Sell the Leaf for a Model 3 or not?

[doberman]

Should I sell my paid off Leaf (with a brand new battery) and get a Model 3 (I have my reservation) or keep my Leaf?

There is a part of me that says to keep the Leaf because it's paid off & I got the battery replaced this year (warranty)...

But, the other part says....Model 3...

Money isn't the issue (I'm not rich, but I'd be in the market for a car). I think if I kept the Leaf, I would buy a pickup truck to have as another vehicle.

Thought you all might have some good insights or perspectives!

 

[jjeff]

Note unless you already have a reservation for a model 3, and a low number, I wouldn't expect to see a model 3 for sale to the general public(not reserved) for years and years, maybe 5???
People keep talking about the model 3 like it's here now or will be in the very near future, it's not and for anyone who's followed Tesla knows they are chronically late, like years! Aren't they talking a couple years before anyone gets the model 3? Then figure how many cars they plan on making/year divided into how many tens of thousands of people already have a reservation......well you get my drift.
If I were you I'd simply drive the Leaf until something else comes along you like better(model 3, Bolt, etc.) my guess is by that time the Leaf may very well be approaching it's useful life, at least not worth much more than several thousand dollars. The Leaf is here now, I'd drive and enjoy it as much as you can, at least thats my opinion, I don't have a crystal ball or inside information but have been following EVs for quite a few years

 

[Jedlacks]

Sell your Leaf and buy a Model S. By the time the Model 3 becomes available it would be no better than any other EV on the market at that time. :lol: :lol:

 

[LKK]

Well there's always the option of holding on to your Leaf for awhile and wait for the Gen 2 Leaf. I'm willing to bet the next Leaf will be in the showrooms well before you will be able to buy a Model 3, and I'm also willing to bet the next Leaf will be way cheaper than the typical Model 3 as well.

 

[Turnover]

I thought I would step in here for a second. We repeatedly hear that TESLA doesn't meet production dates. Lets put this in context. Boeing often doesn't meet production dates either. Still, they make some of the damn best cutting edge planes in the world.

 

[garsh]

The biggest problem with selling the Leaf is that it just isn't holding its value on the used car market. But it's a very reliable vehicle, and in your case, it has a new battery. You mentioned getting a truck as a second vehicle. Have you considered keeping the Leaf and getting a Model 3 as well?

Another tactic would be to push off the Model 3 as long as possible. Generally, Tesla lets you "hold off" on a reservation for a while. You could get some more use out of your leaf before trading up.

 

[RonDawg]

Sell your Leaf and buy a Model S. By the time the Model 3 becomes available it would be no better than any other EV on the market at that time. :lol: :lol:

Or sell it and get a Bolt. At least you're more likely to see a Bolt in your own driveway before 2020.

 

[doberman]

The biggest problem with selling the Leaf is that it just isn't holding its value on the used car market. But it's a very reliable vehicle, and in your case, it has a new battery. You mentioned getting a truck as a second vehicle. Have you considered keeping the Leaf and getting a Model 3 as well?

- I like the logic here, its sort of where my mind is at - the Leaf is reliable A/F...plus, the new battery. Maybe it makes more sense to Keep it.
- Leaf isnt really worth much, although, whatever value would go towards the Model 3.
- If I go with the Model 3, I think I won't have much need for 2 electric vehicles...so, I would definitely get rid of the Leaf if I get the Model 3.
- My feeling on the truck is more practical, tow stuff, haul stuff, easier to for outdoor activities - but, I'd have to buy gas...for a truck.

 

[redLEAF]

I was actually in somewhat the same dilemma but with a bit different scenario; my '12 LEAF is down just 1 battery capacity 'bar' but will come up to the 5 year mark this month so no chance for a battery replacement under the capacity warranty (I'm also in the Midwest); my work commute increased so on even moderately cold days, my GOM range (even at 100% charge) shows about 13-14 miles left after a 42 mile R/T; can't imagine when it gets colder or we have a bit of snow, etc. --- just not much in 'reserve'; I'm sure charging at 100% will make this worse but have no choice. My old work commute was 30 miles R/T so in that case, I would probably have kept the LEAF and be able to wait out the arrival of the Tesla Model 3 (reserved 3/31/16) if we start seeing them getting delivered about this time next year or even early 2018. If it ends up being say closer to 2 years from now I'm not sure even that low a commute would have been viable but hard to predict how/when the battery continues to lose range; at my longer commute no way will it make it.

If I had your '11 with a new battery, I would probably just wait it out -- for you it depends on how much you need to drive it daily; my LEAF has 45K miles on it and its just been this winter season with the longer commute that's forced me to do something sooner than later.

I think that LEAF values on the first gen cars (MY '11/'12) are probably close to bottoming out (the curious thing is that having a new battery only matters perhaps to private sales?? and NOT wholesalers) so my LEAF has a $5K value currently on a trade-in as I would think your '11 is close to that as well -- from $38K down to $5K in 5 years ??? (even the car I traded in for the LEAF originally (a 5 year old Mazda 3 G/T; cost $22K and got $9K for it, it had just under 60K miles) didn't depreciate this much -- of course my eventual out-of-pocket after the Fed Tax Credit, an IL EPA rebate and the trade was about only $17K so with the gas savings added to it, its not as bleak as it might sound -- everyone's scenario can be different.

In my case, I'm trading my LEAF in on a 'stop gap' EV and am taking advantage of the rapid EV depreciation so not going brand new -- you'll see a new post later on the thread for VW e-Golf's; hope to get it in under 3 weeks!

 

[abasile]

If your LEAF is serving you well and you could use a truck, you could wait several years and buy a Tesla truck! I'm not totally serious, though, because it makes no financial sense to buy a new truck for utility purposes. If you just need to haul stuff from time to time, getting an old beater truck is usually a smarter approach.

Another option could be to buy an older, used Model S for about $40K - $50K, ideally from Tesla Motors. Call one of the larger Tesla stores and ask a sales representative to list a few of their best-priced used vehicles, which may not be listed on the Tesla website.

While it's not officially sanctioned by Tesla, you can install a trailer hitch made by a reputable company, and use a small trailer for your hauling needs. See http://torkliftcentral.com/2012-2016-tesla-model-s-ecohitch-stealth

 

[powersurge]

I am sorry, but I have to be the old man father in this conversation... This young man apparently bought a used Leaf in 2013, and was able to rustle a new battery out of his deal... He won the battery lottery, and in 3 years of ownership, he got tired of it...

I understand that people change cars often because they are not allowed to get divorced and marry a 25 year old supermodel every couple of years.... Yes, after the honeymoon period, many lose that "pep" they used to have with their new car and feel that the relationship is "old", and want a new car. Cars, however are not like a computer, TV, or stereo that you buy, with no out of pocket costs. I would like to say...

Are you nuts? For the price of a used Leaf, you got a new battery, and are driving a vehicle that less than 1 percent of the drivers own. You are fortunate to be one of the first in human history to own a fully electric vehicle. Now you want to dump that car because your crotch is twitching for a new Tesla toy now.

I really don't care what you do. However, it seems that many Leaf owners (or car owners) have this fantasy that they can buy any car they want and that all cars are an equally good choice. The Teslas at this point are toys for the super-rich. If you are in a position to lease luxury cars every 2 years for $500-700 per month, then fine. Have fun throwing your money around.

However, if you are regular citizen that wants to get value out of his vehicle and not get raped when repairs are needed, then do not buy a Tesla. The Leaf vs Tesla issue is like a person who wants to trade in his Honda Accord, and buy a Jaguar. Leaf repairs, and parts will hopefully reasonable over the life of the car. Tesla parts and repairs will be prohibitively expensive because there will be no aftermarket of parts, no junk yard availability, and you will only be able to buy parts new and repairs from the dealer. If you want to be a "sugar daddy" who is taken to the cleaners by your high maintenance, 25 year old Supermodel vehicle, go for it. Otherwise, keep your plain-Jane Leaf that takes you everywhere you want to go for practically nothing, and does not complain.

 

[abasile]

If you want to be a "sugar daddy" who is taken to the cleaners by your high maintenance, 25 year old Supermodel vehicle, go for it. Otherwise, keep your plain-Jane Leaf that takes you everywhere you want to go for practically nothing, and does not complain.

I hear you, but our pre-owned Model S thankfully came with a good warranty, and we can budget for potential out-of-warranty repairs a few years down the road.

While our LEAF has been very reliable in a mechanical sense, which we appreciate, the problem is that it won't take us everywhere we want to go. Routine trips that used to be easy now require charging for a couple of hours. Much of this could be solved by upgrading to a 30 kWh battery, if Nissan supported that. Given the relatively high rate of degradation, a new 24 kWh battery would only be a temporary patch, and an expensive one at that. While I admit that our choice to live in a semi-rural area means that our routine range requirements are greater, we are far from being the only ones in this boat. There are many advantages to living here, and it doesn't hurt that our area is quite affordable.

However, we were also ready for a larger vehicle for our family and we wanted to be able to take that larger vehicle on trips (day trips as well as longer road trips). The only EV that offered the functionality we were seeking, at a price we were prepared to pay, was a used Model S. Given the climate challenge that our world faces, and our desire to be better stewards of this very special planet for the benefit of younger generations, I personally feel compelled to support the growth of the nascent shift to EVs.

At the same time, I agree that everyone should carefully consider what's important to them, and avoid impulsive purchasing behavior. Cars by themselves can bring some temporary happiness, but not long term contentment. Taking on a car payment could mean the difference between being able to save for a down payment on a house or not, or perhaps having an adequate buffer for one's family or not. Whether with cars, homes, or marriage relationships, I think the following quote is quite relevant:

Now godliness with contentment is great gain. For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. And having food and clothing, with these we shall be content. - 1 Timothy 6: 6-8

 

[powersurge]

Hello Abasile,

I see you have a Leaf and a Tesla. You are very fortunate to having had a taste of luxury twice... I wish you well with both cars. I kind of see a Tesla as a car you lease, but don't own, just like a BMW, Mercedes, or Jaguar. When it is time to replace even common parts like suspension, brake calipers, electronics, or body/ accessories, I fear that repairs will be sky high because so few of these cars were made, and the Tesla company has had all of their parts custom built by who knows who. Good luck with your cars...

 

[finman100]

"Custom built by who knows who"?

Where does this stuff come from?

Please provide some info on this statement.

You do know Tesla has been around 10 years?

You do know the Model 3 is being built for mass market?

So, really, the answer, to the above question is...Tesla.

For any serious long-range-replace-your-ICE-type EV, the Model 3 will be IT. The Leaf will never cross the country. I love mine for what it is, but my next EV HAS to do more. So...Tesla Model 3. And all it's custom parts, apparently.

 

[garsh]

The Leaf vs Tesla issue is like a person who wants to trade in his Honda Accord, and buy a Jaguar.
...
When it is time to replace even common parts like suspension, brake calipers, electronics, or body/ accessories, I fear that repairs will be sky high because so few of these cars were made...

You're describing the Model S.

The Model 3 will be a mass-market, lower-cost vehicle. It is projected to sell in numbers much higher than the Leaf has ever sold. The base model will cost $35,000. I paid $36,050 for my base model Leaf SV back in 2012.

 

[abasile]

I see you have a Leaf and a Tesla. You are very fortunate to having had a taste of luxury twice... I wish you well with both cars. I kind of see a Tesla as a car you lease, but don't own, just like a BMW, Mercedes, or Jaguar. When it is time to replace even common parts like suspension, brake calipers, electronics, or body/ accessories, I fear that repairs will be sky high because so few of these cars were made, and the Tesla company has had all of their parts custom built by who knows who. Good luck with your cars...

Thanks. Yes, it is true that being able to drive an EV, any EV, is a luxury. Hopefully more will come to appreciate the benefits.

With the Tesla Model S, it sure is nice being able to drive the whole family around in the comfort of a full sized "sedan" that seats seven (5 adults + 2 children), at full speed on the highway, with ample driving range. We are counting our blessings!

While Tesla's production quality seems to be continuing to improve, and the Model 3 is supposed to have a simpler design and be easier to produce, leasing is indeed available for those who want to go this route as a sort of "insurance policy". Of course, leasing does in the long run generally add to the cost of "owning" vehicles. But for many who really appreciate Tesla vehicles, this cost might be worth paying. There is value in responsibly acquiring some nice things that improve one's day-to-day quality of life, in the here and now.

On the other hand, for those who want an EV at minimal cost, keeping their current car for long drives while adding a cheap, used LEAF may be attractive. In the new car arena, the Prius Prime seems sensible, as it will enable many people to drive all electric on a day-to-day basis while obtaining the best possible fuel mileage on long trips. So there are some good options.

Still, Tesla is really the only option for those who prefer to go all electric, all the time.

 

[lorenfb]

While our LEAF has been very reliable in a mechanical sense, which we appreciate, the problem is that it won't take us everywhere we want to go. Routine trips that used to be easy now require charging for a couple of hours. Much of this could be solved by upgrading to a 30 kWh battery, if Nissan supported that.

Nissan does provide that option on a special purchase option thru each dealer's service department.
It can be easily adapted to older Leafs with two additional mounting brackets.

 

[abasile]

While our LEAF has been very reliable in a mechanical sense, which we appreciate, the problem is that it won't take us everywhere we want to go. Routine trips that used to be easy now require charging for a couple of hours. Much of this could be solved by upgrading to a 30 kWh battery, if Nissan supported that.

Nissan does provide that option on a special purchase option thru each dealer's service department.
It can be easily adapted to older Leafs with two additional mounting brackets.

Now that's interesting! Has that been discussed on another thread here? Has anyone actually paid for a 30 kWh battery in an older LEAF?

What could interest me, in particular, would be obtaining a salvaged or reconditioned 30 kWh battery. This would ideally be certified through Nissan and installed by a Nissan dealer. There needs to be a way to get the price down so that older, depreciated LEAFs can be kept on the road. I'm in no hurry, though, and I expect we'll be keeping our 2011 LEAF (with its original battery) for years to come. It's great for local use.

 

[lorenfb]

While our LEAF has been very reliable in a mechanical sense, which we appreciate, the problem is that it won't take us everywhere we want to go. Routine trips that used to be easy now require charging for a couple of hours. Much of this could be solved by upgrading to a 30 kWh battery, if Nissan supported that.

Nissan does provide that option on a special purchase option thru each dealer's service department.
It can be easily adapted to older Leafs with two additional mounting brackets.

Now that's interesting! Has that been discussed on another thread here? Has anyone actually paid for a 30 kWh battery in an older LEAF?

What could interest me, in particular, would be obtaining a salvaged or reconditioned 30 kWh battery. This would ideally be certified through Nissan and installed by a Nissan dealer.

A Nissan dealer would never install a used part, much less a Leaf main battery from a junk yard or for that
matter, anyone other than from Nissan Parts.

 

[Stoaty]

While our LEAF has been very reliable in a mechanical sense, which we appreciate, the problem is that it won't take us everywhere we want to go. Routine trips that used to be easy now require charging for a couple of hours. Much of this could be solved by upgrading to a 30 kWh battery, if Nissan supported that.

Nissan does provide that option on a special purchase option thru each dealer's service department.
It can be easily adapted to older Leafs with two additional mounting brackets.

I don't believe this. Source?