Official Tesla Model S thread

[ebill3]

Well, I've got another ten days to decide if I want to cancel the four year without ranger service plan. I have never before opted for any kind of pre-paid service or warranty extension programs, but I think I'll keep the service plan. Until we get Super Chargers up here, or a CHAdeMO adapter, I doubt that I'll rack up 12,500 miles in a year, but I think I'd like Tesla to look over the car once a year - if nothing else get free wiper blades and perhaps a tire rotation. :lol:

Beside, as someone else already noted, probably just blow the $1,900 on some foolish and unneeded something.

 

[mitch672]

ebill3, I bought the 4 year plan as well, it seems somewhat foolish to buy a $90K car and worry about a $475 yearly checkup. I think if they provide a few upgrades, such as the new vent diffuser to improve the front left windshield defrost issue in cold climates, rotate tires (I plan to have that done twice/year), possibly some other hardware improvements could come out as well (Dynamic Radar Cruise Control). I think they won't be as strict on the mileage, but the 4 year plan is good for 4 years only, can't be "stretched out" time wise from what I gather.

 

[ebill3]

............ it seems somewhat foolish to buy a $90K car and worry about a $475 yearly checkup.

Yep, that observation is factored into my decision.

Plus, I don't feel like going to the trouble of getting the notarized mileage statement needed for cancellation. :lol:

 

[GeekEV]

I too am leaning towards keeping it, on the simple basis of "you never know" and I think you're probably more likely to get preferential treatment with it than without. But there an awful lot of things up in the air right now. I wish we could wait for the dust to settle and then decide.

 

[GeekEV]

So, here's my latest email exchange with Tesla on this subject:

I'm trying to figure out if this is still worth having and could use your help. I've read the information at http://www.teslamotors.com/service" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; but am not 100% clear on what exactly the plans cover. Please help sell me on why I should keep the service plan?

1) It was my understanding that all cars would receive software updates and new features for as long as you support them, but the service page seems to suggest that updates, monitoring and remote diagnostics are all a feature of the service plan. Does that mean that if I drop the service plan and do not get the annual service checks that I will lose some or all of those things?

2) The service says it covers "replacement parts like brake pads and windshield wipers (excluding tires)". Based on my prior experience with hybrids and other EVs, the brake pads will last a very long time before needing replacement. Wipers are cheap. What else would be checked/replaced at these services?

3) Someone on the forums was indicating that the annual service (for the Roadster at least) included hardware upgrades with any re-designed or improved parts as well as a general "reconditioning" of the vehicle to maintain it in tip-top shape - is that accurate and true for the Model S service as well?

If the service plan will keep my car in premium condition, then I'll probably keep it. If, on the other hand, all it really nets me is an annual inspection then I probably won't. As you can imagine, I got the plan because the service was mandatory to maintain the vehicle's warranty and the plan was equivalent in cost to $600 x 4 that I would have wound up paying anyway. Now that it's optional, I'm struggling to figure out why I need it. Any mechanical failure or deficiency would be covered under the standard warranty anyway and what maintenance items an EV does have are infrequent (brake pads) or inexpensive (wipers and cabin filters).

I want to keep my car in tip-top condition, as it's the first luxury car I've ever owned, but I just don't see what the service plan does for me. Any further insight you can provide would be most appreciated.

Thank you for seeking clarity. At this point, if you would like to withdraw from your service plan in the next 60 days, we will not require notarized affidavit.

Also, replacement parts like brake pads and windshield wipers is not covered under warranty and only included as part of annual service. We can, of course, provide these for you but there will be a fixed ost to provide and install. However, 24 hour roadside assistance, system monitoring, remote diagnostics will be included free of charge under your current new vehicle limited warranty. Software updates are free for the time being and the foreseeable future, but may become a paid service. No further information is known regarding this possible change of process. And lastly, new features is regarding software based enhancements from what I was able to gather. No plans have been expressed to add hardware features to our current vehicles.

Please reach out again if there is anything else we can assist with.

Thank you for your response. I want to make sure I take every care to maintain my vehicle in tip-top shape, but at the same time I don't want to spend pointless money. Given your comments, I'm struggling to find the value add of the service plan. I'll keep it if I can find one. I know things are in flux and maybe the answers aren't known right now, but do you see any value in the plan that I'm missing?

With respect to hardware upgrades, Elon's blog post said this:
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/creating-world%E2%80%99s-best-service-and-warranty-program-0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"...to address a few things here & there and perform any hardware upgrades – our goal is not just to fix things, but to make the car better than it was."

What kinds of things here and there? What kinds of hardware upgrades? Better how?

Thanks again!

To follow up: I believe that what Elon is referring to comes from our Roadster experience. Sometimes a reinforced or reengineered part becomes available for your vehicle. As a part of annual service we will switch the part out. There is not specific part list at this time, as Elon is making a forward looking statement. If you come in for an annual service at any time, we will perform this service. It is not limited to those that heave prepaid 4 years.

Regarding value of the service plan: I believe that it is good to properly maintain your vehicle as outlined by the manufacturer. However if you do not see the benefit to our annual service or deem it unnecessary in your mind, you are free to refund at this time.

Alright, since the service was mandatory before to maintain warranty and I knew I'd be paying $600x4 anyway the plan made sense. Give what's transpired and your information, I believe it makes more sense to cancel and I'll just play it by ear and bring the car in periodically when it makes sense to do so.

Just to confirm, there's NO difference between having the plan and paying for service on a case by case basis, right? If so, please proceed with processing a refund for me.

There is no difference as far as the warranty is concerned whether you service annually or as you see fit. I will continue with the refund.

Based on this exchange, my current plan is to get a refund and just manually schedule/pay-for services whenever it feels appropriate based on how the car's holding up. Maybe every year, year-and-a-half or even two. We'll just see how it goes. I hope this helps someone else decide...

 

[ERG4ALL]

This is not a warranty issue, but in talking to a Tesla Sales person I found out that it has over 18,000 cells (at least on the 85 kWh battery) that are sealed under the car. I asked if that pack was injected with nitrogen or some other inert gas. He said that it was not and was sealed with regular air in the pack. High school chemistry tells me that about 20% of that gas would be oxygen which can oxidize over contacts. That causes me to wonder if any Tesla owners have had any experience with cells dropping out just to the enormous amount of connections that are in the battery? Or do they do anything in particular to spread some sort of conductive gel over the contacts to keep the oxygen out? Anybody know?

That 250 mile range sounds awfully good to me and I may actually consider the Tesla in the future if the electrical contacts hold up.

 

[qwk]

Diagnostic screens: (as I recall some service tech left them in that state - tech did NOT show anyone how to get to these screens)

Press and hold Tesla icon in the upper center of the touchscreen, when pop up appears, enter tech password....

 

[ebill3]

So, here's my latest email exchange with Tesla on this subject:

I'm trying to figure out if this is still worth having and could use your help. I've read the information at http://www.teslamotors.com/service" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; but am not 100% clear on what exactly the plans cover. Please help sell me on why I should keep the service plan?

Thanks for posting all that, Geek. Still up in the air on this, but my inclination is to stay with the plan. Nice to know that they really do not want the mileage statement, and it sounds like the cancellation period has been extended to 60 days.

I realize they are charting new ground, but I sometimes get a bit irritated that things change frequently, and often the changes are not very well publicized.

 

[ebill3]

This is not a warranty issue, but in talking to a Tesla Sales person I found out that it has over 18,000 cells (at least on the 85 kWh battery) that are sealed under the car. I asked if that pack was injected with nitrogen or some other inert gas. He said that it was not and was sealed with regular air in the pack. High school chemistry tells me that about 20% of that gas would be oxygen which can oxidize over contacts. That causes me to wonder if any Tesla owners have had any experience with cells dropping out just to the enormous amount of connections that are in the battery? Or do they do anything in particular to spread some sort of conductive gel over the contacts to keep the oxygen out? Anybody know?

Can't answer your questions, but the Roadster battery has been in service since 2008 and all reports indicate it is quite robust.

Might find this interesting: http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/13121-Inside-the-Tesla-battery-pack

 

[GeekEV]

Diagnostic screens: (as I recall some service tech left them in that state - tech did NOT show anyone how to get to these screens)

Press and hold Tesla icon in the upper center of the touchscreen, when pop up appears, enter tech password....

Which is what? I can't find it anywhere. I think it starts with m0del... (that's a zero) based on what I caught out of the corner of my eye.

 

[GeekEV]

I realize they are charting new ground, but I sometimes get a bit irritated that things change frequently, and often the changes are not very well publicized.

Agreed. This is a common complaint on the Tesla Forums as well. They need to stop acting so much like a startup and start adhering to a (slightly) more rigorous process.

 

[GeekEV]

This is not a warranty issue, but in talking to a Tesla Sales person I found out that it has over 18,000 cells (at least on the 85 kWh battery) that are sealed under the car. I asked if that pack was injected with nitrogen or some other inert gas. He said that it was not and was sealed with regular air in the pack. High school chemistry tells me that about 20% of that gas would be oxygen which can oxidize over contacts. That causes me to wonder if any Tesla owners have had any experience with cells dropping out just to the enormous amount of connections that are in the battery? Or do they do anything in particular to spread some sort of conductive gel over the contacts to keep the oxygen out? Anybody know?

Can't answer your questions, but the Roadster battery has been in service since 2008 and all reports indicate it is quite robust.

Might find this interesting: http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/13121-Inside-the-Tesla-battery-pack

It's also my understanding that it's engineered to be tolerant of failure. If a few cells went out (I think it's 8,000 not 18,000) would you even notice?

 

[TomT]

Just as long as they don't use Nissan as a reference for that!

Agreed. This is a common complaint on the Tesla Forums as well. They need to stop acting so much like a startup and start adhering to a (slightly) more rigorous process.

 

[GeekEV]

Just as long as they don't use Nissan as a reference for that!

Agreed. This is a common complaint on the Tesla Forums as well. They need to stop acting so much like a startup and start adhering to a (slightly) more rigorous process.

That's why I said *slightly* more. :lol:

 

[DaveEV]

Who knew that the Model S could fly? The Model S bit starts at 0m26s and pay attention around 1m16s

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMV5EZfY7BQ[/youtube]

 

[aphysician]

Hello Tesla owners, this is a great forum for EV owners. I initially joined the forum for some help with my EV purchase. I had decided on Leaf, but after consultation with Leaf owners in cold climate have come to a conclusion, it may not suit my needs. I may need an EV with Thermal Management System (TMS) or with bigger range. Please see my previous posts.

EVs with TMS
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=12649" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Leaf - Range in cold climate and Buying/Leasing in Michigan
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=12621" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It seems Tesla fits the bill, however I haven't figured out how to pay it's leasing bills. I have contacted Tesla team about new leasing program, but it is still an expensive affair. Recent announcement by Elon has been positive. The nearest Tesla store is in Chicago, IL and nearest Tesla service center is in Columbus, OH. I need to know few things even before I start thinking in that direction.

(1) How to get the service? Tesla says that they will cover me with Ranger service program and car doesn't even need a service and now the service requirement has been waived off. I just wanted to ask owners how has been their experience?

(2) I have seen only one Model S in Detroit, and couldn't catch it with my ICE. But how's the battery performance in the cold weather? It has TMS unlike Leaf, so it should fair better. Most of the Model S sales are still in CA. However Tesla was at Detroit Auto Show, and they clearly want to sell their car in all climates, and are not stupid to make car only for warmer climate. They are pursuing European sales now.

(3) Other question that I have is, how is it to drive in snow considering it is a rear wheel drive car? Tesla's answer was that, it should not be any problem with traction control system.

Thank you all in advance.

 

[TonyWilliams]

(1) How to get the service? Tesla says that they will cover me with Ranger service program and car doesn't even need a service and now the service requirement has been waived off. I just wanted to ask owners how has been their experience?

I believe the Ranger Service comes to you.

(2) I have seen only one Model S in Detroit, and couldn't catch it with my ICE. But how's the battery performance in the cold weather? It has temperature management system unlike Leaf, so it should fair better. Most of the Model S sales are still in CA. However Tesla was at Detroit Auto Show, and they clearly want to sell their car in all climates, and are not stupid to make car only for warmer climate. They are pursuing European sales now.

The Tesla currently will show a lower Rated Range when the car is cold than when you parked. Of course, as soon as you drive it, the TMS warms the batteries. Plugging in at night and preconditioning the car is strongly suggested in cold. The LEAF doesn't even have this option for the battery.

THE LEAF IS THE ONLY MAJOR EV WITHOUT A TMS.

(3) Other question that I have is, how is it to drive in snow considering it is a rear wheel drive car? Tesla's answer was that, it should not be any problem with traction control system.

How does a BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Porsche, two wheel drive pickup, etc handle snow? You deal with it (I personally don't favor FWD for snow, but that's probably because I never had it growing up in Montana).

Tesla may have AWD for the 2014 Model S, and most definitely for the 2015 Model X.

 

[aphysician]

@ Tony,

Thanks for explaining how TMS would work. I don't think so there will be problem with Model S even in cold it has plenty of range for my commute. AWD version for Model S is nice, I guess it would add another 4K-5K to price. Model X is delayed, so have to make up my mind before that.

On a side note, You are really passionate about EVs. I was reading about your Baja to BC EV rally, also browsed your website quickly. Are you coming to Michigan for a talk anytime soon? Would be good to raise some EV awareness here and would be interesting to hear from you what's ahead.

 

[TonyWilliams]

On a side note, You are really passionate about EVs. I was reading about your Baja to BC EV rally, also browsed your website quickly. Are you coming to Michigan for a talk anytime soon? Would be good to raise some EV awareness here and would be interesting to hear from you what's ahead.

Oh, I've got my hands full now, but thanks for the offer!!! If you're ever out here on the west coast, you'll find there are LOTS of folks just like me.

 

[scottf200]

(2) I have seen only one Model S in Detroit, and couldn't catch it with my ICE. But how's the battery performance in the cold weather? It has TMS unlike Leaf, so it should fair better. Most of the Model S sales are still in CA. However Tesla was at Detroit Auto Show, and they clearly want to sell their car in all climates, and are not stupid to make car only for warmer climate. They are pursuing European sales now.

There is are a couple Tesla forums that may be a good place for you to look around.

Model-S-Cold-weather-testing (drive ability)
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/8152-Model-S-Cold-weather-testing" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.teslamotors.com/forums" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - official company one
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/forum.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - user one and more popular