estomax
Posts: 268
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 9:23 pm
Delivery Date: 21 Jan 2017
Leaf Number: 424033
Location: Seattle

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Wed Mar 25, 2020 8:48 am

Dala said somewhere that he will start looking into getting more power through the VCM. Dala, let me know if you need help with testing!
2013 Leaf SL Premium
27k, 93% SoH 2/17 32k, 96% SoH 6/17
46k, 94% SoH 2/18 52k, 88% SoH 6/18
62k, 87% SoH 2/19 68k, 84% SoH 6/19
75k, 83% SoH 2/20

Oilpan4
Posts: 1725
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Wed Mar 25, 2020 11:24 am

There's leaf tuning software available but no one's using it as far as I know.
"THE ABOVE POST CONTAINS MISLEADING AND INACCURATE INFORMATION. PLEASE CONSIDER IT OPINION, NOT FACT". -someone who I offended and is unable to produce the facts in question.

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Nubo
Posts: 5775
Joined: Fri May 28, 2010 11:01 am
Delivery Date: 31 Oct 2014
Location: Vallejo, CA

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:24 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 1:26 pm
The change in acceleration is from a change in the magnets in the motor and in programming. This happened for 2013, while the first gearset was still in use.
Perhaps the drive ratio was increased a bit to recover some of the low-end acceleration after the motor change?
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

LeftieBiker
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Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Wed Mar 25, 2020 10:38 pm

Nubo wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:24 pm
LeftieBiker wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 1:26 pm
The change in acceleration is from a change in the magnets in the motor and in programming. This happened for 2013, while the first gearset was still in use.
Perhaps the drive ratio was increased a bit to recover some of the low-end acceleration after the motor change?
Maybe, but what happens is the 2013 cars are slower off the line, but accelerate a little faster at higher speeds, to get to 60 at the same time, more or less. That is completely consistent with the ratio staying the same and the power curve changing.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

GerryAZ
Gold Member
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Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:16 pm

I looked up the specifications in the service manuals. The difference in ratio is due to a change in the number of gear teeth on the first driven gear from 31 to 32. The numbers of teeth on all other gears are the same so I suspect the change was made for ease of manufacturing rather than specifically to change the ratio. The difference in acceleration between the 2011/2012 models and 2013-2017 models is primarily the programming that limits torque if you floor the accelerator on 2013 or later units.

My 2011 would give all it had to offer if I just floored the accelerator. I thought my 2015 was significantly slower until I met someone from the test track who told me to feather the accelerator instead of flooring it. The 2015 was almost as quick as the 2011 if I feathered the accelerator just right, but it was hard to be consistent--the 2011 would have been much better for bracket drag racing because it was consistent. The 2019 also benefits from feathering, but the OEM tires also limit maximum acceleration (very easy to light the traction control indicator) since they are dealing with twice the horsepower. Still, I would gladly purchase a "performance chip" to get instant accelerator pedal response if one were available in the USA and it would not impact warranty coverage.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL Plus purchased 8/10/2019

nlspace
Posts: 225
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:21 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Jun 2017

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:07 am

Wonder why Ben measured 8.25:1 (average of 2 tests) when the calculated was 8.3044:1 ?

calc. = (75/17)(32/17) = 8.3044

Also he said the wiki was reporting 7.94:1, but based upon Gerry's finding the calculated would be

(75/17)(31/17) = 8.0449 : 1

For sure the error or difference is on the order of 1% or less, but still that seems excessive. Is there considerable backlash or clearance in the meshing of the gear teeth to account for that difference?

GerryAZ
Gold Member
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Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Sat Mar 28, 2020 1:26 pm

From service manuals:
2011 Input shaft gear: 17 teeth
2011 Intermediate shaft gears: 31 teeth, 17 teeth
2011 Output shaft gear: 74 teeth

2015 and 2019 Input shaft gear: 17 teeth
2015 and 2019 Intermediate shaft gears: 32 teeth, 17 teeth
2015 and 2019 Output shaft gear: 74 teeth

2011 RE1F61A Reduction Gear Ratio:
(74/17)(31/17)=7.9377

2015 and 2019 RE1F61B Reduction Gear Ratio:
(74/17)(32/17)=8.1938

Difference in overall ratio is about 3.2 percent.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL Plus purchased 8/10/2019

nlspace
Posts: 225
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:21 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Jun 2017

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Sat Mar 28, 2020 7:47 pm

Way to go Gerry, Thanks for looking up the gears, and that explains it--Ben failed counting teeth in school. i tried to count the teeth from the video but it was too jumpy for me, and i just trusted Ben's numbers.

Oilpan4
Posts: 1725
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Sun Mar 29, 2020 12:18 pm

Any leads on performance VCUs?
I have a 2011 with over 70,000 miles, the warranty is moot at this point.
I would like to see what it can do going from 0rpm to full torque and then some in less than a second.
"THE ABOVE POST CONTAINS MISLEADING AND INACCURATE INFORMATION. PLEASE CONSIDER IT OPINION, NOT FACT". -someone who I offended and is unable to produce the facts in question.

LeftieBiker
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Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Reduction gear ratio swap?

Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:06 pm

I don't think that the NISMO chip does more than remove the WFO throttle restriction on the 2013+ Leaf, and maybe get to full throttle a bit faster in the pedal travel. My evidence? No stories of Japanese NISMO Leafs performing any remarkable feats of acceleration. The best mod would be the ePlus inverter in a 30 or 40 KWH Leaf. I'm not sure how well it would work with a 24 - you'd probably have to use full throttle only when above 80% charge.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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