EVSE Home Assessment Scheduling is Live!

[DaveEV]

My wife and I live like hermits because of PG&E's high electricity cost. Most of the time we are in one room, with lights off in the rest of the house. And florescent lights at that (have already checked everything with Kill-a-Watt meter, etc). In the winter, we can actually come close to hitting the baseline rate... but not quite.

What's your baseline and typical monthly usage excluding air conditioning? You must have some large appliances that suck up the juice. For me, our biggest user is our electric dryer.

In the summer, we are in tier 3-4 depending on the weather, due only to A/C usage. And they are SEER14 A/C units a couple years old.

Ah, AC usage. I grew up in the Bay Area (Mountain View) and never had AC there. House only occasionally got too hot when during the occasional heat-wave, otherwise generally stayed pretty comfortable. Have you looked at insulation in your house? PV will have the added benefit of blocking the sun so it can actually reduce your AC load somewhat, too.

 

[palmermd]

EVDRIVER,
Thanks for the offer to get a J1772 connector for me.

Yes, please let me know the price for the "plug" (and the price for a suitable matching "grip") - the part on the end of the e-fuel cord.

If it is reasonable, I will buy at least one from you.

If you can, please price the "socket" part also - the part in the LEAF.

Thanks, Gary

According to EVTV its $900 for the plug and $450 for the vehicle inlet.

http://media.ev-tv.me/news031210-1280.mov

 

[Nubo]

Guess I ought to find that sucker! :lol: There's a panel outside by the meter but I've never opened it; only the breakers inside.

The main breaker is usually on the same panel as the rest of your breakers unless you have a sub-panel.

Well, looks like we have 2 "main breakers" outside next to the meter. One is 90 amps, the other 40 amps. I assume the second one feeds the AC, since there's no separate breaker for that inside the house. At the other end of the house where the power feeds the AC, there is a box with 2 large fuses in it. The breaker box we do have inside the house is completely full.

I'm starting to suspect this will be an expensive enterprise unless we're willing to give up the AC, or the electric dryer.

 

[DeaneG]

My wife and I live like hermits because of PG&E's high electricity cost. Most of the time we are in one room, with lights off in the rest of the house. And florescent lights at that (have already checked everything with Kill-a-Watt meter, etc). In the winter, we can actually come close to hitting the baseline rate... but not quite.

What's your baseline and typical monthly usage excluding air conditioning? You must have some large appliances that suck up the juice. For me, our biggest user is our electric dryer.

In the summer, we are in tier 3-4 depending on the weather, due only to A/C usage. And they are SEER14 A/C units a couple years old.

Ah, AC usage. I grew up in the Bay Area (Mountain View) and never had AC there. House only occasionally got too hot when during the occasional heat-wave, otherwise generally stayed pretty comfortable. Have you looked at insulation in your house? PV will have the added benefit of blocking the sun so it can actually reduce your AC load somewhat, too.

Our lowest monthly usage is about 450kWh. It's probably mostly the 5-year-old fridge. We're in Cupertino, a notch warmer than Mountain View. The house is well insulated. A/C and washer/dryer are high efficiency. Allergies mean we have to keep the windows closed most of the summer. If I do buy the Leaf, I'll also have to buy a small PV system, or I might as well keep driving the maserati for the lower fuel cost!

 

[hill]

Our lowest monthly usage is about 450kWh. It's probably mostly the 5-year-old fridge. We're in Cupertino, a notch warmer than Mountain View. The house is well insulated. A/C and washer/dryer are high efficiency. Allergies mean we have to keep the windows closed most of the summer. If I do buy the Leaf, I'll also have to buy a small PV system, or I might as well keep driving the maserati for the lower fuel cost!

One of the biggest advantages of a small PV system is that by knocking off 1/2 your usage, you keep your rate(s) in the lowest tier(s).

.

 

[mwalsh]

One of the biggest advantages of a small PV system is that by knocking off 1/2 your usage, you keep your rate(s) in the lowest tier(s).

What is better financially.... a larger system on TOU, which would cover all your electricity needs, or a smaller system on regular domestic rates that keeps your usage in tier 1?

 

[DaveEV]

Our lowest monthly usage is about 450kWh. It's probably mostly the 5-year-old fridge. We're in Cupertino, a notch warmer than Mountain View. The house is well insulated. A/C and washer/dryer are high efficiency. Allergies mean we have to keep the windows closed most of the summer. If I do buy the Leaf, I'll also have to buy a small PV system, or I might as well keep driving the maserati for the lower fuel cost!

If the dryer is electric, it will use about 4-5 kWh/load. Washer uses a lot less, maybe 1/2 kWh/load. All dryers are basically the same in terms of efficiency, unless you use a clothesline. Fridges generally use about 400-600 kWh/year, or 1-2 kWh/day.

So even with both of those items, (say you do 16 loads of laundry/month, not very efficient fridge uses 60 kWh/month) that's only ~125 kWh of your 450 kWh.

Is your water heater gas or electric?

About the only thing you can do for the AC is to have it set to the highest temperature you are comfortable at and to make sure you turn it off when you are not at home.

What is better financially.... a larger system on TOU, which would cover all your electricity needs, or a smaller system on regular domestic rates that keeps your usage in tier 1?

It depends completely on when you tend to use your electricity and when you generate your electricity when on a TOU plan. If you consistently export energy during peak usage times, then you can get away with a smaller system and still not pay anything even though you use more electricity than you generate.

It's not something that's easy to calculate as you need reliable meter readings multiple times a day to make the decision (preferably after the PV and after a year's worth of data), so I'd recommend for most people that they stick on the regular plan until they can get that data as most utilities seem to lock you in to a particular plan for a year before they let you change again.

 

[Rat]

Our lowest monthly usage is about 450kWh. It's probably mostly the 5-year-old fridge. We're in Cupertino, a notch warmer than Mountain View. The house is well insulated. A/C and washer/dryer are high efficiency. Allergies mean we have to keep the windows closed most of the summer. If I do buy the Leaf, I'll also have to buy a small PV system, or I might as well keep driving the maserati for the lower fuel cost!

I live about 4 blocks from Cupertino and don't have or want A/C in the house. We have a gas dryer and our house was well-insulated when we remodeled in the early 90s. I just checked our electric bills, which my wife handles, and saw that prior to the smart meter being installed we averaged just over 400 kwh a mo. but as soon as the new meter went in it jumped to the high 400s, often over 500 kwh. Maybe we should appeal to the CPUC. Our "baseline" is 386 kwh. I'm not sure how that was computed, but obviously we are getting charged more for the usage over the baseline. On the other hand, being retired I'm home most days and so is my wife, so at least one of us is on the computer(s) or using something electronic (stereo/TV) most of the time. I leave my computer on all day even when I go out, usually, and often read with track overhead lighting on even during daylight, and we rarely eat out since my wife is a good cook and we use the electric oven/range virtually every day. So it seems to me that we should be using a lot more than your 450 kwh if that represents mostly a 5-yr-old fridge (ours is about 20 yrs. old). So I'm not sure if we're getting undercharged or overcharged. The big usage change when the smart meter went in seems suspicious.

 

[LEAFer]

PG&E has had problems with smart meter accuracy (some for gas, some for electric). Google it. Check your records again and may be complain.

 

[Rat]

Well, now that I do further analysis it appears that the jump in usage occurred in December, which is when the new meter went in, but also when usage always goes up due to longer night-time and colder weather. I was comparing the fall usage (we have "Indian summer" here through October) to December/January/February. If I compare to same month 1 year earlier, the usage appears normal. As Ruth Buzzi would say, "Never mind."

 

[Dav]

Thanks, Rat. SDG&E just installed a Smart Meter at our place Monday. You had me concerned. :?

 

[DeaneG]

So far mine seems OK. But the lowest power it ever reads is 250w. I can't imagine why. Shut off 45 breakers and it goes to zero like it should.

 

[DaveEV]

So far mine seems OK. But the lowest power it ever reads is 250w. I can't imagine why. Shut off 45 breakers and it goes to zero like it should.

What kind of AC units do you have? Nearly all have sump-heaters to keep the refrigerant/lubricant from mixing and will draw about 100w nearly all the time. You said earlier you have more than one unit - that could be your 250w right there. The rest of the draw would be from phantom loads (any electronics off but still plugged in usually draw a couple watts). Should be easy to isolate the issues using your smart meter and circuit breakers.

A Kill-A-Watt (costs about $20) will help you narrow down further once you've identified your trouble circuits.

 

[Frank]

It's not something that's easy to calculate as you need reliable meter readings multiple times a day to make the decision (preferably after the PV and after a year's worth of data), so I'd recommend for most people that they stick on the regular plan until they can get that data as most utilities seem to lock you in to a particular plan for a year before they let you change again.

There is a pretty cool product being offered by a company in San Diego that will measure and log watt usage at the circuit breaker level. I have been testing it for a few weeks and while the company still needs to work out a few bugs, it has a lot to offer. It will track your electricity usage on each circuit breaker (including one on your new Leaf charger) and price the usage using the current Utility company rate schedule you are on. It does it on a real time basis and you can view the results on any PC. Utility company rate schedule changes are pushed to the software via your Internet connection.

I just switched from a standard tiered rate schedule to the Solar time-of-use schedule and all I had to do is select the rate schedule from a drop down box and it began pricing real time usage based on the time of day the electricty is being used. You can run simulations using other rate schedules on historical data collected by the system. For example, how much would my utility bill be last month if I was on the XX rate schedule?

The hardware involved is "breaker box" connected to the electrical panel with CTs (small rings) connected to each breaker. The breaker box communicates with a network adapter connected to your PC via the AC power line. See http://www.ecodoginc.com for more info.

 

[EVDRIVER]

Ted the energy detective, been using it for some time and works great.

 

[Boomer23]

Rat, I obsessively log my daily electrical usage rates as part of tracking my solar PV system. I find that the big usage hogs are electric cooking and standard incandescent Christmas lights. My December usage used to be obscene, at almost 1,300 kWh, back in 2005, but it was only 650 kWh in 2008, when I switched to LED Christmas lights and we didn't do as much holiday cooking.

That Thanksgiving bird in my electric oven is costing me more than the $15 the grocery store charged me on special.

We also do not have AC in the house. My low usage month has typically been June, due to the longer days, as you mention.

We'll be installing a new, low energy refrigerator in a few days to replace the 20 year-old hog that we have. I hope to save almost 2 kWh per day with that. But we're already saving more than 3,000 kWh per year compared with 2005, just by being more aware of electric usage and using CF bulbs, etc.

 

[Bicster]

http://www.ecodoginc.com for more info.

Frank,

That just made my day. I've been thinking about building something like that because I'm disgusted by the other products that have monthly or annual fees. I've never been that interested in TED because it won't tell me what's going on at the individual circuit level.

Are the units available uninstalled? If so, what's the cost?

Thanks!

 

[EVDRIVER]

The house wiring to the EVSE is 4-wire: Hot1, Hot2, Neutral, and Ground.

There are only 4 wires through the e-hose (even though the J1772 connector has 5 pins): the same Ground, switched Hot1 and Hot2, and one much thinner, low-voltage, two-way "status-communication" line.

The EVSE applies a voltage or signal (through a resistor) to the wire, to tell the car that power is available, and the maximum current available (6 to 80 amps).

The car loads the line with a resistance (which varies) to signal connected, ON, OFF, and ventilation required.

Why neutral? 240 does not need one and all the other EVSE specs I have seen show none, where is this listed? Thanks.

 

[EVDRIVER]

http://www.ecodoginc.com for more info.

Frank,

That just made my day. I've been thinking about building something like that because I'm disgusted by the other products that have monthly or annual fees. I've never been that interested in TED because it won't tell me what's going on at the individual circuit level.

Are the units available uninstalled? If so, what's the cost?

Thanks!

Ted can tell you what is going on at the plug level, it can learn loads. I am monitoring dedicated circuits with TED.

 

[Frank]

http://www.ecodoginc.com for more info.

Frank,

That just made my day. I've been thinking about building something like that because I'm disgusted by the other products that have monthly or annual fees. I've never been that interested in TED because it won't tell me what's going on at the individual circuit level.

Are the units available uninstalled? If so, what's the cost?

Thanks!

The basic system consists of a breaker box that can monitor up to 16 breakers, the network adpater that connects to any PC with a serial or USB port, and the software, for about $1K. The system can be expanded in 16 circuit increments for about $850 extra each. Each circuit is measured and tracked separately on a floor plan of your home on a PC. Rolling over the circuits mapped to your floor plan shows instant load as well as cummulative use bar charts by hour, day, week, month, etc. I believe TED is mainly designed to measure whole house use and generator production such as wind and solar. I don't believe TED has individual CTs on each circuit.