr wrote:The route mapping tools found on the DoE and Chargepoint sites are really nice. Maybe you'd want to look into a similar feature. If your site proves to be easy to use, up-to-date, and has some useful features I think it really has potential. Of course all that means nothing without a comprehensive list of stations, so I'm glad to hear you're still finding data sources to pull from. Being able to search by and differentiate the different parameters such as: types of charging connectors, speed (level 1, level 2, level 3), cost, private vs public location, whether special arrangement/subscription is required, would be useful.
Thanks John. All great stuff and others have suggested similar. Some of it is already there. Level of charging, type of connector are already there. I know, some sites are lacking it. Also trying to weed out the old "bad" sites. Check out this example at the L.A convention center for a connector and level example, plus some nice pics.

http://electric.carstations.com/668

Private vs public or special arrangement is going to be the next level of field work as it's hard to get that exact info. This is where the crowd sourcing from folks driving daily is going to really come into play. We can get all the data we want here, but reality at the station is going to different and important to comment on.

Side note: I am going to post fun new station sites from time to time as I come across them If I think there is an interesting story behind them.

Now, I just have to find some more time in those 24 hours :)

Thanks again.

ranchleaf
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Re: New EVSE maps website http://electric.carstations.com

Wed Jan 05, 2011 5:30 pm

Hey all,

Just wanted everyone know we have added in additional 50+ stations and many more coming in from multiple sources. Stations are going in constantly. Many submitted by users and others we are gathering.

Here is a nice new one in WI.
http://electric.carstations.com/2135

Here is my favorite part:
"Located near the front of the Claddagh Pub."

Yes, we know we still need more better updates on the map, filtering, etc. Still working on it(we hope to have a couple map changes to test soon), but getting sites in is taking priority. Let's just say the updates are "pending" :)

We are also going to go ahead and add in all the Nissan dealers, so if folks have been gathering pictures from their dealer deliveries or road trips and want to add in a dealer site themselves that would be fine. I know us Leafers are going to have the map, but I am sure Volt folks and the next round of EVer's would like to charge at a Nissan Dealer. We hope to have these gathered and entered in the next few weeks.

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walterbays
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Re: New EVSE maps website http://electric.carstations.com

Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:16 pm

ranchleaf wrote:Here is my favorite part:
"Located near the front of the Claddagh Pub."
This could end up being the most valuable part of the web site, kind of like a Yelp for EVs. (Might I suggest soliciting star ratings as well as text commentary?) Looking at other drivers ratings and then clicking through to read a few comments would help you choose between the place where comments say the EV parking spaces are usually free and you can have a sandwich and drink and watch the game while waiting - and the place where comments indicate that the EV spaces are usually filled with ICE cars, the proprietors don't care and won't do anything, and if you're lucky enough to plug in there's nowhere decent to wait within a mile's walk.
ranchleaf wrote:Yes, we know we still need more better updates on the map, filtering, etc. Still working on it(we hope to have a couple map changes to test soon), but getting sites in is taking priority. Let's just say the updates are "pending" :)
Filtering is required for it to be useful, answering the question: Where can I charge *my* *car*. Without filtering it answers the question: Where can I drive to in my ICE car to look at a charger? Even if you try to click through on map point after map point, hoping to find one with a compatible connector, each time you go back it resets you to a map of the whole world and you have to laboriously click back to your area of interest.

But don't get me wrong... Great start! And I expect it will be very useful by the time I finally get my car, and by the time some substantial charging infrastructure is built.
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evnow
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Re: New EVSE maps website http://electric.carstations.com

Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:50 pm

One thing to look for would be all the Nissan dealers who have added chargers.
1st Leaf : 2/28/2011 to 5/6/2013
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Re: New EVSE maps website http://electric.carstations.com

Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:52 pm

Don't want to hijack the thread but since I am the one who worked with Tom at EVChargerMaps to create the iPhone App EVChargerFinder, I do have some thoughts to contribute.

More the merrier is fine and having all the data available is a big win. Where we get into trouble is where there are interests in proprietary and pay networks that can confuse issues with proprietary info. Also contribute "I was here" user comments to the sites. That data is more valuable than any website since it is up to the minute from a person really using the chargers.

I would urge everyone who wants to contribute to send site locations into websites and apps you like. Help make them better. We need you all over the world to help up. I try to keep a strict line of not scraping other peoples data. Gathering that data is quite labor intensive and has value to the site owner. We have had problems with people pulling all the EVChargerMaps data and then putting out apps with Ad support on them. We also don't get access to databases like Nissan's.

We do this as a labor of love and really hope everyone has a good experience with their electric vehicle.

With the coming great rain of public chargers I hope you soon won't need a guide. But till then, let us know when you find a charger or when you would like to see a feature.

Welcome to the EV party, RanchLeaf. All the best. If you feel like collaborating on data or want to affiliate for iPhone apps, let me know. I also have an Android developer working on a version for since I know lots of you out there want it.

ranchleaf
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Re: New EVSE maps website http://electric.carstations.com

Thu Jan 06, 2011 8:39 am

walterbays wrote:
ranchleaf wrote:Here is my favorite part:
"Located near the front of the Claddagh Pub."
This could end up being the most valuable part of the web site, kind of like a Yelp for EVs. (Might I suggest soliciting star ratings as well as text commentary?) Looking at other drivers ratings and then clicking through to read a few comments would help you choose between the place where comments say the EV parking spaces are usually free and you can have a sandwich and drink and watch the game while waiting - and the place where comments indicate that the EV spaces are usually filled with ICE cars, the proprietors don't care and won't do anything, and if you're lucky enough to plug in there's nowhere decent to wait within a mile's walk.
ranchleaf wrote:Yes, we know we still need more better updates on the map, filtering, etc. Still working on it(we hope to have a couple map changes to test soon), but getting sites in is taking priority. Let's just say the updates are "pending" :)
Filtering is required for it to be useful, answering the question: Where can I charge *my* *car*. Without filtering it answers the question: Where can I drive to in my ICE car to look at a charger? Even if you try to click through on map point after map point, hoping to find one with a compatible connector, each time you go back it resets you to a map of the whole world and you have to laboriously click back to your area of interest.

But don't get me wrong... Great start! And I expect it will be very useful by the time I finally get my car, and by the time some substantial charging infrastructure is built.
Yep, you got it. This is the whole idea. Also looking at integrating yelp like and/or google like results. Also we are currently building a mobile app that should be pretty cool and useful.

ranchleaf
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Re: New EVSE maps website http://electric.carstations.com

Thu Jan 06, 2011 8:46 am

evnow wrote:One thing to look for would be all the Nissan dealers who have added chargers.
We should have up every "Leaf Authorized" dealer in Ca up in a couple weeks and then move on to other early states and beyond.

I am just going to go with for now that every "Leaf Dealer" is going to have their 2 public chargers and then just have all of us notify each other on the site if there is a non-participating dealer even if they are listed as one, which is possible. I am guessing Nissan's list of authorized dealers may not be fully accurate as I know many were still on the fence till the end including my own dealer.

also, hoping to find out from you all and other dealers about the use of any ones Level 3? For me living somewhat rurally is going to take some planning and if I can get set up a Level 3 charge from a dealer, that would great. So if you know of dealers with Level 3 willing to arrange something, that could be very valuable information for the Dealer as many folks will stop by.

Thanks for input.

David

ranchleaf
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map searching feature added to http://electric.carstations.c

Sat Jan 08, 2011 4:28 pm

Hi,

Just wanted to let everyone know it's much easier to find stations based on location now. Go to main page @ http://electric.carstations.com. At the top, simply type in a zip code or address and you'll zoom to the location. Obviously at this point some areas will have more than others, but that is quickly changing.

Try 94523 as a decent example or vacaville, ca or any address should work. Should work mostly for overseas addresses as well. We plan to tackle those too.

Next up on the updates is filtering by charge type and selection of how big the radius you want. I am not sure we are going to filter by manufacturer at this point as for most users it's not really going to matter.

Should have all CA Nissan leaf dealers in by next week, in addition to other new ones, so we could use some photos or information about the dealers.

thanks

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walterbays
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Re: map searching feature added to http://electric.carstations.c

Sat Jan 08, 2011 5:08 pm

ranchleaf wrote: Next up on the updates is filtering by charge type...
That's needed. Did you read the review of the Leaf where the journalist drove the car for several days? He charged at home, but as a test he found a charging station from the Nav map and drove there to recharge. What he found there was a paddle instead of a J1772 connector. He was sure glad he hadn't coasted up to that charging station on the last of his battery! Overall it was a positive review, but that public "charging" experience sure did nothing to quell range anxiety.
ranchleaf wrote:...and selection of how big the radius you want. I am not sure we are going to filter by manufacturer at this point as for most users it's not really going to matter.
I don't think setting the radius in a search is very important. Once you get to the area of interest you're probably going to recenter the map and zoom in or out to choose a station. I agree that manufacturer is irrelevant.

One more point... You mentioned that you never "scrape" other sites data, which you consider unethical, and implied that some other sites do scrape data. Ethics aside, it's clearly to the benefit of drivers if more charging directories have more valid data. And it's to our benefit if those sites which invest in providing the most accurate, relevant, and accessible data are successful so that they keep providing it to us.

I wonder if a few of the directory site owners might get together and agree on a standard for exchanging data, and for indicating what data you wish to allow to be copied. For example, there might be a core set of attributes which all directories need to carry, like location, type of connectors, number of spaces, etc. Some other attributes might be unique to particular directories, e.g. carstations.com user ratings, notes on nearby pubs, distance to shopping. A directory site might provide all its core data to competitors in an easy to access standard XML format, while declaring other fields of its data off limits. It might provide most of its listings freely, but withhold certain listings entirely which it felt gave its service an unique edge, e.g. all charging stations in Manhattan.

They'd get your data more easily, but you'd get theirs more easily too. Unethical operators would of course get the freely available data easily, and then continue to try to scrape the data you wanted to withhold. But they're doing that now, so you don't lose much. And in cases where they were taking the data because it wasn't clear that they shouldn't, this in effect posts "No Trespassing" signs. Some might back off and take only what you give freely. And for the others, it would at least be clear to you and to any drivers who cared just what they were doing.
7/00 Dodge Intrepid - 18 MPG - gas $1.72
10/04 Toyota Prius - 35 MPG - $2.40
8/30/10 reserved - $3.09
2/22/11 ordered red SL ETEC - $3.56
3/15/11 delivery est. May - $3.95
4/29/11 delivery est. June - $4.20
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Re: map searching feature added to http://electric.carstations.c

Sat Jan 08, 2011 5:28 pm

walterbays wrote: One more point... You mentioned that you never "scrape" other sites data, which you consider unethical, and implied that some other sites do scrape data. Ethics aside, it's clearly to the benefit of drivers if more charging directories have more valid data. And it's to our benefit if those sites which invest in providing the most accurate, relevant, and accessible data are successful so that they keep providing it to us.

I wonder if a few of the directory site owners might get together and agree on a standard for exchanging data, and for indicating what data you wish to allow to be copied. For example, there might be a core set of attributes which all directories need to carry, like location, type of connectors, number of spaces, etc. Some other attributes might be unique to particular directories, e.g. carstations.com user ratings, notes on nearby pubs, distance to shopping. A directory site might provide all its core data to competitors in an easy to access standard XML format, while declaring other fields of its data off limits. It might provide most of its listings freely, but withhold certain listings entirely which it felt gave its service an unique edge, e.g. all charging stations in Manhattan.

They'd get your data more easily, but you'd get theirs more easily too. Unethical operators would of course get the freely available data easily, and then continue to try to scrape the data you wanted to withhold. But they're doing that now, so you don't lose much. And in cases where they were taking the data because it wasn't clear that they shouldn't, this in effect posts "No Trespassing" signs. Some might back off and take only what you give freely. And for the others, it would at least be clear to you and to any drivers who cared just what they were doing.
That was me. It is really my personal ethics. It takes me and others lots of time to clean, validate, and generate this data. But I agree with your point in general. I wish Chargepoint, Nissan, etc al shared your enthusiasm. Ideally there would be a central place for the data and websites and apps would compete on features instead of hording data. But I can tell you from experience that lots of people put up quick apps or websites that are ad supported and just steal the data. Since we do this out of love and sweat. That annoys me. But that is how things go.

For this purpose though, I have decided unilaterally, that I would open source the data I get from this forum and Leaf emails and share it publicly. If you want to contribute to this, it will be public for all to use. But do support and contribute pictures and user reports to the apps and websites you believe it and like.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key ... ySlE&hl=en

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