EVSE Home Assessment Reports

[Rat]

My characterization of SteveD's assessment of my house seems to have raised more questions than it has answered. That may be a good thing. I apologize if I misstated anything Steve said, although I'm totally unclear about what the "miscommunication" was. Now I am more confused than ever. I have a simple question that still isn't answered, at least not by Nissan, AV, or SteveD, I don't think, but maybe I'm just not following. For now, I am not seeking opinions from "non-official" sources, but if anyone asked about this and got an opinion from their assessor, that would be helpful. I'm not sure all assessors are giving out the same info.

I have a 20A GFI circuit in the garage now, with a plug in a convenient spot for charging. I don't know if you would call it "dedicated" since any plug in the garage or dining room is on that circuit, and all run through the GFI plug (actually there are two GFI plugs on the circuit but any ground fault at any of the plugs trips one or both). There are two automatic things on that circuit that might go on during charging hours: our water softener and our front sprinklers. I can set the sprinklers to not go off during charging hours, though. Since I expect to drive the Leaf no more than 10 miles a day, I am seriously considering just using trickle charge and not installing the EVSE. Is there some reason I can't do that other than the risk that it could occasionally take longer than is convenient when I do drive the Leaf for longer distances?

I suspect that whatever answer I get now, there will be a large number of people on this forum or elsewhere who get their Leafs first and try exactly that and report it, so we will have real-world data, not theoretical data, but if Nissan thinks this won't work, I would like a clear explanation of why not.

 

[AndyH]

If one is trying to specify (or suggest) a circuit that will support ANY J1772-defined Level 1 EVSE (both the 12 and 16 amp-max models), then a 20-amp breaker would be "required".

I cannot see the future, but I an not bound by "today".

If useful and allowed by the standards (and a max-amp selector "switch" is allowed), it is POSSIBLE (I suspect likely) that somebody will build it.

Point is, Gary, we're not waxing eloquently on what's possible - we're trying to plan for WHAT IS. And one fact is that every time people go off in different directions with assuming a bunch of others get confused!

The fact is, TODAY there is no 120V L1 unit that'll pull 16A. I can't find a single one.

I did report from first-hand knowledge that Clipper Creek can make a 16A L1 if there is demand, but they apparently do not have one in the certification pipeline. They do have their -15 in the approval pipeline though.

Uh, see your earlier post:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=10500#p10500

According to you, CC is working on a L1 20A EVSE.

You're right, drees. I got updated info from CC the following day. I will add a note to the listing. Thank you!

I have a 20A GFI circuit in the garage now, with a plug in a convenient spot for charging. I don't know if you would call it "dedicated" since any plug in the garage or dining room is on that circuit, and all run through the GFI plug (actually there are two GFI plugs on the circuit but any ground fault at any of the plugs trips one or both).

I'm sorry for muddying the water, Rat.

I have one 120V circuit in my garage. It runs an outlet, two outside lights, and four 4' overhead lights. I can leave all the lights on and run two 120V 1500W battery chargers from that circuit for 5 straight hours. That's more than 24A plus the fluorescent lights. I'd be very surprised if either your sprinklers or water softener draw more than 1A.

Andy

 

[garygid]

120v 20-amp circuit, add up the loads:

1. Should be 12 amps for Level 1 EVSE
2. Guessing about 1 amp (120 watts) for the sprinkler controller
3. Guessing about 1 amp for the water softener

Total: 12 +1 +1 = 14 amps
Should be easy for a 20-amp breaker, with room to spare.

 

[Gavin]

Heck, we can get more info it seems from the Home Assessment people than Nissan...

I sent them an email asking about getting a charger installed in my home in New Mexico, but that I will probably get a LEAF earlier from Phoenix...

Got a response...

gah...edited...the email had a CONFIDENTIALITY STATEMENT attached...I don't think it would be a bad thing to post the message, as it was very slight in information, but out of respect I have removed it.

So New Mexico is in the third roll out area...Of course I have no idea what time frame that is...nor do I know what the second roll out is...nor if the third roll is the last, next to last or whatever...but it is a number and new info to me

Gavin

 

[steveD]

RAT,

No apologies necessary.

In summary, any multiple receptacle circuit in your home can be overloaded by the sum of all the devices powered by the various outlets. The company defining the criteria for installing charging docs simply states that a level 1 charger is a significant load, and recommends a dedicated circuit in order to avoid nuisance tripping of the breaker.

Anyone who has tried to operate a portable electric heater in the bathroom while their wife also uses her hair dryer, has probably experienced a nuisance trip like I am describing.

 

[mwalsh]

Oh, I forgot to tell you guys.....I mailed the original of my HOA approval form to the Management Company on Monday. Yesterday I called to make sure it had arrived and, of course, it hadn't, or at least that's what they're claiming.

I half-way thought of mailing it certified, thinking that this might happen, but didn't. So now I've got to start over again come this next Monday, with a copy of the copy I made for myself. This one, I may just fax. :x

 

[LakeLeaf]

I'm supposed to be assessed Wednesday.

Did anyone receive an email confirmation (I specified this as my preferred contact method) before the electrician showed up? If so - what was the email address of the sender (I've been out of the country for the past month and haven't seen anything, but want to be sure it isn't in my spam folder - which has thousands of emails in it).

It will be interesting to see if a local contractor shows up (I think I know all of the local electricians) or if someone drives 4 hours from the Bay Area to do the assessment.

I'm also a little torn between spending $2200 (I guess that would be $1100 after the tax rebate) and just installing a dedicated 20A GFI circuit myself for the cost of the GFI breaker (I've got the wire and outlet already) so what, maybe $50. If I could buy the 220V unit directly, it seems to be pretty easy to install, so I'd likely opt for that - maybe at some point in the future. I think the 110V circuit would work just for me.

If lots of recharging at 440V quick charge stations reduces the battery range/life, does that mean that charging mostly at 110V is the way to best preserve the battery range/life?

 

[cinmar]

Had my EVSE assessment on Friday, 7/16, by AV's contractor. Not too many surprises. We already knew we'd likely have to upgrade our 100 amp panel on our 80+ yr. old house to 200 amps -- not generally because the size of the panel, but because it's very old and replacing the ancient breakers takes detective work. The panel is the furthest spot away from our garage, so we figured a way to route the wiring around the back of the house in the ground. I told the contractor we'd likely do the digging part ourselves. I don't want random people trampling my flower beds.

I also let him know that we plan to install PV in the near-ish future, so to keep that in mind in terms of not doing work twice. His company also does PV installs, so he at least had knowledge of what our long-term plans would be.

Nothing else to report that's different from what was already posted. Only interesting thing to note was that as we were filling out paperwork, the contractor noted that I was "high up" on the reservation list based on my number. (I reserved within 3 hours of the first e-mail.) I inquired whether that meant I'd get my Leaf in December, as I'm not in San Diego or Sonoma County. His opinion was that Nissan would piss off a lot of reservation holders if they didn't roll out the Leaf in order of reservations, but that was just his opinion.

 

[cinmar]

Did anyone receive an email confirmation (I specified this as my preferred contact method) before the electrician showed up?

I received a phone call confirmation, even though I specified e-mail.

 

[mwalsh]

Did anyone receive an email confirmation (I specified this as my preferred contact method) before the electrician showed up?

I received a phone call confirmation, even though I specified e-mail.

Received both from mine.

 

[planet4ever]

I got an email from Nissan ([email protected]) shortly after scheduling my appointment, and a phone call from the electrician a day ahead, confirming the appointment and in fact narrowing the time frame. I have never seen nor heard anything from AV directly.

Four working days since the assessment, and no word back, but I haven't rattled any chains yet since everyone else is reporting similar lack of response.

 

[JasonT]

Four working days since the assessment, and no word back, but I haven't rattled any chains yet since everyone else is reporting similar lack of response.

Yeah - my assessment was on the 12th. The paperwork from Nissan says "within 24 hours" - website says "within 72 hours", and I'm past both of those at this point. I tried calling the phone number at the bottom of the Nissan paperwork, and they ended up transferring me to AV. The person from AV apologized for the delay and said that since I have a "standard install" that I should get my quote back in the next two days. She also implied that the delay was Nissan's fault, that they are "reviewing" all of AV's initial quotes. I don't know how accurate that information is.

 

[LEAFer]

The person from AV ... also implied that the delay was Nissan's fault, that they are "reviewing" all of AV's initial quotes. I don't know how accurate that information is.

Upon reviwing all those quotes ... I definitely hope Nissan comes to the same (outrageously priced labor/profit) conclusion we have come to regarding standard installs.

 

[mwalsh]

Edit: Mailed HOA Approval form and faxed one both confirmed by Property Management company today. Progress!

 

[steveD]

Hi Everyone,

I am not an official spokesperson for AV or Nissan, but we do perform assessment/installations.
Since the start of assessments, we have tried to go from zero to 55mph in one step. As we could all predict, stuff seldom goes perfectly. Everyone is working as furiously as possible to get assessment data in, and quotes back. Some quotes are taking longer than we aspire, but the good news is, things are getting better by the day.

Since the start of installations is scheduled to be on Oct. 1, 2010, I am confident we will have all the bumps ironed out of the process so that no installations are significantly delayed. In turn, I expect the actual installations between Oct. 1 and Dec. 1 should mean even early LEAF recipients will have the chargers in ahead of the LEAF arrivals.

Thanks for your patience, we are pedaling as fast as we can.

Steve

 

[JasonT]

I am not an official spokesperson for AV or Nissan, but we do perform assessment/installations.
Since the start of assessments, we have tried to go from zero to 55mph in one step. As we could all predict, stuff seldom goes perfectly. Everyone is working as furiously as possible to get assessment data in, and quotes back. Some quotes are taking longer than we aspire, but the good news is, things are getting better by the day.

Steve,
This is understandable, and although I can only speak for myself I'm not angry at this point, just slightly frustrated. It's understandable that the pre-printed Nissan form would have the wrong information about how long the assessments would take. The website is a little less forgivable though - if they really don't know how long they will take right now, then it should say that instead of "within 72 hours".

I realize we have plenty of time - and I'm not overly stressed about it. I appreciate your response, and certainly would not hold you (or the company that came to my house) to the flame for where my assessment might be. However, Nissan is not presenting this as a "it's a bumpy road, hold on for a little while" - they seem to be presenting it as "smooth sailing, it's all good to go" when clearly it isn't quite there yet.

 

[Dav]

The website is a little less forgivable though -

yes, the Nissan site for our accounts (mine anyway) still says email by June 30. Maybe they should take that down...

 

[DrPowell]

Edit: Mailed HOA Approval form and faxed one both confirmed by Property Management company today. Progress!

Like! Best wishes for a happy ending to your HOA saga.

Thanks to you, sent off info about the panel upgrade I decided to do (electricians finished today), and future EVSE install, and my HOA replied quickly saying no need for them to get involved for either as long as they're inside.

Now if I can just get the email to schedule the EVSE assessment. Anyone else in the Seattle area have their assessment yet? evnow? tomsax?

 

[evnow]

Now if I can just get the email to schedule the EVSE assessment. Anyone else in the Seattle area have their assessment yet? evnow? tomsax?

Since I booked early early I'm being considered for the EV Project free EVSE. So no email. I'd guess the same with Tom.

ps : I'm not actually on the Beaver Lake, but close enough.

 

[DrPowell]

evnow = lucky dog.

As I look at this AV form, it occurs to me they really should simplify the thing to avoid confusion and delays. They should drop all the vague scary language in section 2 and amend the form to just add a check box for Standard Install or for Customer Install, plus a sentence that simply states a standard install involves all work inside the garage with no exterior modifications.

Just doing that will make most HOA management companies or volunteers very happy to sign and move on. They could add a line where the AV assessor can write in briefly what work has to be done for a custom install so the HOA people who are signing know what they're agreeing to waive or approve.