Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

[JupiterLEAF]

I'm not convinced the averaging is based on time. Rather I suspect it is based upon the number of charge-discharge cycles. If that is true, then the only way to get the bars to drop sooner is to drive the car.

I don't think that hypothesis holds out either. 90240 charged and discharged his car A LOT! Like way more than the average bear. Though I realize that's only one data point, and he could easily be an outlier.

To offer another data point for consideration, I reached a loss of 4 bars at only 31,250 miles after over 2 years of constant (5 days/week) fully discharging and fully recharging the battery. Daily usage usually involved 28 miles/day at 70+ MPH and 24 miles/day at 30-50 MPH, all with the AC on ordinarily, with 0-1 bar showing when plugged in at night. The third year of use involved far, far less daily usage. Throughout the entire time, however, when the car was parked overnight after recharging and on weekends or holidays, it seldom sat with less than 100% charge on the battery.

Wouldn't such constant deep cycling of the battery over a long period of time have to have some impact on the averaging?

 

[desiv]

Wouldn't such constant deep cycling of the battery over a long period of time have to have some impact on the averaging?

Probably, but how much in comparison to the other variables (location, leaving the car fully charged, was the full charge happening during the heat, etc..).
I think Steve in WA also deep cycled a lot based on his commute (120+ miles per day) and that is probably deep charging twice a day, however his car seemed to go quite a while before it lost bars.
Making one wonder if the cycling is significantly less of an issue than the location or other factors.

Hard to tell with so few data points tho..

desiv

 

[BudRaymond]

So does anyone know if the 30kW pack will work in a 2011 SL?

 

[dgpcolorado]

So does anyone know if the 30kW pack will work in a 2011 SL?

No. The question is a subject of much speculation here. I'd be pretty surprised if the new battery pack was compatible with the older LEAFs but nobody (outside of Nissan) knows for sure.

 

[Stanton]

So does anyone know if the 30kW pack will work in a 2011 SL?

No. The question is a subject of much speculation here. I'd be pretty surprised if the new battery pack was compatible with the older LEAFs but nobody (outside of Nissan) knows for sure.

I'd be surprised if it wasn't...assuming there are still 48 modules (they standardized on an EV platform for a reason). The problem is even if it IS compatible, they still many not do it. I know I will be asking when my number comes up this Fall.

 

[TomT]

It is interesting that I am seeing a consistent SOC on Leaf Spy Pro of about 92% after a full 100% charge. It makes me think that the BSM is reserving more of the new Lizard battery's top end capacity...

 

[nerys]

Having a battery that could physically fit but that nissan chose to not permit to fit would probably be enough of a slight to get me to change brands. I hope they do not do that.

If it can not fit physically i would be more understanding.

 

[fotajoye]

We all wonder if Nissan will support their older Leafs by providing a path for upgraded batteries. So far they have with an adapter to the so called Lizard battery. Only they know if they will continue this policy. Frankly, if I managed Nissan, I would make that policy SOP if at all possible. The number one reason and money saver is this policy would remove the need to manufacture, and to maintain an inventory of obsolete battery assembles.

 

[ydnas7]

Having a battery that could physically fit but that nissan chose to not permit to fit would probably be enough of a slight to get me to change brands. I hope they do not do that.

If it can not fit physically i would be more understanding.

If the 30kWh is increased due to higher amps, then agree
If the 30kWh is increased due to higher voltage, then its understandable (ie safety, design longevity etc)
I would strongly assume that the 30kWh is in the same outer box as the 24 kWh.

 

[dhanson865]

uggh, just realized this thread had tons of 4 bar losers that didn't make the wiki. Spent an hour or so reding 50 pages of posts and editing the wiki. Still not done but have added or edited:

#24 June 21, 2014 Pipcecil AKA Nathan Drozd
#23 Feb 2015 JupiterLEAF
#22 Jan 6, 2015 leafer77
#21 December 2014 evblues
#20 August 2014 JPVLeaf

still need to do some backfill of 3 bar and 2 bar losses for some of those 4 bar losers above.

I still can't believe they shafted leafer77 like that, I was hoping he would get someone higher up at Nissan to overturn the lower/mid level decision to deny his claim outright.

At the least I would expect them to sell him a 2015 style pack at half cost (like $3000), even better a free 2015 style pack, and best they would buy his car back at lease residual style calcs (slightly above current used car values) and let him decide what to apply that money on (another used Leaf, a Kia Soul EV, a 2016 Leaf with the 30 kWh battery, a Tesla?)

 

[DaveEV]

It is interesting that I am seeing a consistent SOC on Leaf Spy Pro of about 92% after a full 100% charge. It makes me think that the BSM is reserving more of the new Lizard battery's top end capacity...

What's the voltage of the pack and how's the pack balance looking?

 

[TomT]

394.0 volts and 10 millivolts.

It is interesting that I am seeing a consistent SOC on Leaf Spy Pro of about 92% after a full 100% charge. It makes me think that the BSM is reserving more of the new Lizard battery's top end capacity...

What's the voltage of the pack and how's the pack balance looking?

 

[KJD]

Hi all:
I’m happy to be back to provide a long-awaited update on the Nissan LEAF battery replacement plan.

Does Brian Brockman still work at Nissan?

 

[mwalsh]

Does Brian Brockman still work at Nissan?

Nissan's list of media contacts would seem to indicate "yes".

 

[KJD]

Does Brian Brockman still work at Nissan?

Nissan's list of media contacts would seem to indicate "yes".

Someone should ask him if the new 30kWh battery will fit in the old cars(2011 and 2012).

 

[Stanton]

^ ^ ^ THIS

 

[Bazooka]

Does Brian Brockman still work at Nissan?

Nissan's list of media contacts would seem to indicate "yes".

Someone should ask him if the new 30kWh battery will fit in the old cars(2011 and 2012).

If there's a good person to ask, then by all means, ask. It's a very interesting and important question.

But I think there's a very high chance, perhaps 95%, that all we'll get is a no comment/watch this space non-answer. And I think the odds are nearly as high that the answer, once revealed in the far-off times of September 2015, will be "No". Again, all EV makers are wrestling with the fundamental shift in their business and how they perceive and position themselves in the market: Are they a car company or a battery company that happens to sell cars? Tesla has chosen the latter route, but I'm sure that Nissan, GM, et al. will resist that option as long as possible.

 

[ishiyakazuo]

If there's a good person to ask, then by all means, ask. It's a very interesting and important question.

But I think there's a very high chance, perhaps 95%, that all we'll get is a no comment/watch this space non-answer. And I think the odds are nearly as high that the answer, once revealed in the far-off times of September 2015, will be "No". Again, all EV makers are wrestling with the fundamental shift in their business and how they perceive and position themselves in the market: Are they a car company or a battery company that happens to sell cars? Tesla has chosen the latter route, but I'm sure that Nissan, GM, et al. will resist that option as long as possible.

On the other hand, Nissan has a majority share (51%) of AESC, which is a battery company, so unlike GM, et. al. and similar to Tesla's future plans, they control their own batteries, and that could impact how they operate.

 

[Bazooka]

If there's a good person to ask, then by all means, ask. It's a very interesting and important question.

But I think there's a very high chance, perhaps 95%, that all we'll get is a no comment/watch this space non-answer. And I think the odds are nearly as high that the answer, once revealed in the far-off times of September 2015, will be "No". Again, all EV makers are wrestling with the fundamental shift in their business and how they perceive and position themselves in the market: Are they a car company or a battery company that happens to sell cars? Tesla has chosen the latter route, but I'm sure that Nissan, GM, et al. will resist that option as long as possible.

On the other hand, Nissan has a majority share (51%) of AESC, which is a battery company, so unlike GM, et. al. and similar to Tesla's future plans, they control their own batteries, and that could impact how they operate.

That's no doubt true, but I still think that Nissan will continue to see batteries as a necessary evil and at best a potential source of cost/competitive advantage, and not a major business line. Maybe I'm wrong; I guess we'll all find out together based on what Nissan offers as new model standard equipment and options, batteries for old Leafs, etc.

 

[TomT]

Don't hold your breath waiting for an answer! And, personally, I doubt you will ever see such an upgrade... It makes virtually no business sense for Nissan to do so.

If there's a good person to ask, then by all means, ask. It's a very interesting and important question.