LEAF sales disappointing? Duh, what do you expect?

[leaf561]

I spoke to the Nissan sales manager yesterday, at the Dealer closest to me Crown Nissan in Redding CA.

I asked him how many LEAFs he sold last month, the answer was one.

Why only one?

The one ordered, was all he had to sell.

How many could he sell?

He doesn't know, but many more each month, if he actually had LEAFs on the lot, next to the hundreds of other new Nissans he has in his inventory to sell.

Is it possible that there is another dealer close by who has been aggressively giving discounts and attracting customers? That has been the case in Bay Area. Most of us got from the dealer who gave sweet discounts and also aggressive marketing

 

[etrans]

As I posted previously in the new member thread, I was dismayed by the lack of knowledge displayed by their sales people, both regular and "Leaf specialist". Couldn't answer detailed questions about L2 EVSE at homes (and called them chargers) or about the Federal Tax credit or State incentive.

I want electric cars to come on as fast as they can be built so I am planning to develop my own expertise and try an independent marketing/outreach plan that includes a home EVSE evaluation (I am also an electrician). If I can negotiate a commission with one of the 3 local dealers that will pay for my efforts.

 

[lpickup]

2) Require EVERY Nissan dealer to provide a public charge station that can be accessed 24x7 and that means 365 days a year.

For #2, what's the purpose? I don't think that by itself will help that much.

I agree with this. The main purpose of having Nissan have charging stations installed is to get potential customers over the hump of the gas station paradigm. Tell them that all Nissan dealers have charging stations and give them stats on how many dealers that is, how many in a given area, distance between them, etc. That's enough to make the sale. But once the customer actually BUYS the LEAF and starts charging (almost exclusively) in their garage, I don't think they will actually NEED to go to a Nissan dealer to charge, so it doesn't really matter that it's 365x24. If I do find myself in need of a charge, a Nissan dealer is going to be the last place I go--I'd rather go sit at Whole Foods for a few hours! On the rare occasion that I've actually pondered charging at a Nissan dealer due to range limitations, I've called ahead to inquire as to their charging policies and make sure I'd be able to get the charge if I needed it. Not really a big deal.

So I'm in the camp that L2 charging @ Nissan dealers is more of a marketing gimmick than a necessity.

 

[abasile]

So I'm in the camp that L2 charging @ Nissan dealers is more of a marketing gimmick than a necessity.

Until recently, we were regularly making use of L2 at dealerships. Now there is enough public charging infrastructure in our area that we only use the dealerships occasionally. However, we continue to find them vital as backups (given the possibility of EVSEs being ICEd, and the questionable reliability of Blink EVSEs), as well as for range extension when visiting areas with less charging infrastructure.

I made it clear to Fontana Nissan that I was only going to buy a LEAF from them if I could count on being able to stop there for a boost whenever needed, which we ended up doing an average of once every 2-3 weeks or so. With free Wi-Fi for us parents and a play room for the kids, this went rather well.

In many areas of the country, it might be some time before there is any significant charging infrastructure apart from the Nissan dealerships. (Despite the near lack of DC fast chargers, we have it good here in California.)

 

[lpickup]

In many areas of the country, it might be some time before there is any significant charging infrastructure apart from the Nissan dealerships. (Despite the near lack of DC fast chargers, we have it good here in California.)

My argument relies on the assumption that the majority of people are going to do fine just charging at home (or workplace) and occasionally do some opportunity charging, but not necessarily have to rely on it.

Not saying that there aren't exceptions (such as yourself) that actually rely on public charging. Not knowing your situation or typical driving patterns in your area, would you say that your charging behavior is typical of what a driver in your area would experience?

 

[edatoakrun]

I spoke to the Nissan sales manager yesterday, at the Dealer closest to me Crown Nissan in Redding CA.

I asked him how many LEAFs he sold last month, the answer was one.

Why only one?

The one ordered, was all he had to sell.

How many could he sell?

He doesn't know, but many more each month, if he actually had LEAFs on the lot, next to the hundreds of other new Nissans he has in his inventory to sell.

Is it possible that there is another dealer close by who has been aggressively giving discounts and attracting customers? That has been the case in Bay Area. Most of us got from the dealer who gave sweet discounts and also aggressive marketing

Actually, in relation to the total new car sales within a hundred miles of this dealer, ONE LEAF sale was a pretty good month.

I expect it would correspond to several thousand LEAF sales in March, if the same sales ratio held true nationwide.

And this is for a dealer where not a single public L2 charger, except for their own, is operational in a 60 mile radius, and not a single DC charger has even been proposed, in a 160 mile radius.

 

[TomT]

Yep. If Nissan really wanted to make a difference and jump start things, they'd have required each dealer to have a QC station. L2 is mostly meaningless at a dealership.

So I'm in the camp that L2 charging @ Nissan dealers is more of a marketing gimmick than a necessity.

 

[edatoakrun]

Yep. If Nissan really wanted to make a difference and jump start things, they'd have required each dealer to have a QC station. L2 is mostly meaningless at a dealership.

Better yet, If Nissan, instead, made a promotional effort, to encourage every Nissan Dealer to "sponsor" one or more QC stations, at better locations, at short-term destinations like fast-food joints and mini-markets, along major highways, 20 to 40 miles from the dealership.

 

[TomT]

I suspect that the cost of that, which would likely be much higher than at a dealership, would make it a non-starter...

Better yet, If Nissan, instead, made a promotional effort, to encourage every Nissan Dealer to "sponsor" one or more QC stations, at better locations, at short-term destinations like fast-food joints and mini-markets, along major highways, 20 to 40 miles from the dealership.

 

[gascant]

Actually, while this is a good discussion, I'm not sure yet about the role of the dealer in the grand scheme of things. In my experience, trips to the dealer have been only to confirm a choice that I've made by doing independent research, or possibly to compare comparable cars from two manufacturers (e.g., Altima Hybrid vs. Camry Hybrid). In those cases, a 15 minute test drive is sufficient. Without the sales people steering people to the LEAF, my guess is that very few will want to try it (outside of those who have done research). Because an EV represents such a large paradigm shift in how one thinks about a car, the best way to get people interested IMHO is to give them the car for a week and let them drive it. Not only will they get to appreciate what it does mechanically, but they will also realize that they can fuel it at home. Trust me, I don't miss gas stations and especially having to stop at one on my way home from a long day at work.

If I were independently wealthy, I'd buy a 2nd LEAF and do just that--let people drive it for a week with no obligation. They may be in a position to buy a car somewhere between now and 3 years out, but at least they will remember their experience with the LEAF. Our local private/government partnership is trying to get a program like this going through something like Zip Car or Getaround. It would be great, though, if the people trying the car didn't need to pay.

I wonder what Nissan is doing with the cars they used in the Drive Electric Tour??

 

[jkirkebo]

Yep. If Nissan really wanted to make a difference and jump start things, they'd have required each dealer to have a QC station. L2 is mostly meaningless at a dealership.

This is what they have done in Norway (and the UK I believe). Every dealer has a QC open to the public (at least to Leaf owners). QC + sales training was a requirement for the dealer to be able to sell Leafs. I suspect it was a good investment for most of them as the first 1000 Leafs were spread out to only 7 dealers. The largest one I believe have sold over 300, my local one about 50.

For the one dealer that sold the most, I believe Leaf sales was about 1/3rd of the total.

Two more dealers are starting Leaf sales this month and many more will follow as they see the good sales number.

 

[edatoakrun]

I suspect that the cost of that, which would likely be much higher than at a dealership, would make it a non-starter...

Sorry, but I don't see the reasoning behind that statement.

The costs of the QC installation could be lower than at the dealership, by choosing a low-cost location.

The cost of the electricity would vary, due to the various utility's rate schedules.

But in PG&E service areas, close to half of California IIRC, the cost would probably be lower, in most cases, for lower-KW-demand businesses locations, than at Nissan dealers, which might be saddled with large demand fees, from a QC installation.

Most importantly, the QCs could be located properly, by market demand for DC charging, not limited by Dealer locations, so electricity sales would probably lead to QC station profitability, much sooner.

 

[edatoakrun]

...If I were independently wealthy, I'd buy a 2nd LEAF...

I'd buy up a half 4 fast food joints, located 70 miles from my home in all directions, and put public QCs at each of them.

That would almost double my LEAFs practical trip range, and do the same for every other QC capable BEV, over an area of about 10,000 square miles.

Though honestly, that would probably be the second thing I'd do...

 

[TomT]

Because the dealership already owns the location so there is no cost there, power is usually nearby in such an installation so those costs are reduced, and the dealership power demand is likely already fairly high so the QC might not impact it as much. None of these are necessarily true at another location that the dealer does not control and thus costs would likely be higher...

I suspect that the cost of that, which would likely be much higher than at a dealership, would make it a non-starter...

Sorry, but I don't see the reasoning behind that statement.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

I'd buy up a half 4 fast food joints, located 70 miles from my home in all directions, and put public QCs at each of them.

I can hear it now, EVs become leading cause of obesity.

 

[billvon]

After almost 4 months I have yet to see another LEAF in the wild.

Wow, we're swimming in them over here (San Diego.) A dozen or so in our parking lot, and outside of that I see a few a day while I am on my bike.

 

[TonyWilliams]

After almost 4 months I have yet to see another LEAF in the wild.

Wow, we're swimming in them over here (San Diego.) A dozen or so in our parking lot, and outside of that I see a few a day while I am on my bike.

Come on out to Old Town Poway, 14134 Midland Road, this Saturday, 9am-12noon, and you see a few more than that :mrgreen:

 

[gascant]

Come on out to Old Town Poway, 14134 Midland Road, this Saturday, 9am-12noon, and you see a few more than that :mrgreen:

LOL, I dare say so. How many are you typically getting at your meetings, Tony?

 

[TonyWilliams]

Come on out to Old Town Poway, 14134 Midland Road, this Saturday, 9am-12noon, and you see a few more than that :mrgreen:

LOL, I dare say so. How many are you typically getting at your meetings, Tony?

50-ish.

Just confirmed that a Coda will be displayed from the dealer.

 

[gascant]

Come on out to Old Town Poway, 14134 Midland Road, this Saturday, 9am-12noon, and you see a few more than that :mrgreen:

LOL, I dare say so. How many are you typically getting at your meetings, Tony?

50-ish.

Just confirmed that a Coda will be displayed from the dealer.

SWEET! We had a Coda unveiling last month (joint with EAA) and attendance was 110 (or so they say, only 75 signed the guest log). It's a big draw. I'll make it down there for a meeting sometime soon--this Saturday we have the Campbell Easter Parade where we are trying to get the largest ever participation of LEAFs in an Easter Parade.