RePo
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Delivery Date: 28 Mar 2013
Leaf Number: 404201
Location: Houston, TX

Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Fri May 29, 2015 9:58 am

The power inverter in the Leaf will put out 135 amps. That's 1620 watts. So, your ideal solution without going over is a 1500 watt inverter. That'll run your 1300 watt cooker easy.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Cobra-CPI15 ... 35c248f1d8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And, it'll give your the battery voltage readout.
I love mine.
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Found my super black 2013 Leaf.

NissanLeafCamper
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Location: Los Angeles California

Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Fri May 29, 2015 10:59 am

TomT wrote:We have a refrigerator on our boat with a 12 volt DC compressor. It pulls surprisingly little power and is very efficient. And quiet too.
BrockWI wrote:Comparing a peltier to a 120vac small cube fridge with the losses from an inverter are probably more than the peltier.
Hi TomT,

What is your suggestion? Use a refrigerator that runs on DC current? No more inverter = not counting inverter loss into consumption equation? Would the fridge then be connected directly to the deep cycle agm battery with clamps or is it done differently. I believe the battery unloads DC current and the inverter turns it into AC?
BrockWI wrote:Yes a 12v compressor is the way to go, no doubt, but comparing cost a 45 quart peltier at $75 to a compressor version at $325 :)

In all fairness the disadvantage of a peltier is it runs 24x7 to keep the inside about 40F cooler than it's surrounding. So in 90F it will be 50F inside the cooler. When it's 50F outside the inside will likely freeze if left on and get to 20F. A compressor unit is more more like a traditional fridge, you can set a temp and forget it. Also a peltier takes a lot longer to cool down room temp items, where a compressor will cool down quicker.

The right tool for the right job... :)

As far as heating things up look for "trucker stove" there are quiet a few options for 12v as well.
Thank you for that input I went online and googled the trucker stove and read about the roadpro in amazon http://www.amazon.com/RoadPro-12-Volt-P ... B00030DLEE" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It seeems like a nice item to reheat pre-made items. This one seems like a nice option though when I mentioned making a soup I wanted to adds items that would require a bit of cooking (beans for example). I think rice could maybe get cooked in there which would be nice. It would be nice if I could make some scrambled eggs which I don't think the heater could do.... Toasting a sandwich would be really awesome too :).

Am I looking at the wrong item? is it one you can actually cook with?

NissanLeafCamper
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Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Fri May 29, 2015 11:43 am

RePo wrote:The power inverter in the Leaf will put out 135 amps. That's 1620 watts. So, your ideal solution without going over is a 1500 watt inverter. That'll run your 1300 watt cooker easy.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Cobra-CPI15 ... 35c248f1d8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And, it'll give your the battery voltage readout.
I love mine.
Image
Thanks RePo. So it is 1620 watts minus the drain from other electrical equipments in the leaf? Would it not be better to get a pure sinewave inverter instead of a modified sinewave? I used to use the cobra to recharge my laptop in the car by the unit seemed to die often and I would end up returning it. i think it was around 300w from walmart :( I ended up switching to peak modified sinewave inverter...

BrockWI
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Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Fri May 29, 2015 11:46 am

Thats is what I was thinking of, you might also look at small propane or butane single burner options. Again they are pretty inexpensive and small and don't require a battery or inverter. Something like this.

http://www.amazon.com/Iwatani-Corporati ... tane+stove" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
3 kw solar pv - XW6048 - eight L16's
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NissanLeafCamper
Posts: 205
Joined: Fri May 22, 2015 1:46 pm
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Location: Los Angeles California

Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Fri May 29, 2015 11:56 am

BrockWI wrote:Thats is what I was thinking of, you might also look at small propane or butane single burner options. Again they are pretty inexpensive and small and don't require a battery or inverter. Something like this.

http://www.amazon.com/Iwatani-Corporati ... tane+stove" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks Brock. I actually have a coleman twin burner which is much larger than the one you mentioned which I have used on and off. Admitedly it is twice as big as that one so it has been a little pain to use lol. However, I have used it and made some meals. The only thing is that the green propane tanks tend to be a little expensive (I think 10 USD for 2 which a big white propane is 20$ for a refill at the market). They last okay though I think when I make a soup they ran out a bit too fast for me taste. I have an adapter for a large white propane tank to hook it up to the coleman twin burner but... that huge propane sitting in my car makes me feel nervous :o . I have read that the induction cookers are no bigger than a small sized book so they seem to have some nice advantages over the propane in terms of weight and dimension. Also think they are supposed to be 70% efficient? Since I could recharge the leaf at free charging stations wouldn't the induction cooker be the cheaper option? Well! Actually the induction cooker costs much more than the propane stove ... plus the inverter cost... I wonder how long it would take for me to break even? Specially if I pick up a pure sine wave inverter. Modified sine wave tend to be really really cheap! About 10 bucks a moth worth of propane is only 120 usd a year... pretty cheap! I think the induction cooker is more than that to buy lol.

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Nubo
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Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Fri May 29, 2015 3:18 pm

NissanLeafCamper wrote:..I was thinking if it would be ok to switch the car's starter battery with a deep cycle agm to reduce the amount of time the car needs to be on? I believe I herd that wwhen the leaf is 'on' the onboard electronics also drain some wattage around 300 watts? So I wanted to lessen that if possible by using a deep cycle. I would just need a way to track the status on the battery as it drains perhaps with a voltage meter or some other device ran to the inside of the leaf. I will likely just leave the electric cooler unplugged over night when I sleep if it would be too much for a single deep cycle agm (Odyssey brand). The rest of the time I will be in the car which is just about the whole day. ...
A deep-cycle AGM battery has worked fine in my LEAFs and should be standard equipment, imho. There is no high-current starting demand so you can get a full-on deep-cycle battery without worrying about "cold cranking amps".

If you do some research on odyssey deep-cycle batteries, you may find (as I did) that a lot of complaints about poor quality began after the company was sold to Johnson Controls and they moved production from the US to Mexico.

For a true purpose-built deep-cycle battery for LEAF, I chose the Sun Xtender PVX-420T. You'll need to purchase some SAE terminal adapters but it can be made to fit without too much fuss.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

GRA
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Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Fri May 29, 2015 4:12 pm

NissanLeafCamper wrote:
BrockWI wrote:Thats is what I was thinking of, you might also look at small propane or butane single burner options. Again they are pretty inexpensive and small and don't require a battery or inverter. Something like this.

http://www.amazon.com/Iwatani-Corporati ... tane+stove" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks Brock. I actually have a coleman twin burner which is much larger than the one you mentioned which I have used on and off. Admitedly it is twice as big as that one so it has been a little pain to use lol. However, I have used it and made some meals. The only thing is that the green propane tanks tend to be a little expensive (I think 10 USD for 2 which a big white propane is 20$ for a refill at the market). They last okay though I think when I make a soup they ran out a bit too fast for me taste. I have an adapter for a large white propane tank to hook it up to the coleman twin burner but... that huge propane sitting in my car makes me feel nervous :o . I have read that the induction cookers are no bigger than a small sized book so they seem to have some nice advantages over the propane in terms of weight and dimension. Also think they are supposed to be 70% efficient? Since I could recharge the leaf at free charging stations wouldn't the induction cooker be the cheaper option? Well! Actually the induction cooker costs much more than the propane stove ... plus the inverter cost... I wonder how long it would take for me to break even? Specially if I pick up a pure sine wave inverter. Modified sine wave tend to be really really cheap! About 10 bucks a moth worth of propane is only 120 usd a year... pretty cheap! I think the induction cooker is more than that to buy lol.
For car camping I like the Iwatani design, as it's very stable. On the downside, it uses special canisters, which can be expensive and, if discontinued, can leave you with a stove useful only as a mobile (I'd been using the same EFI Mini aka Hank Roberts butane stove for lightweight trips for 30 years, but had to replace it after using my last hoarded fuel canister. The Soto [see below] is a considerable improvement in space, weight and boiling time, and uses a standard canister so hopefully will last me out the rest of my backpacking/X-C skiing/mountaineering life). If space and weight are issues, just get yourself a single burner backpacking stove. Butane/propane canister stoves are easier to use than liquid fuel ones (white gas or kerosene), but more expensive if used frequently. Here's the one I currently use:

http://www.sotooutdoors.com/products/item/OD-1RX.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The stove is everything above the base (which is the discardable, standard fuel canister, available just about everywhere and used by the majority of canister stoves). However, its pot support is limited for larger pots (they make a 4 prong support for those), and all the stoves that mount on top of the canister can be a bit tippy if you're careless. Some models have outrigger legs that attach to the canisters to improve things. For car camping, I'd recommend something lower and more stable, with the Iwatani type being ideal, but there are other options. Go to REI and browse the backpacking stoves, or here: http://www.rei.com/c/backpacking-stoves ... ves&page=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Get one recommended for cooking as opposed to primarily boiling water (Jetboils et al), as you want one with good flame control if you want to scramble eggs. Read the customer reviews. Naturally, these are all for outside use. White gas stoves are better for groups or in winter, but much more of a hassle to light/relight, and for car camping I don't think they're worth the trouble unless fuel costs are critical.

The Primus Yellowstone canister stove is cheap ($20). It's a little heavy for backpacking (8 oz. sans fuel canister. My Soto is 2.3 oz.), but has excellent pot support, good for a fry pan. The Soto and some of the others have a built-in lighter, which is convenient. However, many of the lighters are easily damaged (the Soto's isn't), so it's always prudent to have a lighter or matches just in case. OTOH, for stability, one of the butane/propane stoves with a tube leading from the fuel canister to the stove base, like the MSR Whisperlite Universal, may be a better idea. Are you a klutz in the kitchen, or careful? The Snow Peak Bipod looks like a good idea for your needs, stable albeit relatively heavy (7.8 oz.), but is new so no reviews yet, and is a bit pricey at $90. However, REI has regular sales, and if you're a member most sales allow you to get one full-price item at 20% off, if the specific item you want isn't on sale for even more of a discount.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

NissanLeafCamper
Posts: 205
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Location: Los Angeles California

Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Fri May 29, 2015 5:13 pm

Nubo wrote:
A deep-cycle AGM battery has worked fine in my LEAFs and should be standard equipment, imho. There is no high-current starting demand so you can get a full-on deep-cycle battery without worrying about "cold cranking amps".

If you do some research on odyssey deep-cycle batteries, you may find (as I did) that a lot of complaints about poor quality began after the company was sold to Johnson Controls and they moved production from the US to Mexico.

For a true purpose-built deep-cycle battery for LEAF, I chose the Sun Xtender PVX-420T. You'll need to purchase some SAE terminal adapters but it can be made to fit without too much fuss.
Thank you for the information. What kind of items do you run from you deep cycle battery? How much watts do they use and how long have you ran them for? I am wondering about how long that battery will last before needing me to turn the leaf on so the dc to dc converter recharges the battery. The smallest induction cooker I saw as 1300 watts I think I would use it for around 20 minutes or so (At the most I think). I am still not sure on what type of cooler/refrigerator I would get but from the replies I saw it doesn't seem to use many watts once it is on. Though I think that when you first turn it on and the compressor kicks it the item needs a big load of juice?
GRA wrote:The stove is everything above the base (which is the discardable, standard fuel canister, available just about everywhere and used by the majority of canister stoves). However, its pot support is limited for larger pots (they make a 4 prong support for those), and all the stoves that mount on top of the canister can be a bit tippy if you're careless. Some models have outrigger legs that attach to the canisters to improve things. For car camping, I'd recommend something lower and more stable, with the Iwatani type being ideal, but there are other options. Go to REI and browse the backpacking stoves, or here: http://www.rei.com/c/backpacking-stoves" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ... ves&page=1

Get one recommended for cooking as opposed to primarily boiling water (Jetboils et al), as you want one with good flame control if you want to scramble eggs. Read the customer reviews. Naturally, these are all for outside use. White gas stoves are better for groups or in winter, but much more of a hassle to light/relight, and for car camping I don't think they're worth the trouble unless fuel costs are critical.

The Primus Yellowstone canister stove is cheap ($20). It's a little heavy for backpacking (8 oz. sans fuel canister. My Soto is 2.3 oz.), but has excellent pot support, good for a fry pan. The Soto and some of the others have a built-in lighter, which is convenient. However, many of the lighters are easily damaged (the Soto's isn't), so it's always prudent to have a lighter or matches just in case. OTOH, for stability, one of the butane/propane stoves with a tube leading from the fuel canister to the stove base, like the MSR Whisperlite Universal, may be a better idea. Are you a klutz in the kitchen, or careful? The Snow Peak Bipod looks like a good idea for your needs, stable albeit relatively heavy (7.8 oz.), but is new so no reviews yet, and is a bit pricey at $90. However, REI has regular sales, and if you're a member most sales allow you to get one full-price item at 20% off, if the specific item you want isn't on sale for even more of a discount.
Thank you wow I did not know you could buy just the burner itself for cooking. This tells you I have never gone camping before lol. Wish I had known about this before I bought my twin burner stove from coleman. It is big and heavy, well for me at least. The Primus is so cheap. I can't believe the price jump from the Primus to the Whisperlite; about 80-100 usd?! Seems like the only upgrade was the support/fuel line :? I would not trust myself cooking inside the car with the Prius and too risky even with the whisperlite. It would definitely have to be done outside. I have used the coleman twin burner stove inside the car before by just sitting it on the passenger seat and cooking something on top; the lid folds back against the seat protecting it. It is basically a big brief case with two burners inside. I'm just not sure about cooking outside the vehicle not sure if it is legal/illegal to cook in the streets :?: Not sure what the cops would say. I think i read that carrying propane inside a passenger vehicle is illegal in los angeles. So ever since then I always feel that I am at 'risk' when cooking with it. Have not exactly tried to verify it as I looked into it a few years ago when I bought the coleman portable stove.

I would have to think about but I think if I choose the burner you suggest then I'd likely have to get some kind of propane operated cooler/tiny fridge to go with it and that might just be a few too many possibly explosive items inside the car! I'm still wondering what the price difference will be between propane / electric? 20$ for the primus is super cheap. The cylinders seem to be about $10 too? about 120/mo if I only use one canister per month? If 2 then $240 in one year. A quick amazon search turns up $56 Induction cooker at amazon ( Spt 1300-Watt Induction Cooktop, Silver Free shipping) and $160 for that cobra modified sine wave at amazon (Free shipping) For a total of $216 usd not counting the deep cycle agm suggested just now (+148$+s ) and the adapters which I am not sure how much they will cost. At least one plus side on the induction cooker is that the risk of fire ..might.. be possibly reduced lol. I am going to be recharging at a free charging station not to far from where I usually am and with the extra time I get to have on my hands I think it will just work out to free electricity most of the time for me.

-edit-

Just called my family and asked what size the propane tank for the coleman stove is. "Coleman Propane Fuel, 16.4 oz" basically. I asked about how many times we use it before it runs out and we thought about 7 times. Makes me wonder about how many uses you get out of the small 2.3 oz :?: The 8 oz canister will be half the size so I am not sure how well that would work out. Perhaps 4 times worth of use?

GRA
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Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Mon Jun 01, 2015 5:53 pm

NissanLeafCamper wrote:
GRA wrote:The stove is everything above the base (which is the discardable, standard fuel canister, available just about everywhere and used by the majority of canister stoves). However, its pot support is limited for larger pots (they make a 4 prong support for those), and all the stoves that mount on top of the canister can be a bit tippy if you're careless. Some models have outrigger legs that attach to the canisters to improve things. For car camping, I'd recommend something lower and more stable, with the Iwatani type being ideal, but there are other options. Go to REI and browse the backpacking stoves, or here: http://www.rei.com/c/backpacking-stoves" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ... ves&page=1

Get one recommended for cooking as opposed to primarily boiling water (Jetboils et al), as you want one with good flame control if you want to scramble eggs. Read the customer reviews. Naturally, these are all for outside use. White gas stoves are better for groups or in winter, but much more of a hassle to light/relight, and for car camping I don't think they're worth the trouble unless fuel costs are critical.

The Primus Yellowstone canister stove is cheap ($20). It's a little heavy for backpacking (8 oz. sans fuel canister. My Soto is 2.3 oz.), but has excellent pot support, good for a fry pan. The Soto and some of the others have a built-in lighter, which is convenient. However, many of the lighters are easily damaged (the Soto's isn't), so it's always prudent to have a lighter or matches just in case. OTOH, for stability, one of the butane/propane stoves with a tube leading from the fuel canister to the stove base, like the MSR Whisperlite Universal, may be a better idea. Are you a klutz in the kitchen, or careful? The Snow Peak Bipod looks like a good idea for your needs, stable albeit relatively heavy (7.8 oz.), but is new so no reviews yet, and is a bit pricey at $90. However, REI has regular sales, and if you're a member most sales allow you to get one full-price item at 20% off, if the specific item you want isn't on sale for even more of a discount.
Thank you wow I did not know you could buy just the burner itself for cooking. This tells you I have never gone camping before lol. Wish I had known about this before I bought my twin burner stove from coleman. It is big and heavy, well for me at least. The Primus is so cheap. I can't believe the price jump from the Primus to the Whisperlite; about 80-100 usd?! Seems like the only upgrade was the support/fuel line :?
No, it allows you to use butane/propane canisters or white gas plus there's some other advantages, most of which are irrelevant for your needs. The Yellowstone is your basic butane/propane backpacking stove, dating from around 15 years ago. It's not sophisticated, heavy (for backpacking) and lacks the latest tech. As a result, performance falls off markedly in cold weather and/or as the canister empties. OTOH, it does have the advantage for your needs of a relatively large pot support, and stability. YGWYPF. Although aimed at the needs of backpacker/X-C skier/mountaineer types like myself, this article (by MSR, but applicable to types of stoves if not the specifics of other brands) gives you general info on the advantages and disadvantages of canister and liquid-fuel stoves for different situations: http://www.cascadedesigns.com/msr/blog/ ... quid-fuel/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

For possibly more info than you want, here's an article on stoves using upright versus inverted (like the Whisperlite) canisters: http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin ... d_id=72761" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
NissanLeafCamper wrote:I would not trust myself cooking inside the car with the Prius and too risky even with the whisperlite. It would definitely have to be done outside. I have used the coleman twin burner stove inside the car before by just sitting it on the passenger seat and cooking something on top; the lid folds back against the seat protecting it. It is basically a big brief case with two burners inside. I'm just not sure about cooking outside the vehicle not sure if it is legal/illegal to cook in the streets :?: Not sure what the cops would say. I think i read that carrying propane inside a passenger vehicle is illegal in los angeles. So ever since then I always feel that I am at 'risk' when cooking with it. Have not exactly tried to verify it as I looked into it a few years ago when I bought the coleman portable stove.
IMO, cooking inside a car should only be done in a survival situation, when no other option is available. I've never heard of any law against cooking outdoors, and the police would have to bust everyone using a barbecue set for tailgate parties outside of stadium parking lots if they did. I suppose they might object if you put it on the sidewalk where people could walk past, but I suspect it wouldn't be a problem on the hood, or on the ground/on a table like this one, http://www.rei.com/product/765280/rei-c ... mc:cse_PLA" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; behind/in front/alongside of the car in a parking space. As to carrying propane inside a car, ? Seems ridiculous and impossible to enforce. Bulk propane like a tanker truck, sure. But every RV on the street would seem to violate such a law in L.A., not to mention everyone hauling a propane tank for their barbeque to/from refilling or swapping it.

BTW, any of these stoves other than a jetboil-type system or one of the MSR separated burner stoves will benefit from some kind of extra windscreen on windy days. The critical thing is this: never surround or enclose the fuel canister. Letting it get hot is a REALLY BAD IDEA. Any windscreen you come up with should block off no more than three sides, and be situated well away from the fuel canister of sit-on-top type canister stoves. The canister temp should be checked by hand to make sure it doesn't feel warm or hot when cooking; it should be cool to cold. You can make a cheap two- or three-sided windscreen from a piece of cardboard cut from a box and covered with aluminum foil, you can block off the wind with anything handy (boots, cooler etc.) or you can get as fancy as you like. But obey the rule about keeping the fuel canister cool.
NissanLeafCamper wrote: I would have to think about but I think if I choose the burner you suggest then I'd likely have to get some kind of propane operated cooler/tiny fridge to go with it and that might just be a few too many possibly explosive items inside the car! I'm still wondering what the price difference will be between propane / electric? 20$ for the primus is super cheap. The cylinders seem to be about $10 too? about 120/mo if I only use one canister per month? If 2 then $240 in one year. A quick amazon search turns up $56 Induction cooker at amazon ( Spt 1300-Watt Induction Cooktop, Silver Free shipping) and $160 for that cobra modified sine wave at amazon (Free shipping) For a total of $216 usd not counting the deep cycle agm suggested just now (+148$+s ) and the adapters which I am not sure how much they will cost. At least one plus side on the induction cooker is that the risk of fire ..might.. be possibly reduced lol. I am going to be recharging at a free charging station not to far from where I usually am and with the extra time I get to have on my hands I think it will just work out to free electricity most of the time for me.

-edit-

Just called my family and asked what size the propane tank for the coleman stove is. "Coleman Propane Fuel, 16.4 oz" basically. I asked about how many times we use it before it runs out and we thought about 7 times. Makes me wonder about how many uses you get out of the small 2.3 oz :?: The 8 oz canister will be half the size so I am not sure how well that would work out. Perhaps 4 times worth of use?
Read the specs of the particular stoves, or consult the stove comparison handout sheet at an REI, but typically you get around 50-60 minutes of run time at maximum flame from the smallest (100g/3.5 oz. of fuel) canister, so multiply that run time by the appropriate number for larger canisters. OTOH, it's entirely possible to get propane single-burner stoves that use standard (16.4 oz.) propane cylinders, which may well be the best choice for you since you don't need to carry the stove yourself. Some of them look like the Iwatani with a separate canister, others use a sit-on-top design. For prolonged car camping, I'd probably recommend that - you aren't anywhere near as constrained by space and weight issues as someone who has to carry everything on their back.

As for induction cookers, I have no experience with them, but in general my opinion is that using a high-quality form of energy like electricity for a low-quality use like cooking is a waste (short use like a microwave aside). If you insist on cooking inside the car, they obviously have some safety benefit compared to a stove with a flame, but not enough to get me to do it. HTH.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

Eyeresearch
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2013 7:14 pm

Re: Inverter for a small refrigerator for the leaf?

Sat Jun 06, 2015 4:08 pm

I agree with the previous poster about the cooler, sometimes we lose site of the real issue and try to use technology for the sake of “playing with cool stuff” (pun intended), kinda sorta. The task at hand is to the keep food / drinks cool, right. O.K. now that this is established let’s not try to reinvent the wheel here, remember we are not beyond re-supply points along the way, don’t have to load the car and cooler and never re-stock mid journey. Stay cool and stay inexpensive is our main goal, having said that how about we revisit the idea of the cooler and take a look at the new and improved coolers out on the market today.

Enter the Yetti – Roadie Model to be exact. Keeps your stuff cold for DAYS and is not a space hog.

http://yeticoolers.com/roadie-cooler/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Use one in my kayak, sometimes two, one for wet ice and the other with dry ice for extended trips and I get tired of the freeze dried route, have even taken ice cream on trips, surprised some of my fellow campers when I tossed them a frozen hard ice cream novelty after a hard days paddling down river with no site of the Good Humor Man around.

On the hot side of the equation might I suggest or second like a previous poster mentioned and consider one of the lightweight backpack stoves. I personally have been using a MSR Wisperlite Backpack Stove for 27 years (backpacking & kayak kamping) cause I don’t like carrying heavy stuff around. There are a gazillion different types of backpack stoves out there. Check out and see what fits your taste and space.

http://www.campmor.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I also have a small 6 pound propane bottle (about the size of a gallon of milk) with an adapter to fuel a small propane stove where some people normally use the disposables, myself I like to re-fill and re-use.

Never have any type of flame inside of a car or tent. Recipe for disaster.

Happy Trails

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