Honda Fit EV Concept

[wizeguy]

OT - The Fit's EV specs are a clone of the LEAF. I checked it out at the LAAS and it was just like a regular Fit which is sorta disappointing.

I'd expect the specs to be similar. This is pretty typical of most auto competitors.

I'm not sure if looking like a regular Fit is a bad thing either. They've been well regarded by reviewers and really I'd prefer to have my car not look like some odd ball car (Prius/Leaf etc...) I'd rather it look like well... a car! I certainly don't intend to insult and Leaf or Prius owner. For your own ammo I own a Ridgeline and those are rather homely too.

You can make a car look any way you want. Why make a fugly one?

 

[Adrian]

You called it right, TRONZ - the same way they're promoting hydrogen.

Yes - NG is cleaner at the tailpipe. But it's not worth if if we have to poison our kids 'over here' to have fewer emissions 'over there'.

If we can get enough NG with conventional (old school) extraction and/or fracking, or with expanded landfill methane collection, then I'm all for it. But if the industry is going to continue to pump diesel fuel and heaven knows what else into the ground - and into our rapidly disappearing fresh water supply - to do their neu-fracks then no way.

Yes - absolutely DO beg, borrow or steal a copy of Gasland.


edit...typos do vex me...

Interesting article:
http://www.emirates247.com/business/economy-finance/emirates-transport-moves-to-cng-2011-03-16-1.369111

 

[AndyH]

You called it right, TRONZ - the same way they're promoting hydrogen.

Yes - NG is cleaner at the tailpipe. But it's not worth if if we have to poison our kids 'over here' to have fewer emissions 'over there'.

If we can get enough NG with conventional (old school) extraction and/or fracking, or with expanded landfill methane collection, then I'm all for it. But if the industry is going to continue to pump diesel fuel and heaven knows what else into the ground - and into our rapidly disappearing fresh water supply - to do their neu-fracks then no way.

Yes - absolutely DO beg, borrow or steal a copy of Gasland.


edit...typos do vex me...

Interesting how those with plenty of oil seem to understand this better than the US:
http://www.emirates247.com/business/economy-finance/emirates-transport-moves-to-cng-2011-03-16-1.369111

They've also got a significant fresh water challenge - you can bet they're not fracking their water supply to get the CNG they're using.

Note that the article says 'more sustainable' - it's more sustainable because they have plenty of NG that's not being used and they're hit peak oil. China and Iran are also expanding CNG use. Many Texas school buses are running CNG as are vehicles in other areas of the country.

I agree completely that it can be a bridge fuel as we transition from petroleum to electric drive - If I didn't I wouldn't be a congressional district rep for the Pickens Plan. HOWEVER - that does not mean that we should destroy our drinking water or environment to GET the gas so we can have 'new and improved' vehicle exhaust. That's just plain stupid.

 

[evnow]

CNG makes a lot of sense to some countries. To me the first order of business is to retire coal plants and use NG in their place (that is a simple upgrade to most coal plants). Then we should convert trucks.

BTW, a lot of geologists think the whole shale thing is a racket to get stupid investor money.

 

[Adrian]

HOWEVER - that does not mean that we should destroy our drinking water or environment to GET the gas so we can have 'new and improved' vehicle exhaust. That's just plain stupid.

Agreed. I never suggested we should destroy aquifers through fracking. I'm not a fracking expert, but based on my limited understanding I am optimistic that with the right governmental control at both state and federal level (we need some changes for sure) along with mandatory TRI (toxic release inventory) reporting for natural gas exploration and production we could access our domestic natural gas resources responsibly. Are we going to get it right from the beginning? Probably not. All I'm saying is we should not throw the baby out with the bathwater or in this case say no to natural gas because of improper fracking by some. Judging gasoline and diesel wheel to well, natural gas is superior environmentally, assuming everything is being done right. When done wrong, crude oil exploration ,transport and gasoline and diesel production can also severely impact the environment (I think we all know plenty of examples).
Then there is the simple fact that in order to drive our EV's if we say no to natural gas or coal, the ones among us not using PVs and/or pure hydro should just park our cars if we want to walk the walk. And of course while you're at it, please don't drive your ICE either since gasoline and diesel are no better. Or be sensible. Again, a temperate approach where progress is valued over the elusive perfect solution is my preferred option.

 

[AndyH]

Don't throw NG out with the bathwater, but skip EVs if we aren't solely using PV or wind? Did I miss something here? :lol:

I guess the good news is that if we move to NG sooner rather than later, we'll be supplying the money the industry will use to fight disclosure rules. We're running out of aquifers in this country, and the ones with water are being over-pumped. We simply cannot afford the early days of damage from those that break the rules, or from other damage that occurs before appropriate rules are put into place.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=120043996

Al Armendariz is an environmental engineer at Southern Methodist University in Dallas who wrote a widely circulated report earlier this year. He estimated gas production, processing, and transmission in the Barnett Shale produces nearly as much air pollution as all the region's vehicle traffic. State regulators validated his numbers.

http://www.texastribune.org/texas-e...y-fighting-natural-gas-dish-mayor-leave-town/

he goings-on in DISH aren’t funny anymore. Lately, Tillman, who became mayor in 2007, has been fighting for the town’s survival as natural gas companies have laid miles of pipeline through residents’ property and constructed multiple compressor sites. Air quality has consumed much of Tillman’s focus, though residents also complain of noise from the facilities, of having their property turned over to private companies against their will and most recently of contamination in their drinking water. As he takes on the companies and the agencies that regulate them, Tillman has become a media darling, an unlikely face of oil and gas reform and a public speaker crisscrossing the country. But now, he’s ready to give up — packing up and preparing to leave the town entirely, along with his job as mayor. That’s if he can sell his house promptly, which will be difficult in a town where property values have plummeted.

http://www.propublica.org/series/buried-secrets-gas-drillings-environmental-threat


"Cleaner" can be a slimy word sometimes...

 

[Adrian]

Don't throw NG out with the bathwater, but skip EVs if we aren't solely using PV or wind? Did I miss something here? :lol:
.

if it wasn't clear, what I meant was that throwing out the NG with the bathwater makes as much sense (None, just to be very clear)) to me as parking my EV or everyone parking their gasoline and diesel ICEs. No thank you.

Progress is never neat, but we've advanced since the stone age as a society and will continue to do so.

 

[AndyH]

Don't throw NG out with the bathwater, but skip EVs if we aren't solely using PV or wind? Did I miss something here? :lol:
.

if it wasn't clear, what I meant was that throwing out the NG with the bathwater makes as much sense (None, just to be very clear)) to me as parking my EV or everyone parking their gasoline and diesel ICEs. No thank you.

Progress is never neat, but we've advanced since the stone age as a society and will continue to do so.

Thanks - makes more sense.

I'm glad that EVs are finally here as we have a new opportunity to make different choices. The same way that countries can choose to jump directly from pony express to cell phones without duplicating 'our' move thru telegraph and copper phone lines, we have the opportunity to move from fossil fueled vehicles to electric.

And yes - while converting coal plants to NG fire is a step in the right direction, we could completely power the country just from our wind resources...or solar...or geothermal. Yes - we CAN continue to make small changes for the better - but we have the option of completely skipping some intermediate evolutionary steps and moving completely to 'clean' - without settling for just 'cleaner.' "Cleaner" is the lid on the garbage can. "Clean" is driving away from the landfill entirely! :lol: