B0133 NO BATT CAPACITY WARRANTY

[QueenBee]

I am curious how they get around material defect. if the vehicle can no longer function remotely as advertised that is by definition a material defect ???

if a gas car gets half the mpg because something in the engine itself degraded that would be a material defect.

I already charge at work (not enough range for round trip its 54 miles one way)

all I need is 3 years. if I can get 3 years I am golden

Battery capacity is a wear item. A vehicle no longer functions as advertised if you don't replace the tires, brakes, etc. after they wear out just like a battery after battery capacity degrades.

 

[nerys]

I think that legal argument is specious. A $10,000 plus component is not a "wear item" in a $30,000 car. It is quite literally 1/3rd of the car.

It is morally tantamount to a primary component of the drivetrain.

Engines wear transmissions wear. If either wear inside your 100k warranty to the point of detrimentally impacting the operation of the vehicle they take care of it.

As per law and as is right and proper.

Brakes are consumables. Tires are consumables.

10 or 15 thousand dollar batteries are not quite the "same" as brakes and tires.

We are not talking 10% here they are basically saying the car can lose nearly half its useful range and that is normal wear and not covered.?

I cant help but wonder how they can legally get away with that.

Your talking about people taking out 7 year loans on vehicles that are not warranted for by far the most critical part of the car and most expensive part of the car for even the paypack period.

That seems like a screaming big problem.

At the minimum the cars should have oversized batteries such that at 60% they still have the original advertised range. (Software can balance this expand usable capacity as it degrades.)

And they damned well should be warranted to achieve advertised range for 7 years or do not give out loans of more than 5 years. Nk e of this 60% crap

Mind you I dont fall in this category. I will hit my miles limit long before my years limit.

So I dont have that kind of bias for this argument. I fully expect to purchase 2 batteries in the next 6 or 7 years.

 

[Stoaty]

Your talking about people taking out 7 year loans on vehicles that are not warranted for by far the most critical part of the car and most expensive part of the car for even the paypack period.

That seems like a screaming big problem.

That's why a lot of people lease, and the ones who buy need to understand the risk they are taking as early adopters. Nissan is up front about what the warranty covers and what it doesn't.

 

[nerys]

Agreed. They however are not clear and upfront about the expected rate and results of degredation in capacity

Heck. I knew far more about the car than the dealership who sold it to me. They were very nice just largely ignorant.

I am confident I will be happy. Not so sure about average joe and they are the important ones not me.

 

[JeremyW]

Average Joe leases the car (currently).

A replacement battery costs $5500 plus installation, and in your case requires an adapter kit costing $200-$300 (only needed for the first replacement).

Be happy you can even get a new pack, that's a development that took over three years!

 

[nerys]

Nothing to be happy. I had zero plans to buy one until there was a replacement process at hand.

sadly the only one I can lease is the Honda Fit unlimited mileage alas my credit was not sufficient

 

[mxp]

This is a great suggestion for taking action nearing the end of the 5-6 year mark of ownership, and a reminder that the CVLI feature on the app. However, it would be good to know if the data/results of the CVLI can be used (say, in a court case) as legitimate data? Nissan could say that the data did not come from a factory tool.

Also might be helpful to run the LEAF Spy Pro Cell Voltage Loss Inspection Test (CVLI) prior to the capacity warranty ending and going to the dealer to complain.
Mine shows somewhere between three and eight cells bad with only one lost capacity bar.
To fix that might require replacing 20% of the modules under the original 8 year 100,000 mile manufacturers warranty.
Might be cheaper for Nissan to replace battery totally or at least negotiate.

Capacity warranty may not be the only remedy.

I'm at 84% SOH an 70% HX with 3 years at the end of last June and 33k miles. Thanks for reminding me about the new test feature. Keep forgetting to run when SOC is low. It's reporting 4 modules for me. At roughly 5% loss per year I'm going to fall short of he warranty kicking in. I'll definitely want this issue resolved and right before the 5 year mark seems like a good time. I'd be willing to try small claims court if they resisted. The retired judges submission does a good job outline ones case.

 

[TomT]

I believe that you would have little chance of prevailing...

This is a great suggestion for taking action nearing the end of the 5-6 year mark of ownership, and a reminder that the CVLI feature on the app. However, it would be good to know if the data/results of the CVLI can be used (say, in a court case) as legitimate data? Nissan could say that the data did not come from a factory tool.

 

[TimLee]

... However, it would be good to know if the data/results of the CVLI can be used (say, in a court case) as legitimate data? Nissan could say that the data did not come from a factory tool.

I think it is unlikely that Nissan or the court would accept CVLI data that you personally obtained using LEAF Spy Pro, even though the results likely will be the same as the dealer obtains using the Consult service equipment.
But LEAF Spy Pro gives you the great advantage of knowing whether it is worth paying the dealer to do the CVLI test and provide the results that Nissan and the court will consider valid.
Depending on your service dealers hourly rate that will probably be ~$100.

But even though the service manual says replace modules with cell pairs that don't meet the criteria, Nissan may balk at that especially if a large # of people begin asking for replacement of a large # of modules near the end of their 7 year / 70,000 mile or 8 year / 100,000 mile Gold extended warranties, or the battery 8 year / 100,000 mile warranty.

Nissan cost for module replacements could be $2,000 or more for a large % of lower than average miles per year drivers.
And the better more correct and useful fix would be to replace the whole battery with the new heat resistant chemistry battery and provide the LEAF owner with a substantial discount on the $5,499 battery price.

 

[JeremyW]

I think it is unlikely that Nissan or the court would accept CVLI data that you personally obtained using LEAF Spy Pro, even though the results likely will be the same as the dealer obtains using the Consult service equipment.

I'm willing to be an expert witness in a court of law to explain to the court that the data is equivalent to Nissan equipment.

 

[keydiver]

All of you/us with a B0133 on their service record: please be patient. I hear that a tentative agreement was reached in the Class Action suit yesterday, and it includes a provision for a letter going out to all of us who opted out. Due to a non-disclosure agreement, that is all the info I could get at this time, but it appears that there is light at the end of the tunnel.

 

[QueenBee]

All of you/us with a B0133 on their service record: please be patient. I hear that a tentative agreement was reached in the Class Action suit yesterday, and it includes a provision for a letter going out to all of us who opted out. Due to a non-disclosure agreement, that is all the info I could get at this time, but it appears that there is light at the end of the tunnel.

Thanks for keeping us updated!

 

[Valdemar]

Any changes coming applicable to those who didn't opt out?

 

[Moof]

Average Joe leases the car (currently).

A replacement battery costs $5500 plus installation, and in your case requires an adapter kit costing $200-$300 (only needed for the first replacement).

Be happy you can even get a new pack, that's a development that took over three years!

Anyone know how many hours of labor is billed for a battery swap? I'm fearful there is another grand or more hidden for installation costs.

 

[keydiver]

Any changes coming applicable to those who didn't opt out?

Sorry, but because of the non-disclosure that was all he could tell me.

 

[TomT]

I doubt the court would allow you legal standing as an expert, true though it may be...

I think it is unlikely that Nissan or the court would accept CVLI data that you personally obtained using LEAF Spy Pro, even though the results likely will be the same as the dealer obtains using the Consult service equipment.

I'm willing to be an expert witness in a court of law to explain to the court that the data is equivalent to Nissan equipment.

 

[edatoakrun]

... it includes a provision for a letter going out to all of us who opted out..

That should soon confirm that Nissan got my letter.

 

[mwalsh]

Anyone know how many hours of labor is billed for a battery swap? I'm fearful there is another grand or more hidden for installation costs.

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=14102&p=365382#p365382" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[mwalsh]

All of you/us with a B0133 on their service record: please be patient. I hear that a tentative agreement was reached in the Class Action suit yesterday, and it includes a provision for a letter going out to all of us who opted out. Due to a non-disclosure agreement, that is all the info I could get at this time, but it appears that there is light at the end of the tunnel.

Thanks for the update. I also heard this weekend that it might be possible we'll get some relief from this situation as a result of the mediation, but that's all my contact was willing to say.

 

[TomT]

Frankly, my Leaf will be gone in four months so I no longer much care...

Thanks for the update. I also heard this weekend that it might be possible we'll get some relief from this situation as a result of the mediation, but that's all my contact was willing to say.