CarCharging Inc now $.49 per kWh, instead of $2.40/hr

[grommet]

As of last week, CarCharging Inc owned/operated ChargePoint (Coulomb) stations have switched to $.49 per kWh billing instead of the previous $2.40/hr ($.04/minute) in any states where it's permitted by law.

http://www.carcharging.com/ev-owners/rates/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This is especially good news for any of their locations in paid parking lots, where you were previously paying for total time connected to the EVSE on top of the site's parking fees.

 

[mynameisjim]

That's better than the fixed hourly rate for 3.3kw LEAFs, but worse for 6.6kw "others". It also could encourage blocking the spot. Is it me, or are they over charging?

 

[Stoaty]

This is great news! I see that the Pomona College parking lot in Claremont, CA is listed as one of their charging stations. I often go to Claremont to hike Mount Baldy, but didn't want to charge there due to the hourly connected fee (I am there for 5-6 hours, but had $8.00 maximum before). Now I can go there, set my Leaf for an 80% charge, and only pay for the electricity I actually use (probably around $4.00). I will leave a card on the windshield letting others know that once the blinking lights stop they can use the station (plenty of space to park next to the Leaf and use same charging dock). There are 6 charging stations there, the only time I saw anyone else there while I was charging was when abasile had his Leaf there too.

 

[Cheezmo]

So, $5.00 for 10kWh, which for typical drivers would be about 40 miles.

Using my Volt for the economic analysis.

10kWh = 40 miles = $5.00
1 gallon gas = 40 miles = $3.50

 

[Electric4Me]

That economic analysis doesn't match my usage at all. I will gladly pay that rate when I need the juice so that I can make the trip in the EV in the first place. You need to compare the total electricity you used in a trip (home + public) vs the gas you would have burned for the same trip. I gladly paid $2 for 20 min the other day to make my EV trip work out.

It's also like eating home cooked food vs dining out: you're going to pay more at commercial stations but it's good to have the choice.

 

[smkettner]

49 cents seems high but I would far prefer that method of pricing. Eventually we will get some competition.

 

[Cheezmo]

Yeah, the Volt makes for a different analysis than for a BEV in most cases.

For you the choice is make the trip totally electric or totally gas. Your average electricity price is much lower if a large portion of it is done at home.

With the Volt the decision would be when you are near the end of 40 miles, or considering opportunity charging in the middle of a day, is it more economical to charge (more $$, more time) or use a little gas. When charging is priced like that, gas wins out.

That economic analysis doesn't match my usage at all. I will gladly pay that rate when I need the juice so that I can make the trip in the EV in the first place. You need to compare the total electricity you used in a trip (home + public) vs the gas you would have burned for the same trip. I gladly paid $2 for 20 min the other day to make my EV trip work out.

It's also like eating home cooked food vs dining out: you're going to pay more at commercial stations but it's good to have the choice.

 

[TonyWilliams]

49 cents seems high but I would far prefer that method of pricing. Eventually we will get some competition.

Yep, the competition is lining up to get a piece of that action!!! I'd love to see how that pencils out in places with electric rates exceeding that number.

 

[TonyWilliams]

didn't want to charge there due to the hourly connected fee (I am there for 5-6 hours, but had $8.00 maximum before). Now I can go there, set my Leaf for an 80% charge, and only pay for the electricity I actually use (probably around $4.00).

I see that you're making some considerations for your fellow EV driver, but how long do you think somebody should block an EV spot, after the car has completed charging? 5-6 hours? 24 hours? 72 hours? Permanently?

 

[Stoaty]

I see that you're making some considerations for your fellow EV driver, but how long do you think somebody should block an EV spot, after the car has completed charging? 5-6 hours? 24 hours? 72 hours? Permanently?

Normally, not long at all. However, in this particular case there is very little usage of 6 charging docks (the maximum I have seen is 2 cars for 6 docks). If usage increases that would change the equation. In addition, each dock has two spaces (for L1 and L2 charging), which means that even if all 6 spaces were blocked and I was done charging, someone else could charge either L1 or L2. The chance of me being hit by lightning is greater than the chance that I will be blocking someone from charging at this particular charging spot at this particular time.

In the usual case, I would say someone should not block access to a spot that someone else may need for any longer than they need to charge.

 

[smkettner]

49 cents seems high but I would far prefer that method of pricing. Eventually we will get some competition.

Yep, the competition is lining up to get a piece of that action!!! I'd love to see how that pencils out in places with electric rates exceeding that number.

I thought I just read a thread where the high priced SCE had a new commercial EV rate of 4 cents no demand charge?

The fee will never pay the rent independently.... but I would be inclined to choose this venue to visit vs the competition down the street.

You will never be able to buy a parking lot, install this equipment and make money by only charging electric vehicles.

 

[derkraut]

So, $5.00 for 10kWh, which for typical drivers would be about 40 miles.

Using my Volt for the economic analysis.

10kWh = 40 miles = $5.00
1 gallon gas = 40 miles = $3.50

Good point; I can drive my Prius for less than that---and I can drive coast-to-coast without "plugging in for hrs", "range anxiety" etc.

 

[TonyWilliams]

In the usual case, I would say someone should not block access to a spot that someone else may need for any longer than they need to charge.

Ok, with that we agree. You seem to have a solid handle on the situation (and low on selfishness!).

Don't get hit by lightening

 

[TonyWilliams]

I can drive my Prius for less than that

Yes, you can.

:|

 

[EricBayArea]

I just looked on CarCharging's website for locations near me (Northern California) and they are still listed as $0.04/min with 1hr minimum - perhaps they have yet to update the website. I also saw that the locations these are placed are paid parking lots. So that means I'd have to pay for parking and then for charging. Guess that's the reality of things to come.

What I don't get is why companies like CarCharging Inc (who place Coulomb EVSEs) and 350 Green (who place Coulomb EVSEs) even exist at all. Couldn't a parking lot call up Coulomb and say, "we want 2 EVSEs in our garage, make it happen." Then only 1 person gets a cut of the fees (Coulomb) as opposed to 2 (Coulomb AND CarCharging/350). I could be missing something, but I'm pretty sure any business can call Coulomb and pay them to install and manage the EVSEs.

And as an aside, I agree with the notion that you can't simply take the $0.49/kWh as the price. You should average in your starting "tank" at your home rate. But even still, not all of us own a Prius as alternative transportation. My alternative to the LEAF is a car that gets an average 23mppg (miles-per-Premium-gallon). So it is technical cheaper to pay $0.49/kWh than buy premium gas and burn it at a rate of 23mpg. But that's just me

 

[grommet]

Remember, folks... EVSEs are often in traditional parking lots/spaces. As such, expect them to be treated more like parking spaces than "fill-up stations."

I will try to move my vehicle when done in many scenarios, but honestly... even I won't walk back a few blocks to an expensive San Francisco Parking Lot in the middle of a busy day and attempt to re-park the car to a non-EVSE space, which may not even be available. You definitely can't expect the masses to do this, and forcing them into this behavior will just hurt EV adoption.

It's all just part of the public charging bag of hurt. Good I rarely use public L2. ;-)

I just looked on CarCharging's website for locations near me (Northern California) and they are still listed as $0.04/min with 1hr minimum - perhaps they have yet to update the website. I also saw that the locations these are placed are paid parking lots. So that means I'd have to pay for parking and then for charging. Guess that's the reality of things to come.

What I don't get is why companies like CarCharging Inc (who place Coulomb EVSEs) and 350 Green (who place Coulomb EVSEs) even exist at all. Couldn't a parking lot call up Coulomb and say, "we want 2 EVSEs in our garage, make it happen." Then only 1 person gets a cut of the fees (Coulomb) as opposed to 2 (Coulomb AND CarCharging/350). I could be missing something, but I'm pretty sure any business can call Coulomb and pay them to install and manage the EVSEs.

They've changed all the ones I've encountered to per kWh (a few in San Francisco, one in San Jose)... maybe their web site is stale.

Half-baked business plan companies like CarCharging Inc. (and 350Green, which is on it's dead-bed and being acquired by CarCharging) "own & operate" the stations... as such, the host site takes less risk. (Their contracts with their host partners aren't public, so we can only guess what the financial arrangement is.)

IMHO, Adopt a Charger's L2 model makes far more sense. ;-)

 

[Stoaty]

Ok, with that we agree. You seem to have a solid handle on the situation (and low on selfishness!).

Don't get hit by lightening

That may not have been the best analogy, since I encountered a fierce lightning storm on my one week Sierra backpack last week. Fortunately, the lightning never got closer than about a mile from our tent.

 

[mkjayakumar]

I don't understand why every cost comparison has to be with Prius? As if Prius is the exact equivalent alternative for Leaf. Perhaps we should compare a motorbike ?

And also comparing Gas costs with public EV charging costs is meaningless. Someone aptly gave an analogy of eating at home and at a restaurant. A cup of coffee at home costs me no more than 25c, and at Starbucks over $2, but we don't complain. And I spend money at Starbucks maybe twice a month..

I can only pity ICE owners that they don't have an option of cheap gas fillups at home.

 

[Cheezmo]

Part of the appeal of EV driving is saving money, low $/mile. If charging an EV is more expensive than filling up a gas tank, it will never be accepted by the masses, only those with environmental motives.

For me there is little value to public L2 charging, it just isn't worth the time, if I'm near it and it is cheap sure, I may take advantage of it but if it is there and costs more than gas, I'll pass.

I may be about to have 3 L2 chargers in my garage, where it is $0.07/kWh. That is cheap, and a convenient location.

 

[mkjayakumar]

For an EV with a gas range extender, I understand L2s are not worth the trouble of time and money.

For a pure BEV though, those occasional L2/L3 costs are chump change in the overall scheme of things. It is a small price to pay to get the ability to drive the BEV to places beyond its range.