ECOtality News 8/12/13 - DOE Stops payments

[TonyWilliams]

Tony, since Nissan installed quick charge stations, many of them free, has that impacted the paid customer volume at EVoasis? San Juan Capistrano is ideally located for travel between the LA and San Diego areas, but a couple of Nissan dealers seem to offer plausible alternatives. More importantly, can you say whether those Nissan stations have delayed EVoasis plans to open other locations? I certainly don't mind Nissan building some infrastructure where everyone else had mostly failed to do so. Nor do I object to getting anything for free. But I'd much rather have something paid and available, than hypothetically free and unavailable.

No, the only bump down was when this unit went from free to paid. But it has been steady ever since.

No affect on future plans. There will be chargers coming online that have not been previously announced relatively soon.

Fun times.

 

[GRA]

Just a random piece of Ecotality/Blink data. They've spent the past four months installing 10 Blink L2s at the Hayward, Ca. City Hall parking structure, adjacent to the Blink QC. PG&E finally did their thing that's been holding this up since June (there's a minimum 5 week wait), and yesterday I saw that the contractor had connected all the units and powered them up, although they're still blocked off by sawhorses and tape.

These units were all built in 2011, so they've been sitting around in a warehouse for the past eighteen months or more. They haven't even gone into service yet, but wouldn't you know it, two of the ten units are showing blank screens (powered up and illuminated, but no 'Hello' display). I don't have a Blink card so couldn't check to see if they'd respond to one, but the units with 'Hello' displays all had working touchscreens; neither of the malfunctioning units responded when I touched their screens in the same place ('Help'). Reported them to Blink via email, for whatever good that might do. I wonder if they even have any customer service or repair personnel left?

EDIT: It appears someone's still there, as I got an email reply from an actual person within 1/2 hour after sending my message.

Just an update. I emailed Blink twice in the past two weeks about the bad displays on two on the units. They must have sent someone out last week, because one of the two units had a good display last week. The other had gone from displaying nothing to being dark for 5 seconds, then briefly flashing an 'EV Project' screen for less than a second before going dark again. The second email was to inform them of this. Lo and behold, today all the screens are working correctly, and Hayward has removed the tape and sawhorses from in front of seven of the ten units. I can't see any reason why the 3 others (two for handicapped spots) are still blocked, but at least there are seven that people can use. Judging by other people's accounts of fairly rapid response to service problems recently, it appears that Blink is demonstrating the accuracy of one of Samuel Johnson's famous quotes: "Depend upon it, sir, when a man knows he is to be hanged in a fortnight, it concentrates his mind wonderfully."

 

[scottf200]

My unit was displaying an interrupt-happened screen on a few mornings and it appears to be within an hour of my charge. Annoyed in the morning but obviously I still could drive the car. Tried to resolve it with a service call but the scheduling got miscommunicated (not communicated) so 10am in my calendar was 2pm in theirs. This was 12Aug2013. I canceled and that is when the news came out on potential bankruptcy! And the RAV4 EV too high of charge issues. They stopped service calls at that point. Doh!

Luckily I got a call today that they can visit me tomorrow at noon to fix the unit. Not convenient but in this situation I made it so.

 

[phxsmiley]

uh oh - access to blinknetwork.com and the Android Blink app doesn't appear to be working. Was looking up a charger. Hopefully just a temporary thing, wish everybody the best over at Ecotality...

 

[DanCar]

uh oh - access to blinknetwork.com and the Android Blink app doesn't appear to be working. Was looking up a charger. Hopefully just a temporary thing, wish everybody the best over at Ecotality...

Blinknetwork.com dead for me too.

 

[phxsmiley]

ok it's up - sorry for the scare...

 

[jhm614]

ok it's up - sorry for the scare...

I'm just picturing some ECOtality guy plugging quarters into the Internet meter.....

 

[Randy]

Recent DOE Audit of ECOtality, with results published in July 2013...

http://energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2013/07/f2/OAS-RA-13-29.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[Deleted member 8423]

Thanks for the link Randy!

Many here are not going to like Appendix 1.

The Office of Inspector General received various complaints regarding overbilling for installations of electric vehicle charging stations included in a subsidiary of Ecotality, Inc.'s (Ecotality) American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 (Recovery Act) project. Specifically, the complaints alleged that a contractor installing electric vehicle charging units for Ecotality as part of the Recovery Act project overcharged participants and the Department of Energy (Department) based on the scope of work performed, improper billing, and price gouging. While we discovered information that could have understandably led to concerns with installation charges, the allegations were essentially unsubstantiated

 

[eHelmholtz]

I got a call from Paul Gordon, Ecotality's CTO, yesterday regarding the J1772 heating issue. After questions about the heating in my cable, he said that Ecotality is working with REMA and they have a next gen cable that addresses the hitting but will implement it selectively since only 10% of cables have the hitting issue. Anyway, he also told me that he would get a replacement out to me ASAP; I shared with him that there's already a replacement cable waiting for me with a local tech but that service calls had been on hold. He says that they are back doing service calls and will get it fixed for me within a week.

When asked about ecotality's future, he indicated that it intends to be around for many years.

It's been 2 weeks since my telephone conversation and I have heard nothing about replacement for the J1772 cable and the red screen ground fault error remains a problem. This - after assurances from the CTO that a replacement would happen within a week. An email to him went unanswered and calls to the Ecotality staff person working on this go straight to voice mail.

 

[pchilds]

This is from the second paragraph. Six times mark up on labor. No gouging there. :roll:

Additionally, installer quotes received by the contractor were nearly six times, on average, the actual wages paid for installation labor.

 

[KillaWhat]

This is from the second paragraph. Six times mark up on labor. No gouging there. :roll:

Additionally, installer quotes received by the contractor were nearly six times, on average, the actual wages paid for installation labor.

I had a fully functional AV installed, and when Ecotality offered Free Blinks, I accepted one.

They charged me over $750.00 to Install my new blink.
Surprizingly, there were install funds available that totaled.... $750.00 !!!

$750.00 to attach 3 wires to the unit; wires that were already in place, and to screw gun the Blink to the wall.

They didn't even have to remove the AV, I did it.

Nice work if you can get it.

 

[EVDRIVER]

I ran all the wiring and the outlet was installed. They sent three people and it took over an hour, first unit was bad. They told me no permit would be issued because the outlet was in. A month later they called and said I need to get an inspection and they were too busy to send someone. Inspected came and gave me crap about other petty things. Thanks for yet another lie ET. They bolted a unit on the wall and were paid far too much. That POS is gone now and I refuse to ever use one of their public stations for a multitude of reasons.

 

[TomT]

Boy, my experience could not have been more opposite. The came out and did a site inspection and had no issues with were I wanted it installed, and no extra charges. They came back out about two weeks later, ran the wiring, installed the unit and were done in about 90 minutes. The following week an inspector came out, who they met at my house, looked around briefly and signed me off right then and there. Total cost to me: $0

I ran all the wiring and the outlet was installed. They sent three people and it took over an hour, first unit was bad. They told me no permit would be issued because the outlet was in. A month later they called and said I need to get an inspection and they were too busy to send someone. Inspected came and gave me crap about other petty things. Thanks for yet another lie ET. They bolted a unit on the wall and were paid far too much. That POS is gone now and I refuse to ever use one of their public stations for a multitude of reasons.

 

[TimLee]

Boy, my experience could not have been more opposite. The came out and did a site inspection and had no issues with were I wanted it installed, and no extra charges. They came back out about two weeks later, ran the wiring, installed the unit and were done in about 90 minutes. The following week an inspector came out, who they met at my house, looked around briefly and signed me off right then and there. Total cost to me: $0

+1
Ecotality's installation / service contractor in East Tennessee, Broadway Electric, was exceptionally good.
Blink installation was done at no cost to me and they were willing to cooperate and put the wire inside the wall for me. When they came a year later to fix the Blink wiring problems and discovered heating damage on the Blink power connections, they contacted Ecotality and got the unit completely replaced with a new one under warranty.

 

[eHelmholtz]

My home Blink unit has been showing the orange/red error screen frequently (daily) especially when plugged into a Volt (I suspect a ground wire poor crimp). In addition, the J1772 handle gets rather warm when pulling 30A. I rang up blink in late July and they arranged to have the cable replaced and the orange screen issue addressed; this was delayed by the availability of the new cable. The cable arrived at the local tech's address on Friday August 9 and I was to have the service done Monday August 12. Unfortunately, I was told that all service calls have been put on hold until the DOE issue is better sorted. I couldn't get anymore information than this.

It had been several months since my case was opened with blink for the 2 issues above but with ecotality going out of business I thought to leave it until the new folks got a footing with blink. Anyway, I rang Blink up today and got the old case fired up and within a few hours I got a call from Mike Martin, an engineer with Blink, who said he could come by right away to fix it including replacing the J1772 cordset (he's based in Arizona but was in town). Anyway, I had a brilliant time chatting with him. He did confirm the the self-test orange/red error screen was due to a poor crimp on the CT because the connector was too large which he fixed. The most interesting bit was with regards to the J1772 overheating issue. He tells me that he's tested many cordsets and it's never been an issue with poor crimping on the J1772 cable end; it's the actual contact between the car's pins and the EVSE pins since SAE didn't specify minimum tolerances and forces for insertion and retention. Blink has worked with Rema to fix this issue ensuring that the pins have better contact (this means plugging in is tighter than before) and also put in an additional safeguard should the fixed REMA cords still overheat by putting in a thermofuse in the J1772 plug to disconnect if the temperature is too high. Cool stuff!

 

[QueenBee]

My home Blink unit has been showing the orange/red error screen frequently (daily) especially when plugged into a Volt (I suspect a ground wire poor crimp). In addition, the J1772 handle gets rather warm when pulling 30A. I rang up blink in late July and they arranged to have the cable replaced and the orange screen issue addressed; this was delayed by the availability of the new cable. The cable arrived at the local tech's address on Friday August 9 and I was to have the service done Monday August 12. Unfortunately, I was told that all service calls have been put on hold until the DOE issue is better sorted. I couldn't get anymore information than this.

It had been several months since my case was opened with blink for the 2 issues above but with ecotality going out of business I thought to leave it until the new folks got a footing with blink. Anyway, I rang Blink up today and got the old case fired up and within a few hours I got a call from Mike Martin, an engineer with Blink, who said he could come by right away to fix it including replacing the J1772 cordset (he's based in Arizona but was in town). Anyway, I had a brilliant time chatting with him. He did confirm the the self-test orange/red error screen was due to a poor crimp on the CT because the connector was too large which he fixed. The most interesting bit was with regards to the J1772 overheating issue. He tells me that he's tested many cordsets and it's never been an issue with poor crimping on the J1772 cable end; it's the actual contact between the car's pins and the EVSE pins since SAE didn't specify minimum tolerances and forces for insertion and retention. Blink has worked with Rema to fix this issue ensuring that the pins have better contact (this means plugging in is tighter than before) and also put in an additional safeguard should the fixed REMA cords still overheat by putting in a thermofuse in the J1772 plug to disconnect if the temperature is too high. Cool stuff!

Let us know if you get the cordset replaced as well. I had requested it and it was apparently "on order" but then....

 

[DaveEV]

It had been several months since my case was opened with blink for the 2 issues above but with ecotality going out of business I thought to leave it until the new folks got a footing with blink. Anyway, I rang Blink up today and got the old case fired up and within a few hours I got a call from Mike Martin, an engineer with Blink, who said he could come by right away to fix it including replacing the J1772 cordset (he's based in Arizona but was in town). Anyway, I had a brilliant time chatting with him. He did confirm the the self-test orange/red error screen was due to a poor crimp on the CT because the connector was too large which he fixed. The most interesting bit was with regards to the J1772 overheating issue. He tells me that he's tested many cordsets and it's never been an issue with poor crimping on the J1772 cable end; it's the actual contact between the car's pins and the EVSE pins since SAE didn't specify minimum tolerances and forces for insertion and retention. Blink has worked with Rema to fix this issue ensuring that the pins have better contact (this means plugging in is tighter than before) and also put in an additional safeguard should the fixed REMA cords still overheat by putting in a thermofuse in the J1772 plug to disconnect if the temperature is too high. Cool stuff!

Good stuff! Was he also going around fixing public charging station issues, too? Did he mention what they are planning on doing for all the old plugs out in the field?

The weird thing about the plug overheating issue is that the plugs are supposed to be rated for a certain number of insertion/removal cycles - that would seem to dictate the amount of force required for plug insertion/removal to maintain sufficient contact over the design life of the plug.

 

[eHelmholtz]

Let us know if you get the cordset replaced as well. I had requested it and it was apparently "on order" but then....

Yes, the cordset was replaced with the new and improved one.

 

[eHelmholtz]

Good stuff! Was he also going around fixing public charging station issues, too? Did he mention what they are planning on doing for all the old plugs out in the field?

The weird thing about the plug overheating issue is that the plugs are supposed to be rated for a certain number of insertion/removal cycles - that would seem to dictate the amount of force required for plug insertion/removal to maintain sufficient contact over the design life of the plug.

Yes, he made the same point about insertion/removal cycles but he said that SAE never specified minimum tolerances and forces so manufacturers did different things; he also mentioned that the silver flashing process wasn't standardized so that's another issue. He did say that of the available cordsets at the time of testing, the ITT one was the best but even it was hit and miss; he said a cordset from Merck which wasnt available for testing had the most impressive spec sheet. He thinks because Merck has a background in high voltage stuff from ships.

Apparently, blink engineers met with car manufacturers about the overheating issue and could not get them excited about putting thermistors on the car end like what Honda has done so they went to SAE about putting it in the EVSE but was told that it would be a deviation from current J1772 standards so they couldn't list such a device as j1772 compliant. Anyway, that's supposed to be on the wishlist for the next J1772 revision. So the cordset thermofuse is stopgap but the plan is implement them in commercial settings too though there's apparently only 2 field guys making calls right now. I didnt ask about home units; they're doing ones with known problems. There's a lot in Texas and Illinois.

Regarding DC fast charging chademo units turning off at various places, I'm told that to get site owners to sign up, the units were put in Ecotality's name so that the site owners aren't on the hook for the electricity bill and demand charges. Of course, with Ecotality gone, electricity accounts are closed but they ate working to identify and get power up again.