Philadelphia and Southeastern PA

[tps]

I think I read that BobE leased his -- what about you, tps?

I was planning to lease and ended up leasing.

I got home tonight after a normal day of driving, running the CC continuously, in short driving like I normally would have done before I got the LEAF, with 26 miles on the guess-o-meter. I bet in warmer weather I'll get 2 normal days out of a full charge. I let a workout buddy at the Hatboro YMCA drive the LEAF a few miles tonight. "Fabulous" is how he desribed the LEAF. I don't think the range will work for him, but he probably wishes it would.

I have developed a better understanding of range anxiety. So far, the closest I gotten to empty is the first Low Battery Warning 1 mile from my house, once in the rental LEAF and once in my LEAF. Both times I knew for sure I would make it home with plenty to spare. Even though, one can feel "trapped" within an ever tightening range circle (displayed on the NAV screen), even when you know you're not planning to go outside that circle.

 

[yeswaydude]

I routinely run my cars down to empty -- and even past empty -- so I'm not expecting range anxiety to be that big of a deal for me. I always count on there being a little more "in the tank" even when the gauge reads empty.

I'm still thinking seriously about buying instead of leasing -- I just can't wrap my mind around spending that much money and having nothing left to show for it at the end. I bought my Plymouth Neon new in 2000 and it now has 150,000 miles. I set aside money each month for maintenance, and I'm just hoping that fund grows ever larger with the LEAF until it contains enough for a new (and improved!) set of batteries!

I'd be happier, though, if the car were plastic or aluminum so I'd be a little more secure that it wasn't going to turn into a rust bucket after the rust-thru warranty ends after 3 years. But nowadays that's usually not going to happen anyway.

 

[tps]

I routinely run my cars down to empty -- and even past empty -- so I'm not expecting range anxiety to be that big of a deal for me.

But the difference with the LEAF is that I know I'll have hours of charging ahead before the LEAF is back to a reasonable range radius, whereas with a regular car 5 minutes at the gas pump will get one back up to a reasonable range. It's totally illogical and entirely emotional, but I'm just saying I felt a little trapped in the LEAF's tiny range circle when the car was at Low Battery Warning, even though I had no plans to go anywhere. This problem will largely go away once a network of quick charge stations is deployed, because 20 minutes at the quick charge station and range circle will become much larger. Just knowing they're avalable, even if I never quick charge, will get rid of the "trapped" feeling. I think after a while I'll come to really appreciate the fact that I won't ever be visiting the gas station again and that my fueling needs can be taken care of at my own garage.

So far as the LEAF's fuel gauge, I believe some here have experimentally determined that there's one "hidden bar" of reserve below the last bar of the LEAF's state of charge gauge. But I have no plans to drive my LEAF to turtle anytime soon to find out.

 

[yeswaydude]

How many watts does the trickle charger pull?

Would it be possible to keep a 12v DC to AC converter in the trunk as a "gas can" so I could flag someone down and pull a charge off their ICE on the highway? Kind of like a Volt but without the on-board engine!?!

Knowing you've got something like that on-board might ease some of the range anxiety . . .

Of course, it seems like a waste (although I claim no knowledge of how electricity works!) to convert from DC to AC to DC again for charging the batteries. So maybe we need a 12v DC to ChaDeMo (?) cable!?!

 

[tps]

How many watts does the trickle charger pull?

Would it be possible to keep a 12v DC to AC converter in the trunk as a "gas can" so I could flag someone down and pull a charge off their ICE on the highway? Kind of like a Volt but without the on-board engine!?!

Knowing you've got something like that on-board might ease some of the range anxiety . . .

Of course, it seems like a waste (although I claim no knowledge of how electricity works!) to convert from DC to AC to DC again for charging the batteries. So maybe we need a 12v DC to ChaDeMo (?) cable!?!

120V @ 12A is what the charger pulls. If it was possible to make a 100% efficient inverter, the input would be 120A @ 12V! Somewhat impractical to pull this much for a long enough time. Best to get a Honda generator, as some here have done. (Make sure to make a "grounding plug', as neutral and ground are not tied together on many generators; this will prevent the EVSE from functioning.)

 

[tps]

I drove the LEAF over 90 miles today, scouting out public charging stations in the area. (The LEAF is so much fun to drive that it doesn't take much of an excuse for a trip!) First was King of Prussia Mall. I found the stations, both available, and picked up an hour or so of charge while I got a bite to eat and walked around the mall. They have an Apple store and a Bose store... Then I drove to the Wayne train station. It took a bit of exploration, but I found the Chargepoint. It was in use by a Volt. I figured he needed it more than me, since the Volt's electric range is much smaller. So it was off to Radnor train station, two stops closer to center city. I picked up about 20 minutes of charge there while I explored around.

Then I paid a visit to a place which doesn't have a charging station, but would be an ideal location: the Cracker Barrel at the Rt. 1 (Bensalem) exit of the Turnpike. Even though I couldn't fuel the LEAF there, I fueled myself with some roast beef, fried okra, mashed potatoes, and corn. I stopped at my house and picked up about an hour of charge, then I was off to check out Nissan dealers in the area. First was O'neil Nissan in Warminster (just a few miles from my house), then Colonial Nissan in Feasterville. Both dealers had two public charging stations, but they were both blocked by cars for sale. This is unlike the dealer where I bought my LEAF, Peruzzi Nissan in Fairless Hills, whose public charging stations are in front of parking spots reserved for customers.

I've been keeping track of all of the charging stations I scouted out in an Excel spreadsheet. I've tried to get very precise lat/long, which I do by zooming in on the Google Maps satellite image, placing the arrow right on the EV parking spots, the right click and "What's there" to get the exact coordinates. The whole point of this is to document what's really out there, because the charging stations shown by the Nav system map are way too sparse.

Anyway, here's what I have so far:
http://proxy1.fielddiagnostics.com/~tps/PublicEVSE.xls" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[BobE]

Thanks for the information for the Philly area. I guess there are no level 3 in PA? The only L2's I have in Lancaster or Lebanon counties are at the Nissan dealers.

I am a week away from my one month check up. So far I have put on 650 miles. The check up is free and there seems to be no reason except I believe they want see how things are going.

I had my first group questioning after my meeting I found my car encircled with firemen in the rain wanting to know about the Leaf. They were impressed with the idea of no gas but concerned about the range as I quietly took off.

 

[tps]

Thanks for the information for the Philly area. I guess there are no level 3 in PA? The only L2's I have in Lancaster or Lebanon counties are at the Nissan dealers.

I am a week away from my one month check up. So far I have put on 650 miles. The check up is free and there seems to be no reason except I believe they want see how things are going.

I had my first group questioning after my meeting I found my car encircled with firemen in the rain wanting to know about the Leaf. They were impressed with the idea of no gas but concerned about the range as I quietly took off.

If all the Nissan dealers are included, there are lots of public charge points in Philly. I haven't charged at a Nissan dealer other than 10 minutes at Peruzzi (where I got the car) to test their charge points. No QC that I know of, unforturnately. I've driven my LEAF 600 miles in less than 2 weeks! It's great fun to drive.

When I came out of the KofP mall yesterday, there was a guy taking pictures of the L2 charging stations. I talked with him about the LEAF for 10 minutes or so. Now that I've got a LEAF, I feel as if I can really be a proper LEAF evangelist.

 

[yeswaydude]

Back on page 11 of this discussion thread (around Jan. 15), there's some info about the L3 chargers at the Sheetz stations that I think are out near you, BobE. If you could kindly check them out and let us know if they're good, we might be able to arrange a meet-up out your way! By the way, 350Green never replied to my request for information. Maybe I should try PA DEP, since I think they're the ones that handed the money to 350Green.

KoP is close enough for me; others can use the chargers if we meet there.

I'm a little over a week away from delivery -- still no charging dock. Maybe I'll start making some calls directly to manufacturers today. I also need to call my insurance company -- did anyone experience any shocks (bad pun) when they went to insure their LEAF?

 

[BobE]

yeswaydude, I know about L3 at the Sheetz in Lancaster but I have not stopped to check when it will be installed. I have a Charge Point account but few places to use it so far. I hope there will be more charging stations soon so I extend my area of travel.

My insurance on the Leaf is $100 cheaper than my 2010 Pilot, but $300 more than my 1990 Miata for the year.

I hope you get your Leaf soon. It has been a blast.

 

[tps]

I drove to the data center in downtown Philly where our servers are located this evening to make an IP change. All went smoothly and I really could have done it remotely, but I like to be there in case I screw something up and loose contact with the server.

Anyway, since this trip wasn't planned and I started from the office with less than a full charge, I picked up about 45 minutes of charge at the Liberty filling station oa Columbus and Tasker while I got a bit to eat at the burger king down the street, then I proceeded to the data center. After finishing the server changes, I drove home by the most direct route. up Broad Street and York Rd. Made it home with about 20 miles on the guess-o-meter The charge point at my house stayed well within the inner circle of the range display, so I guess I really didn't have much to worry about. But with my limited LEAF experience, I'm not ready to push the envelope, yet.

I'm planinng a trip to Princeton NJ Saturday to hit Princeton Record Exchange. While I'm there I might be able to try out the ChargePoint at the Palmer Square parking garage. I've really had a lot of fun driving the LEAF everyday!

 

[yeswaydude]

BobE, I hadn't realized that the L3's had yet to be installed at the Sheetz stations! I guess we are getting our cars before the infrastructure is ready to handle them!

I talked with my insurance agent, and going from my 2000 Plymouth Neon to the LEAF SL will raise my insurance by $107 per 6 months. I think she said that my 2008 Smart ForTwo has a rating of 16 while the LEAF has a rating of 23, which is near the upper end of the State Farm scale.

I got two phone calls from Schneider yesterday about their EVSE options. Both people recommended that I not use their indoor model with my detached garage and outdoor charging of the car itself. One guy said he would e-mail me more information, but I've yet to receive it. The other person said that I will need to go through my electrician to find out pricing and options, as the part itself is orderable through their on-line catalog system through an electrical supply house. I have yet to speak with anyone at Eaton, but I'm assuming they will probably use the same approach.

 

[BobE]

If you are still looking for a charging station, consider the GE one. I really like mine. It works well and it is cool to look at with led all around the JT1772 holder. It is large but it function as the holder to wrap the cord around. If you buy from Lowes, it is $999 and sign up for their credit card and get another $50 off.

 

[tps]

If you're planning to charge outside, as I do, check out my EVSE installation. I installed the EVSE inside the garage door but have an RV electrical hatch which allows me to get the charging cable out.

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=822&start=370#p159479" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


http://www.amazon.com/Leviton-EVB22-3PM-Evr-Green-Charging-Station/dp/B004G6ZSZG/ref=sr_1_cc_2?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1326654041&sr=1-2-catcorr" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.amazon.com/Leviton-EVK02-M-Evr-Green-Installation-Charging/dp/B004G6YGBI/ref=pd_bxgy_hi_img_b" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.amazon.com/JR-Products-541-2--Deluxe-Electric/dp/B000BGJWA2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1326653951&sr=8-1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[yeswaydude]

BobE, the GE definitely wins on the phantom power loss criteria. It looks a bit large, but it would probably fit. The biggest issue I have with that one is the 16' cord. I'm afraid that's a bit short given my garage configuration. And I haven't seen anything about custom options on that one. But, I finally found the website where GE covers their EV stuff, so I'll take a look around: http://www.geindustrical.com/ev

Nifty setup, tps! My garage floor is actually crowned, so there is a small gap in each corner even when the garage door is down. I installed a rubber gasket to the bottom of the garage door to keep the leaves and debris out, so I'm hoping it squishes just enough to let the cord out. If that doesn't work out, I'll take a look at the RV port you've got!

I spoke yesterday with Nicole Fallat of Scoville Public Relations, which is covering 350Green. She couldn't tell me exactly what 350Green is up to with installing chargers, but she was very polite and responsive. She sent me a link to this site: http://www.afdc.energy.gov/afdc/locator/stations/ It appears to be a bit out of date, but it's interesting to see how far ahead Baltimore and NYC are in comparison to Philadelphia. Also, New Jersey seems to be far ahead of Delaware. Hopefully things will progress quickly once people like us start hounding our elected officials to make something happen! She's going to send my contact info directly to 350Green so that I can stay abreast of their latest developments.

Here's Nicole's contact information if you'd like to do the same:

Nicole Fallat
Scoville PR
1809 7th Ave, Ste 1007
Seattle, WA 98101
(206) 625-0075 x4 (o)
(206) 390-2236 (m)
[email protected]
http://www.scovillepr.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[yeswaydude]

I got a response from the GE Corporate Feedback Team suggesting that I contact GE Energy directly:

http://www.ge-energy.com/products_a...harging/electric_vehicle_charging_station.jsp

 

[tps]

I scouted out another large mall here in Philly, Franklin Mills. No EVSEs anywhere I could see. There were a few 120V outlets on the outside of the building, but I bet mall security would frown on parking there and plugging in. In an emergency, you'd probably have better luck going up the road a few miles and getting Colonial Nissan to move cars so you could charge there.

I think the best charging opportunity on the northeast side of Philly right now is Peruzzi Nissan, whose 2 public charging stations are right in front of customer parking spots as they should be. These guys get it! Further up the road is the parking garage at the Hamilton NJ train station, with a 6-20 240V outlet which can be used with an adapter and an upgraded EVSE which you must supply. There's a Nissan dealer at Hamilton Square which I haven't checked yet. Finally, there's 1 Leviton 32A EVSE on the ChargePoint network just inside the Chambers St entrance to the Palmer Square parking garage in Princeton NJ. Element Hotel in Ewing has a ChargePoint station, but it only supports L1, so I doubt if it would be of much use to anyone except hotel guests.

Given the current state of deployement, I have little doubt that it would be possible to drive a LEAF from Virginia to Boston, but it would be slow going as all of the charging would be L2. It'll be interesting to see where we are with QC deployment in a year or so. It will also be interesting to see how many EVs are sold in this area. Still the only one I've seen in-the-wild was a Volt which was charging at the Wayne train station. So far as I can tell, most people around here see the LEAF as another hybrid and the few I actually talk with are very surprised when I tell them it does not use gasoline.

 

[BobE]

I agree that very few seem to know about the Leaf. I was surprised at a meeting a couple came up to me and said their daughter ordered one in Washington state. I wonder if people know but are not curious. My friends seem to laugh at me and ask how long my extension cord is. I ask them how much are they paying for gasoline.

I had my 1st month check up. All is well and there were no updates. My one and only mechanic at Lancaster Nissan was curious how I like it so far. I told him I would rather drive my Leaf than my ICE car any day.

Last Saturday, I had an odd incident. I let my daughter's friend drive the Leaf and it would not go into drive or reverse. I thought about the early Leafs that it would happen due to starting with the climate control on, but a software update fixed it. Well, my situation, I turned the Leaf off and then restarted and all was back to normal.

 

[davewill]

... Last Saturday, I had an odd incident. I let my daughter's friend drive the Leaf and it would not go into drive or reverse. I thought about the early Leafs that it would happen due to starting with the climate control on, but a software update fixed it. Well, my situation, I turned the Leaf off and then restarted and all was back to normal.

Probably, she didn't press the brake hard enough when starting the car. She ended up not really started up.

 

[yeswaydude]

My dashboard now says the week of March 7th -- so I guess I won't be getting my car this week. :-(