July 27 Nissan email: the Nissan LEAF: get ready to order

[evnow]

if any of you 'early recipients' are frustrated about not getting your leaf soon enough (sounds like you get them starting dec 2010), just think of us in the northeast having to wait til fall/winter 2011; a whole year away! that should make you feel better

I'm fairly sure - Leaf 2012 will have something different to make it more palatable to cold conditions. They are definitely avoiding cold places ...

 

[cinmar]

Just adjust your withholding.

This is what I am doing. Actually, already have done. Have been on exempt this whole year so far (yearly tax liability is more or less $7500). Hedged my bets and signed up for the solar system too, just in case the car was held up until after the first of the year. For me that means no tax liability at all for the next 2.5-3 years.

I'm thinking that since my order date is October, there's no way I'm getting a Leaf this year, and should probably push forward on the PV panels on my garage sooner rather than later for tax purposes.

 

[adric22]

I got "October" in my email. I'm located in Fort Worth, TX.

Again, I am repeating what others have said here. I'm not that interested in the order date as I am the delivery date. And they haven't been too clear on that so far.

I'd really like to know a little better because I can wait 6 months for my Leaf. But if it is going to be a year or more before I can take delivery of it, I think I'd rather go ahead and buy a 2010 Prius and put an EV kit in it.

 

[Pipemajor]

Re: Taxes
If you cannot get the car until early 2011, don't despair, simply adjust your withholding on your W-4.
)

It will be late 2011 for most of us.

I'm already claiming Married and 10 exemptions... I installed a geothermal system in the house Jan '09. I got a 30% tax credit for that which proved to be worth more than the total taxes withheld so will carry over another $3000 into 2010. Now if I could only find a way to get a state tax credit...

 

[TimeHorse]

but I'm A) kinda lazy and changing my withholding to get it right, and then changing it back just reeks of effort B) I like lump sums...a couple hundred a month, even a few hundred a month, well I would just spend it or give it to the kids or...but getting a big check of 7500, well I would know, hey, pay off the car some, or the solar some or something big...

Fair enough; personally, getting all the domestic pay stubs is like pulling teeth in this house but I may do it anyway since I'm not likely to get it until April (well, by Nissan's old estimate) and I'd just assume making bigger monthly payments for the rest of that calendar year rather than a big lump sum. Either I get the interest or I reduce the interest on my loan by paying extra down; either way, the Gov't doesn't earn income on my money.

I also did solar this year, getting about 8 grand back...but my tax is a bit higher, so i could do the car and solar in the same year and get back a nice 15k...

Ah, would that I could get my HOA to approve Photovoltaic! >sigh<

 

[mwalsh]

Ah, would that I could get my HOA to approve Photovoltaic! >sigh<

No "Solar Rights Act" where you are?

 

[Ready2plugin]

I'm in the San Francisco east bay area (Pleasanton), got an August order date. Reserved on 4/20 right after receiving the email. Keeping fingers crossed for the $5k rebate.

 

[leafygreen]

regarding the $5k California rebate--if you're curious if there's any money left in the pot, here's a nice pie chart to chew on:
http://energycenter.org/index.php/incentive-programs/clean-vehicle-rebate-project/cvrp-program-status
Currently at $3.5M and dropping...

 

[efusco]

By winter of 2011, it's too close to the release of the Tesla Model S, which I would prefer, why settle for a Leaf when the model S will be out very close to that time frame anyway. Nope, no Leaf for me, and many in the other 38 states will probably feel the same way. The price difference is not all that great, but the EV range will be much better on the model S.

I hope you have your model S details right.

I doubt S will be delivered in 2011. 18 months is too short a time to build a new plant (as Tesla themselfs said in an interview). 160 miles for $49K (after rebate) is 60% more miles for 100% more money.

Model S is supposed to be delivered in early 2012, like I said, close to Leaf availability here (10-12/2011).

I'm more likely to just get the "Plug in Conversions" 12.5 kWh lithium-ion 2010 Prius conversion, 40 miles of highway EV driving (same as the Chevy Volt), for about $13,500, actual price not released yet. Since I already own the 2010 Prius, this is almost a no brainer, I can probably get it very soon, it's less than a Leaf (or selling/trading in the 2010 Prius and then buying a Leaf), almost 1/2 the range, and more efficient than the Chevy Volt.. Might just do it, and wait for "Leaf 2" when the price and range will be much greater, 2014/2015 is fine with me, let the pioneers take the arrows . The other option of course is to just keep driving the 2010 Prius as is, and getting 45-50mpg

http://green.autoblog.com/2010/07/26/piccs-latest-converted-plug-in-prius-boasts-40-mile-electric-ra/

What reservation number are you Mitch? Unless you've put down your $40k for a Signature or are a very early R number (I'm R77) I really doubt you're gonna see a Model S in your driveway before late 2012...and that's if everything goes perfectly with the new plant, testing, building, certification, etc. I'm holding onto my Leaf reservation, may get the Leaf and then pass it down to my wife for her commuter once my S comes...depends on finances and word from Tesla on production date as we get closer.

 

[mxp]

Re: Taxes

If you cannot get the car until early 2011, don't despair, simply adjust your withholding on your W-4. Say you get the car in April (like I'm likely to do), we'll call this week 15 of the year. Now, if you're paid biweekly, you have had 7 paychecks since the year started and 1 more before the change in the W4 takes effect. This leaves 18 paychecks you've yet to receive. So, take your $7500 rebate, divide by the number of cycles and you get about $417. This is the ideal point you want to get back each paycheck. Calculating the number of deductions you need to achieve a reduction of withholding is complicated, though, and if you have your most recent paycheck you can use the IRS website to figure this out for you. Simply enter $7500 under "other credits" on the second page of the form. That should give you a very good estimate of making next year's taxes $0 and having the money now instead of later. Of course, if you're felling really bold, you could adjust your next few paychecks to take 99 deductions and then set them back to normal once you've recouped your $7500.

It's a pain to get all the information the IRS needs (especially estimating things like medical expenses and mortgage interest), but it's certainly a reasonable and lawful way of getting your credit in a timely fashion.

W-4: http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/fw4.pdf (for 2010)
IRS Help Site: http://www.irs.gov/individuals/page/0,,id=14806,00.html

Hi TimeHorse, Thanks for your great detailed response with the examples. I like examples!
Regarding the $5k California state tax credit (it's not a tax rebate) what I understand is that there is a pot of money and whoever claims it first gets it until no money left in the pot. As another reader points to this weblink there's a nice pie chart to chew on:
http://energycenter.org/index.php/incentive-programs/clean-vehicle-rebate-project/cvrp-program-status

Currently at $3.5M and dropping...

So, given it is a state tax credit (not a federal tax rebate), I am not sure if your approach described will work?

Thanks in advance.

 

[LEAFfan]

[/quote]Hi TimeHorse, Thanks for your great detailed response with the examples. I like examples!
Regarding the $5k California state tax credit (it's not a tax rebate) what I understand is that there is a pot of money and whoever claims it first gets it until no money left in the pot. As another reader points to this weblink there's a nice pie chart to chew on:
http://energycenter.org/index.php/incentive-programs/clean-vehicle-rebate-project/cvrp-program-status

Currently at $3.5M and dropping...

So, given it is a state tax credit (not a federal tax rebate), I am not sure if your approach described will work?

Thanks in advance.[/quote]

You have those monies reversed: the $5K CA money is a REBATE, and the $7500 is a tax CREDIT.

 

[evnow]

Regarding the $5k California state tax credit (it's not a tax rebate) ....

No, it is a rebate. Not a credit.

 

[EVDRIVER]

Regarding the $5k California state tax credit (it's not a tax rebate) ....

No, it is a rebate. Not a credit.

A retractable one I believe,,,

 

[johnr]

Regarding the $5k California state tax credit (it's not a tax rebate) ....

No, it is a rebate. Not a credit.

Actually, as I read it, it's neither a tax rebate nor a tax credit. It's a *rebate* rebate :lol: - the state will cut you a check.

 

[garygid]

Yes, I believe it works like this:

You apply for the Rebate money (nothing to do with taxes), and (if there are still funds available) the funds are "held" (up to about 10 days), giving you time to get your Purchase and CA DMV Registration (copies) paperwork to them.

If all the paperwork is in order, you get a check.

 

[mitch672]

What reservation number are you Mitch? Unless you've put down your $40k for a Signature or are a very early R number (I'm R77) I really doubt you're gonna see a Model S in your driveway before late 2012...and that's if everything goes perfectly with the new plant, testing, building, certification, etc. I'm holding onto my Leaf reservation, may get the Leaf and then pass it down to my wife for her commuter once my S comes...depends on finances and word from Tesla on production date as we get closer.

Don't have a reservation, Evan. I'm pretty much "done" financing multimillion dollar corporations.
Somehow, I just don't believe customers will be "beating down" Tesla's door for the Model S. when they are in their showrooms, I believe I will be able to walk in, take a test drive, plunk down my money and drive off wth the car. There will be a lot of EV choices by then, I don't feel a need to give them any deposit money. Perhaps with Toyota's backing and support, they will ramp up production much faster than previously possible, plus with all of that IPO money, they should be able to get going very soon (of course probably most of that IPO money went back to the "angel" investors already)

at any rate, my 2010 Model V prius is just fine, or like I said, get the 12.5KwH Lithium pack for 40 miles of highway EV range with a converted 2010 Prius... I'm just not feeling the Leaf "love" with a "Fall/Winter 2011" order/delivery timeframe. In other words, if I can't have my new toy soon, I really can just live without it. period.

BTW, keep up the great work on "What Drives Us", and here is an idea for a story for an upcomming week: disalusioned Leaf reservation holders in the "other" 36 states

 

[scottwilcox]

I see rental fleets will get the LEAF before the early hand raisers in non-rollout states. They are saying that Enterprise will start getting the LEAF in January of 2011. Meanwhile I got the "you can order in Fall/Winter of 2011 almost a year after the car is in the rental fleets.

Hopefully the 2012 model that the 36 non rollout states will be getting will have some nice improvements.

 

[worldlyone]

Mid-May reserve and January 2011 order date. Location: Seattle, eastside

Anyone have any idea the duration between ordering month and actually getting the car?? Didn't see it posted up-thread, so if anyone has some info. on this, I'd appreciate it.

 

[garygid]

Late Aug to Dec 4 mentioned one place, so ...
looks like about 3 months to start.

 

[TimeHorse]

Mid-May reserve and January 2011 order date. Location: Seattle, eastside

Anyone have any idea the duration between ordering month and actually getting the car?? Didn't see it posted up-thread, so if anyone has some info. on this, I'd appreciate it.

Nissan's LEAF site used to have an estimated delivery in their table posted earlier, but this has been removed and only the estimated order dates are being listed now. Mine originally said April, which I assume is late April so I am calling my LEAF newly Gestated.

That said, I think they took it down because they're now rethinking that delivery schedule as, dare I say with 36 states already excluded!, too ambitious! :roll: