Guide to LEAF charge timers

[rkidd]

Anyway, has anyone verified that maybe L1 charging actually supports END timers? Maybe Nissan (intentionally or unintentionally) doesn't honor an END timer when L1 charging.

I think you may on to something here. I have been using L1 charging exclusively for a little over a month now with an 80% charge, end timer for 7:45a. I have received end charge emails anywhere between a little after midnight and about 6a.

 

[vin944]

I'm on SMUD TOU Option 1. Not a bad plan actually. Just in the summer months you have to stay away from 2PM to 8PM usage. So how do we program the Leaf for that (not) window?

A little tricky but working.

Sun - Thurs 8PM to 2PM
Fri, Sat 8PM to 8PM

Hope this helps.

 

[zowland]

Summarizing zowland issues:
Issue #1 -- On L1 charging starts immediately when only End time is set, and may conclude hours before End time.
Issue #2 -- Carwings does not send a Start Charging notification when timer starts charging.

lpickup: "Anyway, has anyone verified that maybe L1 charging actually supports END timers? Maybe Nissan (intentionally or unintentionally) doesn't honor an END timer when L1 charging."
rkidd: "I think you may on to something here. I have been using L1 charging exclusively for a little over a month now with an 80% charge, end timer for 7:45a. I have received end charge emails anywhere between a little after midnight and about 6a."

planet4ever: "Join the crowd. So far as I know, no one has ever gotten an email or text notification of when charging starts. We assume this is a bug in their software/firmware somewhere."

Thanks everyone for your reponses. I'm expecting my L2 setup to arrive in the mail this week. It will be interesting to see if I no longer see an immediate charge start when I plug in at L2. Perhaps my cold battery temps are making it difficult for the timer to calculate the proper start time. Guess I might have to get a TED or HOBO to get a more accurate look at the real start and end times since we can't get a start notification by e-mail. My original goal was to try to at least start the day with a warm battery, but in looking at other threads, it doesn't look like even L2 charging is fast enough to raise the battery temp much. Fortunately this bug isn't costing me money at the power meter since I don't have teired service.

B>

 

[planet4ever]

My timer is set for 80%, and I get "Charging Stopped" emails a full two hours or more before the indicated stop time (with no start time set)

The car does finish early when using an end time but not that much. I am stumped as to why your charge would start immediately.

I'm not sure why I understand why there are two different camps here. I've seen posts from people like 91040 who indicate that end timer charging stops within 15-30 minutes of the end time, and then people like myself and Ray that find that it's stopping 2+ hours before end timer.

It would be nice to see confirmation or refutation of my wild-eyed theory. Are 80% folks seeing very early ending, and 100% folks seeing ending about on time?

Ray

 

[Deleted member 3147]

It would be nice to see confirmation or refutation of my wild-eyed theory. Are 80% folks seeing very early ending, and 100% folks seeing ending about on time?

Ray

I charge at both 80% and 100% and I see about the same amount of early ending with both. If I'm down to 1 or 0 bars, it will typically finish charging at slightly more than an hour early. If I've used less it ends less early. I've never seen charging finish 2 hours early.

Others have theorized that the charge time calculation is based on Japan's 100/200V electrical system and it does not correct for the faster charging on the US 120/240V. This seems very possible to me.

 

[lpickup]

It would be nice to see confirmation or refutation of my wild-eyed theory. Are 80% folks seeing very early ending, and 100% folks seeing ending about on time?

Ray

I charge at both 80% and 100% and I see about the same amount of early ending with both. If I'm down to 1 or 0 bars, it will typically finish charging at slightly more than an hour early. If I've used less it ends less early. I've never seen charging finish 2 hours early.

Others have theorized that the charge time calculation is based on Japan's 100/200V electrical system and it does not correct for the faster charging on the US 120/240V. This seems very possible to me.

So why are some people (assuming they are US based) seeing end times that are close to their programmed end times?

I'm seeing early end times for both 80% and 100% charges.

It's actually very consistent (80% charges are more consistent than 100%), just very early!

Here are some recent end times (more recent listed first):

80% (should be 6:30am): 3:50 3:57 3:54 3:27 4:03 3:33 3:26 3:32 3:25 3:36 3:43 3:43 3:52 3:45
100% (should be 7:30am): 5:45 4:30 5:24 5:33 5:53 5:33 5:44 4:30 5:44 5:37 5:14 5:22 5:37

 

[91040]

My focus is why the car would start charging immediately.

With my portable EVSE using 120V, the timer set to 80% (or 100%) and no start time:
1. End time more than 1.5 hours beyond the predicted time to charge on the dash- Did not charge.
2. End time less than 1/2 hour more than the predicted time to charge on the dash- Began to charge immediately.

Problems I or others have encountered:
1. Timer not set. The Nav screen should show both that Timer 1 (or 2) is "ON" and the light in the square for that Timer should be lit.
2. Timer settings need to be saved by touching "Yes" and then wait for confirmation.
3. Turning on or changing the Timer settings after plugging-in will not take effect until the next plug-in.
4. Timer off button pushed.

On plug-in with delayed charging:
1. The car makes noises at first.
2. The 3 blue lights on the dashboard flash in sequence (for 15 minutes?).
3. The amber charge light on the portable EVSE does not light.

If the car still charges immediately when connected, either there is another factor I am unaware of or there is a problem with the software. Please correct or add information to this to make the issue clear.

 

[zowland]

My focus is why the car would start charging immediately.....

....If the car still charges immediately when connected, either there is another factor I am unaware of or there is a problem with the software. Please correct or add information to this to make the issue clear.

The mystery deepens a bit. I now have two instances where the Leafster didn't start charging immediately (with no changes to the timer settings etc).

(1) Yesterday I took a short trip to the store shortly after noon and plugged back in ("50 minutes needed at 120V"). No immediate charge started, and the dash lights sequenced 1 2 3, 1 2 3 to indicate waiting to start charging. Received e-mail this AM: Charging stopped at 6:13am (with the end timer set to 7am). Yeah!

(2) This AM I again drove a short distance (2:30 needed to 80%). Plugged in before noon; normal 123 123 light sequence, and no immediate charge!

Not willing to leave well enough alone, I later went back out to the garage (4pm here). Checked my Kill-A-Watt---total kWh same as when I first plugged in. I unplugged the LV1, turned on systems and still need 2:30. Turned off systems. Display: "Charging timer on; climate timer off", but this time no 123 123 (with no lights lit). Plugged in the LV1 and now light 1 is steady and light 2 is blinking. Charge light on LV1 EVSE is now on.

Just went back out to the garage again (4:20pm). Now lights 1 & 2 steady, light 3 blinking; EVSE charge light still on and Kill-A-Watt up one cumulative kWh.

(During active charging, the dash lights sequence and display your SOC (divided by thirds), such that with less than 33%, only light 1 blinks. If SOC is GT 1/3 and LT 2/3, light 1 is steady and light 2 blinks. If SOC is greater than 2/3, lights 1 and 2 are steady and #3 blinks.)

These are the first two times I've plugged in with really long times (18 hrs) before the end time of 7am. Normally, I'm plugging in with less than 12 hours to end time. Perhaps there is a different algorithm with less than 18 hours to end time? (Note that my unplugging and re-plugging experiment was made approx 15 hours before end time, but for some reason now the software appears to have calculated that it is close enough to the end time such that charging should start immediately.)

B>

 

[91040]

If your charge stops at 80%, the timer is set and working.

The question is why is the timer starting excessively early? My car works differently than what is being reported. I have no idea what might be going on. Hope someone has a deeper insight into this.

 

[essaunders]

It may be relevant here: while my 80% end only timer works, my climate timer seemed to be leaving me cold every morning. It turns out that the time zone was set for pacific - not eastern. Not sure exactly what was happening but we will see tomorrow if I have a warm commute.

 

[tbleakne]

This Guide has very helpful information, but my usage is a little different. See my own "Scenario 90%" at end.

I am on TOU (Midnight to 6 AM), so when charging at home, I normally use Scenario 2 with a start time of 2:00 AM and 80%. I go to bed long before the window opens, so Scenario 2 works better for me than Scenario 1. It does not seem risky to me at all under my conditions. I am fairly sure there is no one else anywhere near me charging their Leaf at 2 AM. Some folks suspect having no specific end time helps the car do battery cell equalization, but I am not sure anyone outside Nissan Japan really knows.

When charging away, I plan to try Scenario 5 with 80% rather than Scenario 4 for the reasons stated. Thanks.

Scenario 1: Timer Start = 12:00 AM; End = 8:00 AM

Scenario 2: Timer Start = 12:00 AM; End = <None>
Will NOT start charging immediately as the Start time has already been missed. Charging will start the next day at 12:00 AM. With this timer, charging will start ONLY IF the car is plugged in at the start time.

Recommended: Never. Relevant for TOU users but frankly seems like too dangerous a timer to use. See scenario #1 or #3 instead.

Scenario 3: Timer Start = <None>; End = 8:00 AM
May or may not start charging immediately but will charge the car today until 8 AM.
>>>>
Recommended: Users with TOU rates who can set the end time to the end of super off-peak rate. Has the added benefit of automatically staggering start times in a neighborhood with many LEAFs so not everyone is loading the transformer at 12 AM.

Good to know: When parking the car at a charging station for a few days (like at an airport), change your timer to scenario #4 or #5 (rather than using the Immediate Charge button in the car). First, this ensures that your car will begin charging immediately. Second, if someone unplugs you during a charge, charging will resume when they plug you back in again.

Scenario 4: No timer
Car will start charging immediately to 100%.

>>> Those who want 80%, see scenario #5.

Scenario 5: Timer start = 12:00 AM; End = 12:00 AM
Will start charging immediately. Same as scenario #1 except the window is the entire 24 hour day. So, no matter when you plug in, you're always within the window.
>>>
Recommended: Users >> who want to charge the battery to 80%.

I have my own new scenario for charging to 90%, which I find is sufficient for many days and I suspect significantly easier on the battery than 100%. Suppose my trip begins Saturday morning. I used to try to compute the exact time necessary to reach 90%, but with the onset of cold weather I find the rate of charge too unpredictable.

Scenario 90%: Friday, Timer 1 start = 11:50 PM, End = <none>, 80%.
Saturday, Timer 2 start = 5:00 AM, End = 5:30 AM, 100%.

These settings allow me to use two timers in one evening. The time 1 charge completes at 80% even though this occurs early Saturday morning.

30 minutes on Time 2 reliably gets me from 82% on the SOC meter (from charging to "80%") to 90% SOC. I can add a little more time (10 or 20 minutes) to reach 92% or 94%.

 

[zowland]

If your charge stops at 80%, the timer is set and working.

The question is why is the timer starting excessively early? My car works differently than what is being reported. I have no idea what might be going on. Hope someone has a deeper insight into this.

My charging stopped tonight at 5:44pm (at 80%). Only difference I can think of is is battery temp. My garage is 34 degrees, plus it's colder than that outside.

B>

 

[Deleted member 3147]

I charge at both 80% and 100% and I see about the same amount of early ending with both. If I'm down to 1 or 0 bars, it will typically finish charging at slightly more than an hour early. If I've used less it ends less early. I've never seen charging finish 2 hours early.

Others have theorized that the charge time calculation is based on Japan's 100/200V electrical system and it does not correct for the faster charging on the US 120/240V. This seems very possible to me.

So why are some people (assuming they are US based) seeing end times that are close to their programmed end times?

I'm seeing early end times for both 80% and 100% charges.

It's actually very consistent (80% charges are more consistent than 100%), just very early!

Here are some recent end times (more recent listed first):

80% (should be 6:30am): 3:50 3:57 3:54 3:27 4:03 3:33 3:26 3:32 3:25 3:36 3:43 3:43 3:52 3:45
100% (should be 7:30am): 5:45 4:30 5:24 5:33 5:53 5:33 5:44 4:30 5:44 5:37 5:14 5:22 5:37

Sorry, I have no idea who your Leaf is starting so much earlier. AFAIK, the vast majority of Leaf owners who use end-only timers have experiences similar to mine. Maybe you need to have your leaf looked at by your dealer?

 

[essaunders]

My leaf finished charging to 80% at 3:19 am thus morning. The set end time is ~6 am. For the past couple weeks it has been finishing right around 6:20 am. Only thing I did differently was to change the timer time zone to eastern from pacific.

 

[garygid]

After setting the time zone, erase and reprogram the timers.

 

[lpickup]

Sorry, I have no idea who your Leaf is starting so much earlier. AFAIK, the vast majority of Leaf owners who use end-only timers have experiences similar to mine. Maybe you need to have your leaf looked at by your dealer?

Well, I'm trying to validate "vast majority". For awhile I was thinking that yes, maybe there was a problem unique to me, but then I hear of others that experience the same thing. So just my informal feedback reading random posts that discuss it (I haven't seen a thread dedicated to this subject--maybe I'll start one) is that around 25% of people see the behavior I do, so 75% != vast majority. But as I said, maybe I'll create a new thread specific to this issue (unless someone knows one already exists).

 

[zowland]

... maybe I'll create a new thread specific to this issue (unless someone knows one already exists).

This thread was somewhat active in December: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=7277&hilit=end+timer&start=10#p160287" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[zowland]

My timer is set for 80%, and I get "Charging Stopped" emails a full two hours or more before the indicated stop time (with no start time set)

The car does finish early when using an end time but not that much. I am stumped as to why your charge would start immediately.

I'm not sure why I understand why there are two different camps here. I've seen posts from people like 91040 who indicate that end timer charging stops within 15-30 minutes of the end time, and then people like myself and Ray that find that it's stopping 2+ hours before end timer.

It would be nice to see confirmation or refutation of my wild-eyed theory. Are 80% folks seeing very early ending, and 100% folks seeing ending about on time?

Ray

I installed my L2 charging station this weekend, and now my 80% "charging stopped" notifications are within 1/2 hour of the end time set in the timer. Charging also no longer starts immediately following connection to the charger.

Seems like the L1 charging needed calculation is very conservative.

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