Another interesting Wall Street Journal Article 2/27/2021

"What’s Missing in the Electric-Vehicle Revolution: Enough Places to Plug In
As dozens of new battery-powered, plug-in car models come to market, roadtrippers who bought anything but a Tesla are discovering that America’s charging infrastructure isn’t ready for prime time."

https://www.wsj.com/articles/whats-missing-in-the-electric-vehicle-revolution-enough-places-to-plug-in-except-tesla-11614380406

and an archive to avoid the paywall:
https://archive.is/o7mMT

When I read this in yesterday's paper, I was surprised to see a WSJ article that mentioned Tesla positively.

Where EVs are concerned, I almost subscribe to the "no news is bad news" theory. :roll:
Having said that, I posted in the comments section (paraphrase here) that the target market for EVs is not cross-country road-trips, so there's a lot of market penetration to be had for the average commuter (like me).

It's really a simple thing to solve: don't road trip in an EV.

Remember "the cost of batteries" was, for at least a decade if not more, a key FUD point raised about the Prius? The same is for EVs with road trips. I Make no excuses for them: Evs are terrible road trip vehicles. Let's just not pretend they aren't. Even if you had a 250 kWh charger (they exist), any decent-sized battery vehicle is still going to take a long time to charge vs gas and chargers are not all over the place. Unless you're retired and don't care how long your trip takes, use your ice based vehicle for road trips. And if you want some EV get a PHEV. There are several on the market. No range anxiety, but you can put a lot of miles in from EV.

You need to eat or use a restroom or sleep sometime. I road trip in an EV as do some of my acquantences. You make it sound like it takes a day to charge. The problem with the LEAF is heat dissipation even in the Plus which causes me slow charging after a few DCFC but that is not a problem in others. The original poster here lives in the same general area as I do and may be surprised to see how well Colorado is coming along. Wyoming to the north is still pretty bad, I talked to their energy secretary about it in a meeting a few months ago and he has plans but they have funding issues. Have you seen charging spread across the dakotas recently on plugshare? One of my acquaintances is probably going to hit it. I also charge while camping at an RV outlet sometimes just because I can sometimes I have to, the old sleep and wake up full trick of an EV. There are still many places that are difficult to go for example Yellowstone in northern Wyoming as one has to swing through Utah and up that way to go in that way so yes we have some more to go, I am always amazed how charging suddenly started to take off just the past couple years. This dramatic change is due to some programs like the Colorado program and the law suit against VW for dieselgate resulting in money and EA.

Tesla who I have a few issues with does have the easiest time if they have a CHAdeMO adapter they can use superchargers and everyone else. Watch Teslabjorn as an example of Tesla road trips over long distances.

There will probably never be as many chargers as gas stations as many of us charge at home so we only public charge on road trips or if we just feel like using an l2 at a store or state park or something.

BTW the Colorado springs EV club is planning a trip with a variety of EVs into Kansas again this summer for a show if you want to tag along.

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

It's really a simple thing to solve: don't road trip in an EV ... use your ice based vehicle for road trips

Click to expand...

Or, get an EV that works well on road trips.

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

Even if you had a 250 kWh charger (they exist)

Click to expand...

Huh ?

jlv said:

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

It's really a simple thing to solve: don't road trip in an EV ... use your ice based vehicle for road trips

Click to expand...

Or, get an EV that works well on road trips.

Click to expand...

Exactly.
My LEAF would be a terrible road trip car. My Model 3 is most excellent

jlv said:

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

It's really a simple thing to solve: don't road trip in an EV ... use your ice based vehicle for road trips

Click to expand...

Or, get an EV that works well on road trips.

Click to expand...

Sure, let's leave Seattle and go through the North Cascades, stop in Republic and dig some fossils, visit Bonnors Ferry, go over the Going To The Sun road in Glacier, visit a little town or two in Montana, then go down to Yellowstone and then to home.

How does that work?

https://abetterrouteplanner.com/?plan_uuid=9888892e-eac4-483e-9825-1b24114b56ab

SageBrush said:

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

Even if you had a 250 kWh charger (they exist)

Click to expand...

Huh ?

Click to expand...

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a32132062/tesla-250-kw-vs-150-kw-supercharger-tested/

Also saw a guy reviewing an etron gt on youtube a few days ago and he had it doing 250!

SageBrush said:

jlv said:

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

It's really a simple thing to solve: don't road trip in an EV ... use your ice based vehicle for road trips

Click to expand...

Or, get an EV that works well on road trips.

Click to expand...

Exactly.
My LEAF would be a terrible road trip car. My Model 3 is most excellent

Click to expand...

That was a subjective statement, as is what I'm about to say. What can your model 3 charge at, a few hundred miles of range per hour? Any gas based vehicle can have that added in a few minutes. This is why ice based cars are still superior to every EV when it comes to road-trips. And, as mentioned, you can fill that car up anywhere in the US with a near-0% chance of the station being "out of service".

More to the point it's a simple fact that an EV cannot cover as many miles per hour as a gas based vehicle if you're trying to cover distance as quickly as you can because they take magnitudes longer to refuel. I did a road trip myself a few years ago (I was dropping insane miles in one day) that would have been impossible in an ev.

WetEV said:

How does that work?

Click to expand...

EVs are not yet great road trip machines example.

First fail is the Twisp to Okanogan route. Direct would be what an ICE would take, 32 miles.

Tesla 2021 Model 3 LR needs to route to supercharger in Entiat, 137 miles, or 105 unwanted extra miles.

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

That was a subjective statement, as is what I'm about to say. What can your model 3 charge at, a few hundred miles of range per hour?

Click to expand...

Around 600 miles an hour

You can always present a corner case, but an all EV life works fine for my family. It goes like this:

I'm in a rush: I fly
Travel is over 1000 miles: I fly or take a train
I need to cover more than 600 miles a day: I fly

Up to 600 miles a day*:
I start out with 300 miles of range from overnight charging, and then add another 300 miles during rest stops that are longer than my car requires.

*This presumes highway driving. Off the beaten path can be a story that includes L2 charging.

SageBrush said:

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

That was a subjective statement, as is what I'm about to say. What can your model 3 charge at, a few hundred miles of range per hour?

Click to expand...

Around 600 miles an hour

You can always present a corner case, but an all EV life works fine for my family. It goes like this:

I'm in a rush: I fly
Travel is over 1000 miles: I fly or take a train
I need to cover more than 600 miles a day: I fly

Up to 600 miles a day*:
I start out with 300 miles of range from overnight charging, and then add another 300 miles during rest stops that are longer than my car requires.

*This presumes highway driving. Off the beaten path can be a story that includes L2 charging.

Click to expand...

Yeah I will admit that day I did a few years ago was the first time (and so far last) I've covered that kind of distance in a day.

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

SageBrush said:

EatsShootsandLeafs said:

That was a subjective statement, as is what I'm about to say. What can your model 3 charge at, a few hundred miles of range per hour?

Click to expand...

Around 600 miles an hour
You can always present a corner case, but an all EV life works fine for my family. It goes like this:

Click to expand...

Yeah I will admit that day I did a few years ago was the first time (and so far last) I've covered that kind of distance in a day.

Click to expand...

Exactly.

Not only is it a corner case, but it is easy enough to rent an ICE tool when those corner cases come up.

WetEV said:

How does that work?

Click to expand...

That trip doesn't back up "An EV makes a bad road trip car". Maybe that just backs up "Don't road trip in Montana in an EV."

I guess if I was planning a 3800 mile trip across Montana, maybe I would rent an ICE.

Up and down the eastern seaboard (where I road trip), there that sort of problem doesn't exist. We're going to NC this year, and that will be 800 miles one-way. And we'll stop somewhere overnight (with charging) as part of that trip each way.

jlv said:

That trip doesn't back up "An EV makes a bad road trip car". Maybe that just backs up "Don't road trip in Montana in an EV."

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Or 'Don't road trip in Montana in the EV he owns.'

SageBrush said:

jlv said:

That trip doesn't back up "An EV makes a bad road trip car". Maybe that just backs up "Don't road trip in Montana in an EV."

Click to expand...

Or 'Don't road trip in Montana in the EV he owns.'

Click to expand...

You might notice the ABRP trip was for a Tesla 3LR 2021.

Which I don't own.

But yes, a road trip across Northern Washington State is a fairly bad idea in any EV, and Montana is worse. Actually doable by stopping at RV camps and charging.

WetEV said:

SageBrush said:

jlv said:

That trip doesn't back up "An EV makes a bad road trip car". Maybe that just backs up "Don't road trip in Montana in an EV."

Click to expand...

Or 'Don't road trip in Montana in the EV he owns.'

Click to expand...

You might notice the ABRP trip was for a Tesla 3LR 2021.

Which I don't own.

But yes, a road trip across Northern Washington State is a fairly bad idea in any EV, and Montana is worse. Actually doable by stopping at RV camps and charging.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately, out west off the interstates the original statement generally holds: BEVs aren't currently good road trip cars, because of short ranges, long charging times, a lack of charging infrastructure and the unreliability of being able to charge at the sites that do exist (this is mostly a non-Tesla issue). BEVs are only good for off-interstate road trips now if you're willing to design the trip around them - if you want to be free to go where you want, when you want, how you want, a BEV isn't the right answer yet.

Re Glacier, Tesla had a site in Kalispell "Coming soon" for at least 3 years before I stopped checking for it. IDK if they've built one in Kayenta, AZ yet either, much requested to allow trips to Monument Valley, and the list of places/routes it's either inconvenient or impossible to visit now by BEV remains large.