Gasoline May Rise Above $5 a Gallon

[DaveinOlyWA]

The Fungibility of gasoline provides a few simple guidelines

1) if you buy gas, you cannot boycott anyone because doing so hurts the small businessman of the station you are avoiding. it does not hurt the man he is getting the gas from

2)Oil Companies will take their profits AND bonuses first NO MATTER WHAT. if needed they will simply pass that cost on to us, the consumer.

3) Oil Companies are not socially responsible. like a child, if they make a mistake they cry a bit, apologize a lot but DO NOT PAY FOR THEIR MISTAKES...if you need clarification of this point, re read #2

4) why is gas prices higher. there are several theories and that is exactly what they are, theories. no real proof, no real logic, no real patterns. why does unemployment figures affect gas prices?? well they dont. it is only what is offered as an excuse. for clarification of corporate responsibility, see #3. i propose the increase in gas prices is us paying to fix BP's mistake and nothing more.

Many people think "Carbon Neutral" is where we need to be. that is wrong. that is your "father's Green Cred" and like his Buick, that is no longer good enough. we are waaay past Carbon Credits, etc. this last point will bring arguments. and those arguments will provide data presented as facts but no more valid than the statement i just made.

now, i will not point the wonderful weather the Eastern half of the country is enjoying nor will i point the the major Tornado Storm Cell we had that almost happened in Feb. its all been in the news so its not like we have already forgotten about it

 

[coqui]

I just paid over $4 in NY last week, but here in NC we are at $3.79 today.

 

[coqui]

3) Oil Companies are not socially responsible. like a child, if they make a mistake they cry a bit, apologize a lot but DO NOT PAY FOR THEIR MISTAKES...

So true.

Banks aren't socially responsible either. So guess which groups have the ear of the politicians?

My goodness this is a popular topic!

 

[Yodrak]

Note that 14 cents of that difference in price is due to the difference in the state tax on gasoline.

I just paid over $4 in NY last week, but here in NC we are at $3.79 today.

 

[davewill]

... Many people think "Carbon Neutral" is where we need to be. that is wrong. that is your "father's Green Cred" and like his Buick, that is no longer good enough. ...

Maybe I'm just being silly, but I thought we were talking about powering cars, and unless you've invented a new car that is powered by growing plants that are then transplanted along the road as you drive, I don't see how you are going to do better than "neutral".

 

[TNleaf]

... Many people think "Carbon Neutral" is where we need to be. that is wrong. that is your "father's Green Cred" and like his Buick, that is no longer good enough. ...

Maybe I'm just being silly, but I thought we were talking about powering cars, and unless you've invented a new car that is powered by growing plants that are then transplanted along the road as you drive, I don't see how you are going to do better than "neutral".

+1
This was pretty much my thought when I got to that part of the post.


TN had been level for a few weeks, but just started to rise again. I'm only made aware by co-workers complaining about $3.60/gal and gasbuddy.com

 

[AndyH]

... Many people think "Carbon Neutral" is where we need to be. that is wrong. that is your "father's Green Cred" and like his Buick, that is no longer good enough. ...

Maybe I'm just being silly, but I thought we were talking about powering cars, and unless you've invented a new car that is powered by growing plants that are then transplanted along the road as you drive, I don't see how you are going to do better than "neutral".

The closest to neutral I can point to today is:
- Burning a biofuel made from a crop grown using permaculture/biodynamic/sustainable methods and processed with solar electric/solar thermal heat/power
- Driving an EV powered by electricity derived from wind, PV, solar thermal, hydro, wave, etc. sources

Both are available and in use today.

The vehicles/equipment/buildings/etc. are left from our stone age practices and aren't carbon neutral, and even future vehicles/installations built from neutral sources using renewable power will still have a bit of a tail connecting it to the stone age. Seems to me we can approach zero but not really get there.

We can get a LOT closer to zero/neutral than we are today though.

Sustainable isn't where we should be aiming, however. Burning oil is like giving someone $20 and getting $4.50 back. Sustainable is giving someone $20 and getting $20 back. Nature doesn't work that way though. We plant one seed and we get hundreds in return - so $20 in and $400 back. The only reasonable target is beyond sustainable.

 

[Dino]

You don’t see the so called “Liberal Media” doing this. Just the “Fair and Balance” media.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=UzEnKdBAb_o" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
(from 2008)

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

I still cross paths with many people who think 11 mpg in a pickup truck or SUV is the norm, and driving a vehicle like that is requirement in their lives. Higher gas prices so far haven't slowed them down. Some of them just have plenty of money and you get the impression they would keep driving the Escalade without giving it a thought if gas were $10 a gallon. Others may be impacted more by the higher prices but prioritize driving the large vehicle higher than other things, so higher gas prices for them doesn't mean less driving or look for a more efficient vehicle, it means less money to spend on other things (and maybe more complaining about it).

If there is ever a supply shortage though, then watch out, interest in EVs will pick up in a hurry. Paying more is one thing, sitting in line or wondering where you'll get the next fillup is quite another matter. That may not happen though; as I recall it was price controls that led to a few isolated shortages back in 1974. As long as the price is allowed to adjust to the market, a supply shortage would produce a huge price spike, followed by demand destruction and economic slowdown, which in turn would bring back lower prices.

 

[keydiver]

That is exactly why I bought my Prius, and now my LEAF. It doesn't matter how much money you have if there is no gas to be bought. I well remember the rationing in the 70's, and it is very similar to that here in South Florida when hurricanes are heading for us. Stations run out of gas from everyone topping off or heading north, or they have no electricity to pump it after a storm. I discussed this with one potential customer at the LEAF drive event in Miami, and I mentioned how all my friend's houses near hospitals or police stations got their electricity back first. This puts opportunity charging in a completely different light, being able to "fuel up" at city hall, or any friend's house that has power, when all the gas stations are still closed.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

That is exactly why I bought my Prius, and now my LEAF. It doesn't matter how much money you have if there is no gas to be bought. I well remember the rationing in the 70's, and it is very similar to that here in South Florida when hurricanes are heading for us. Stations run out of gas from everyone topping off or heading north, or they have no electricity to pump it after a storm. I discussed this with one potential customer at the LEAF drive event in Miami, and I mentioned how all my friend's houses near hospitals or police stations got their electricity back first. This puts opportunity charging in a completely different light, being able to "fuel up" at city hall, or any friend's house that has power, when all the gas stations are still closed.

I'm not holding my breath on the Leaf being a great tool during any sort of widespread power outage after a storm, although you never know exactly what the situation will be until it happens. After the 2004 storms I could go a few miles south and find plenty of stations open, but after Wilma power was out over a much broader area. Still an ICE car with a full gas tank seems to have you better covered, but now I've got both covered.

As far as any sort of national emergency type shortage who knows what that would look like. You can let price do the rationing, but at some point you probably see some other policies kick in too. In terms of our society functioning, IMO diesel is way more important than gasoline. People can walk, even if its a couple miles, or ride bikes, or carpool to the grocery store, but it does no good if the trucks can't get fuel to bring the food to the store. The one thing I do know is if there is rationing somehow that guy in the black escalade will still have all he wants because he has the right connections. I don't, so I'll be glad to have the EV

 

[GRA]

That is exactly why I bought my Prius, and now my LEAF. It doesn't matter how much money you have if there is no gas to be bought. I well remember the rationing in the 70's, and it is very similar to that here in South Florida when hurricanes are heading for us. Stations run out of gas from everyone topping off or heading north, or they have no electricity to pump it after a storm. I discussed this with one potential customer at the LEAF drive event in Miami, and I mentioned how all my friend's houses near hospitals or police stations got their electricity back first. This puts opportunity charging in a completely different light, being able to "fuel up" at city hall, or any friend's house that has power, when all the gas stations are still closed.

My dad bought himself a '76 Peugeot 504 diesel after the '73 embargo, and during the '79 Iran hostage imbroglio I remember us driving up to the head of a very long line of cars waiting to get gas at a station around noon (the gas pumps were due to be turned on at 1 p.m. IIRR) and getting diesel immediately. Just in case he couldn't find a diesel station when he needed one (the car came with a book listing diesel stations by state and city), he'd also bought an 25-gallon auxiliary tank (15 gallon regular tank) which was installed in the trunk, taking up much of the space. He had a 1,200 mile freeway range, and could just about make our yearly Oakland-Portland-Oakland trip to visit relatives un-refueled. This was certainly taking excessive precautions, as there was always a truck stop or station selling diesel somewhere within 100 miles.

If I were looking to buy a post-disaster car I'd opt for a plug-in hybrid like the Volt, giving me two options for fuel and a reasonable evacuation range.

 

[smkettner]

The web site Energy Bulletin has many articles on oil and gas prices. Tom Whipple writes at least once or twice a week and he writes some good articles. They are worth the time to read.

http://www.energybulletin.net/stories/2012-03-15/peak-oil-crisis-surging-gasoline" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

With the EU's debt crisis and the Iranian confrontation relatively quiescent, attention has turned to the incessant increase in U.S. gasoline prices. The Capitol Hill gas station, where at least some members of Congress fill up, is currently selling regular for $4.49 a gallon. If you prefer to do business at the Watergate Exxon it will set you back $5.39 for regular. For a real taste of the future, then be sure to come in a full-sized SUV with a big V-8 and a 33 gallon gas tank - a fill-up will only be $188 for premium.

Are you saying there is a congressman that pumps their own fuel and pays the bill out of his own salary..... I have doubts.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Hold on to your plugs, $5 gasoline may not be happening any time soon.

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/breakout/look-below-major-crude-oil-crash-coming-says-170127530.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

$16.79/bbl equates to what, 79 cent gas? You aren't selling many EVs if anything close to that happens.

 

[EricBayArea]

Hold on to your plugs, $5 gasoline may not be happening any time soon.

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/breakout/look-below-major-crude-oil-crash-coming-says-170127530.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

$16.79/bbl equates to what, 79 cent gas? You aren't selling many EVs if anything close to that happens.

It won't make my LEAF any less enjoyable

However, it will make driving my turbo Subaru a bit more enjoyable

 

[Smidge204]

Hold on to your plugs, $5 gasoline may not be happening any time soon.

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/breakout/look-below-major-crude-oil-crash-coming-says-170127530.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

$16.79/bbl equates to what, 79 cent gas? You aren't selling many EVs if anything close to that happens.

Oblig:

=Smidge=

 

[EricBayArea]

:lol:

I love xkcd sometimes

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Hey, I don't make the news, I just report it :lol:

I thought the Elliot wave was E.T. saying goodbye with a glowing finger.

 

[cwerdna]

There's breaking news that there's a Chevron refinery fire in Richmond, CA right now.

Supposedly, it's not under control.

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Fire-Erupts-at-Richmond-Refinery-165212676.html

There is a level 3 shelter in place.

Residents in Richmond, North Richmond and San Pablo are advised to go inside, close all windows and doors, turn off all heaters, air conditioners and fans. If not using the fireplace, close fireplace dampers and vents, and cover cracks around the doors and windows with tape or dampended towels.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

There's breaking news that there's a Chevron refinery fire in Richmond, CA right now.

Supposedly, it's not under control.

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Fire-Erupts-at-Richmond-Refinery-165212676.html

There is a level 3 shelter in place.

Residents in Richmond, North Richmond and San Pablo are advised to go inside, close all windows and doors, turn off all heaters, air conditioners and fans. If not using the fireplace, close fireplace dampers and vents, and cover cracks around the doors and windows with tape or dampended towels.

that is gonna be trouble. when our refinery caught on fire it resulted in our paying nearly a buck a gallon higher than anywhere else in the country. remember we were at $4.20 a gallon in May!