Electrical line noise while charging at 240V

[turbo2ltr]

I don't think there's much wrong. It's a side effect of the switching circuits of the charger. Could it be better? sure. But I don't believe it to be a problem.

 

[garygid]

Perhaps one needs to look at the current waveform?

Do the peaks of the AC voltage look somewhat flattened?

 

[Clippy]

It occurs on circuits with or without GFCI. These outlets do pass ground testers.
3) This same noise is audible directly from my electrical subpanel while charging at 240V. It's normally silent. (My subpanel is up in my living space, two flights above my garage.)
4) My 240V source is a dedicated 30 amp circuit for my dryer with the old style 3-prong outlet. (NEMA 10-30)
5) Two noise filters tested against the computer display didn't help. Another old noise filter (SL Waber WaveTracker) that I dug out of the closet fried itself (flash+burnt smell) when I tried to use it. (It had been sitting in storage for many years.)

Check the ground path from your sub to the main panel. Grounded neutral?

 

[TEG]

Do any of the EVSE's provide line noise filtering on the 240V? I wonder if this issue could be more or less pronounced depending on what J1772 EVSE you use to plug in the Leaf.

 

[garygid]

We thought that the AV L2 EVSE had ... what appeared to be a "large" torroid with the power input lines wrapped around it, ... probably a line noise filter.

 

[TomT]

My guess is that is more to meet FCC part 15 RF radiation limits at higher frequencies than it is for the lower frequencies we are discussing here...

We thought that the AV L2 EVSE had ... what appeared to be a "large" torroid with the power input lines wrapped around it, ... probably a line noise filter.

 

[hill]

I haven't checked all the frequencies but I've herd zero RFI on my HAM radios which are only about 15 feet away from my Blink unit. I expected LOTS of noise, but was pleasantly surprised. I haven't listened to my inverter for my solar.....99% of the time, I charge after midnight when (last time I checked), there isn't much solar generation going on.

What frequencies are you checking via amateur bands? How 'open' is your squelch? Most transceivers are set up to cancel noise, so if you have access to a spectrum analyzer, you may be surprised what's actually bringing about noisy/unacceptable interference.

I've previously reported this too. It has nothing to do with the EVSE, but (I believe) the charger design. I hear the charging in my computer speakers (very faint), my dimmable CFL turns into one of those flickering candles, and X10 becomes unreliable. Maybe I'll take my scope home tonight and check it out. It's clear the charger is putting all kinds of noise on the line. This happened with both the Clipper Creek and the Blink.

Interesging. X10 runs on microwave frequencies (2.4ghz) albeit just a few milliamps of power. 60 hertz does divide into 2.4ghz as well as numerous other parts of the spectrum, but one wouldn't figure it to 'buzz' the way it does on one of our PV inverters. I wonder if I could build an RF choke to cancel it out.

 

[turbo2ltr]

X10 runs nowhere near 2.4ghz. It operates at the zero crossing of the AC line...which translates to 120 bits per sec theoretical maximum.

You must be referring to something else.

 

[hill]

X10 runs nowhere near 2.4ghz. It operates at the zero crossing of the AC line...which translates to 120 bits per sec theoretical maximum.

You must be referring to something else.

I guess so ... just from reading up on some X10 devices being interfered with over the years -
http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/Other_2.4_GHz_Device_Compatibility

X10 cameras and Video Senders use the following frequencies:
Channel A
2.411 GHz
Channel B
2.434 GHz
Channel C
2.453 GHz
Channel D
2.473 GHz

 

[Christopher]

Just a reminder that as this thread wanders elsewhere, I'm still looking for a volunteer who could stop by briefly with their LEAF to see if their car generates electrical noise when charging at 240V on my building's electrical system. If it does not, then I'll want to bring my car in to the dealer. It'll only take a few minutes. (Move my car out-of-the-way, plug yours in, I run upstairs, noise or no noise?, I come back down and you're on your way!) I'm near 880 and Montague Expressway in north San Jose (near Milpitas).

Thanks,
Christopher

 

[Christopher]

4) My 240V source is a dedicated 30 amp circuit for my dryer with the old style 3-prong outlet. (NEMA 10-30)

Check the ground path from your sub to the main panel. Grounded neutral?

Thanks but that's something I'll have to leave to an electrician, particularly being in a condo building.

 

[turbo2ltr]

X10 runs nowhere near 2.4ghz. It operates at the zero crossing of the AC line...which translates to 120 bits per sec theoretical maximum.

You must be referring to something else.

I guess so ... just from reading up on some X10 devices being interfered with over the years -
http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/Other_2.4_GHz_Device_Compatibility

X10 cameras and Video Senders use the following frequencies:
Channel A
2.411 GHz
Channel B
2.434 GHz
Channel C
2.453 GHz
Channel D
2.473 GHz

Ahh, you are referring to wireless cameras, I was referring to the powerline carrier lighting and appliance control protocol. When the charger is on, signals do not transmit over the powerline to the dimmers and switches very well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X10_%28industry_standard%29

 

[GeekEV]

I would, but that's too far away for me. Sorry...

 

[ElectricVehicle]

Just a reminder that as this thread wanders elsewhere, I'm still looking for a volunteer who could stop by briefly with their LEAF to see if their car generates electrical noise when charging at 240V on my building's electrical system. If it does not, then I'll want to bring my car in to the dealer. It'll only take a few minutes. (Move my car out-of-the-way, plug yours in, I run upstairs, noise or no noise?, I come back down and you're on your way!) I'm near 880 and Montague Expressway in north San Jose (near Milpitas).

Thanks,
Christopher

I volunteer to stop by later next week with my LEAF.

 

[hill]

Just a reminder that as this thread wanders elsewhere, I'm still looking for a volunteer who could stop by briefly with their LEAF to see if their car generates electrical noise when charging at 240V on my building's electrical system. If it does not, then I'll want to bring my car in to the dealer. It'll only take a few minutes. (Move my car out-of-the-way, plug yours in, I run upstairs, noise or no noise?, I come back down and you're on your way!) I'm near 880 and Montague Expressway in north San Jose (near Milpitas). . . . . . . . . . . . snip
Thanks,
Christopher

Don't think of it as wandering Christopher ... think of it as tangential A.D.D.
:lol:
no actually, discussing the collaterals does helps diagnosing. You can't necessarily count on another Leaf's charger to narrow it down ... but I hope so. Or - even if it DID prove it was your Leaf, it wouldn't necessarily mean that others with similar symptoms had the same issue. I think I'll pm the other gary nevertheless, and see if I can get him over to try to replicate my buzzing PV inverter.

 

[Herm]

Another Leaf would narrow it down, but it sounds like someone miswired or left out an RFI filter somewhere... but not too hard to install one.

 

[jsnable]

I have similar behavior with my LEAF. The introduced noise is especially apparent on my computer monitor (iMac/LED) and home theater projector (believe that noise is coming from the arc lamp). I have two EVSEs on two separate circuits and the effect is the same on both, plus the panel is fairly new with good grounding so I hadn't considered the possibility that it could be a wiring issue. I just set the charge timer to 1am to avoid the issue. Still, would be nice to find a solution!

Jay

 

[bowthom]

Hello,
8V of noise, maybe that's what drives the Blink crazy for some and not for others. I've seen bad diodes cause burst oscillations that sound like that.

Don

 

[hill]

So . . . garygid just stopped by to test for the possible effect (affect?) of a different Leaf/charger on our AV EVSE. The same 240V / 60hz buzz emanated from our PV inverters ... whether his Leaf is charging, or whether our Leaf is charging. From that, I can say the RFI issue doesn't seem to be particular to any one Leaf. Now the question for me is whether Nissan (their charger) or AV (their pass-through device) or our solar manufacturer will be willing to deal with it. Hey! . . . maybe I can even get U.L. to jump into the finger pointing fray.
(sigh)
.

 

[LEAFer]

hill: thanks for that additional info. (Result is what I expected, but additional data is helpful.)

It's not the EVSE ... it's in the car. Patience. Search this thread for "weeks" (as in "couple weeks" or "couple of weeks") and re-read my posts, please. I am in contact with Nissan Engineering.